Amp dropout problem

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Hey guys,

I am running two amps and a Gamecube in my car. (Eventually I wanna get another amp for the front). But I am running 4awg cable from the battery into a distribution block then 4awg from the distribution block to the amps.

I have recently replaced the battery in my car as it was stuffed. I had this problem with the old battery and its not as frequent now I have a new one. But my problem is at night when I have my headlights on and am driving slow (ie. reversing out of the shed etc.) my 2 channel amp will drop out for a few seconds (until the car gets moving). It doesn't do it all the time but if the amp doesn't drop the inverter for the Gamecube will drop out.

One amp is a 900 watt mono block and the other is a 300 watt 2 channel.

I was thinking a capacitor might solve my problem but don't know a lot about them. Would that be the correct way of dealing with this or what else can I do?


Thanks

[shiftySLE]

Are you sure you dont have a short or bad earth somewhere. Dont know if it will help. but in my last system I used a 0/1 gauge battery to amps. Its fat and a prick to hide under the carpets but never had any wiring probs running orion amps and subs and front splits 6, 4 and tweeter and rear splits 6 and tweeter, so it was a decent power system. I also always ran a yellow top optima and 2 x 1 farad caps. (which have varying opinions on if they are worth it, I think they are). Also good wiring everywhere else helps from triggers to RCA's. If thats all the go then at least when you have a prob or crap sound, you can only blame the parts or the install.

[D-Man]

yeah a capacitor would definately fix it. the capacitor will need to be connected to the battery however as it will need to recharge when driving.

have all systems running from the capacitor and your problem should be fixed. if it isnt then you have a roblem with wires or you just dont have enough watts in the amps to cover everything.

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Ah sweet.. yeah I am pretty sure its not a wiring problem as I got a new distribution block when I got the new battery so re-did all the boot wiring at the same time. And it only seems to be a problem when my car is drawing alot from the battery that it happens.

So what size capacitor would I need. Anyone care to explain farads to me?

[D-Man]

best to go to a car shop like Autobarn (not sure what you guys call em in sa) but a car care store that sells electronics car care stuff etc etc.. or do some research on google. find out what other peeps reccomend.

i'd want something around medium size to be able to play system constant for around 4 hours min. i know there are some capacitors out there that can play 1500+watt systems for loooong times. so the choice is up to you and what you want to spend.

this is what i found..

http://www.ryda.com.au/Car-Audio-Bat...tors-s/171.htm

i also found this -
" When amplifiers are subject to transient peaks and spikes, they often need to draw significant amount of current to cope. When this happens, the supply voltage can drop by a few volts. This voltage drop can cause distortion and cause the output to clip which can damage your valuable speakers. It can also ‘dim’ your vehicle lights, and decrease the amount of electrical power going to your engine which in turn can diminish your fuel economy.

have a chat to Andrew from http://www.performanceshop.com.au 209 Richmond Road, Richmond, South Australia 5033 he's so fairly close to you, he'll be better to help you make the informed decision.

the above in italics sounds like what is happening to you at the moment, the amps are spiking and drawing too much power and it effects the lights in the form of Dimming.

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Yeah we have autobarns here in SA as well

Yeah I will look into it a bit, probably isnt something I will get straight away as I still need new front speakers and another amp but at least I know what I am going to need.. Thanks a lot for your help.

As for the farad thing I am rather curious now so can someone fill me in?

[D-Man]

As for the farad thing I am rather curious now so can someone fill me in?

Farad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

that will do the trick

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Ah should have thought to check Wikipedia... thanks mate.

[juzzteq]

ye im having the same problem this post helped,
i just went past jb hi - fi i got a mte who works there he fixed it um, it had somethign to do with the fuses on the amp

[bezz]

yeah a capacitor would definately fix it. the capacitor will need to be connected to the battery however as it will need to recharge when driving.

have all systems running from the capacitor and your problem should be fixed. if it isnt then you have a roblem with wires or you just dont have enough watts in the amps to cover everything.

where's my facepalm picture gone? bah! There's so many things wrong with this quote I don't know where to start.

Anyway, a capacitor will not solve your problems. They are not a magical source of power and won't let you play your stereo for extended periods of time. In simple terms, all a stiffening capacitor does is reduce the voltage drop when the amp draws a high amount of current, such as when a deep bass note is played. Even then, in a real world situation you most probably won't even notice the difference when adding a capacitor to a system. I think they main selling point for a car audio capacitor is to add a blingy looking voltmeter to your boot.

If you want to stop your dimming/drop out problems there's a few things you can try:
1. Make sure you have a good grounding point. The child seat bolt in the parcel shelf is not a very good ground, try the back seat seat belt bolt and sand away the paint first so that you can achieve a good connection to the chassis.
2. Upgrade the factory ground wires.. battery to chassis, battery to engine etc
3. Upgrade the stereo power wiring, however looking at the specs of the amps you are running you shouldnt need to (I don't really know the current draw of a gamecube however).

[D-Man]

where's my facepalm picture gone? bah! There's so many things wrong with this quote I don't know where to start.

Anyway, a capacitor will not solve your problems. They are not a magical source of power and won't let you play your stereo for extended periods of time. In simple terms, all a stiffening capacitor does is reduce the voltage drop when the amp draws a high amount of current, such as when a deep bass note is played. Even then, in a real world situation you most probably won't even notice the difference when adding a capacitor to a system. I think they main selling point for a car audio capacitor is to add a blingy looking voltmeter to your boot.

If you want to stop your dimming/drop out problems there's a few things you can try:
1. Make sure you have a good grounding point. The child seat bolt in the parcel shelf is not a very good ground, try the back seat seat belt bolt and sand away the paint first so that you can achieve a good connection to the chassis.
2. Upgrade the factory ground wires.. battery to chassis, battery to engine etc
3. Upgrade the stereo power wiring, however looking at the specs of the amps you are running you shouldnt need to (I don't really know the current draw of a gamecube however).

a capacitor in this sense is just like a battery, the engine makes power, that in turn charges the main battery, in this case with a capacitor set up this will also charge the capacitor (essentially a second battery (which holds electricity(for those who didnt know :P)) then essentially what you have is a battery.

so then tell me how does this not let me play my stereo over extended periods. if the capacitor is a storage device for power (aka - battery)

[bezz]

a capacitor in this sense is just like a battery, the engine makes power, that in turn charges the main battery, in this case with a capacitor set up this will also charge the capacitor (essentially a second battery (which holds electricity(for those who didnt know :P)) then essentially what you have is a battery.

so then tell me how does this not let me play my stereo over extended periods. if the capacitor is a storage device for power (aka - battery)

Lets clear this up. A capacitor is not a battery. My suggestion is you do a bit more reading before you come up with more crap advice like you have offered above.

I'd like to hope I know a little bit about electronics, otherwise I'd have wasted the last 5 years of my life and should hand in my resignation at work tomorrow

[holdenboy]

FFS....THEY DO NOT WORK.....ive been installing car audio for over 10 years (including many capacitors) and they make jack sh*t difference. If they did why dont serious DB drag cars use them? They need every 0.1v of a volt to increase their score and if a capacitor magically provided that extra power im sure we'd see them everywhere in these cars.

Anyways, back to the problem at hand. I would be checking the voltage at the battery with the high beams on and the fan (a/c) on max. Get yourself a mulitmeter and check this out, anything in the range of 13.0-14.0v is normal. Its strange that its only happening at night and your driving slow/reversing. Which from an electrical point of view is when:

A) The headlights are on
B) The reversing/brake lights are on
C) The car isnt revving much / is idling (alternator is spinning slowly).

Get yourself a multimeter and check this out.

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Well the distribution block I have has a voltmeter built into it. I plan on going out a bit later on so before I drive off I will check what thats reading with everything on and running.
I know when I have the car off and all the audio gear running it reads about 12.4v which is what I would have expected but never looked with everything else running.

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Ok, well I checked it out earlier on and with the car idling, high beams on and fan out flat out with the stereo turned up fairly loud the voltmeter was only reading 11.4 - 11.6v.

When testing this the amp for the 2 channel speakers cut out (the mono block kept pumping away happily) until I turned the high beams off. I then put the car in reverse and it cut out again for a second then came back. Got driving and all was good. So really its only a problem when the alternator is spinning slowly and everything is running.

[holdenboy]

Just double check your amp wiring connection at the battery to make sure its got a good solid connection to the battery. Also worth checking the wire on the back of the alternator, i read somewhere on here with the ecotec engines the alternator terminal can burn out a little. It may need replacing.

If you do all this and still havent got atleast 12.5v at the D.B. then i would be getting another / new alternator im sorry to say. Also best to take it to an auto electrician and get them to test the alternator. I know with my car it drops from 14.2v to 13.4v with the high beams on and a/c fan on max. I would assume thats around normal (with just a stock battery in the front).

[RoboticCherry-Coke]

Ok cheers holdenboy, I will check all that out tomorrow when I get a chance and hope like hell its something simple and I dont need a new alternator.

[holdenboy]

No worries, heres the link about the wire on the back of the alternator....

VS v6 owners check this out

[shiftySLE]

DB drags and SPL comp cars dont have caps?????? Ha, thats a new one just like car racers dont have superchargers. What comps are you going to?? They are a bling thing??? Most people hide them anyway coz they just look like a big battery, unless you get the crap with the readings and LED's all over them.

[holdenboy]

LOL, matey im at most if not all DB Drag Racing competitions held in NSW....i have the loudest commodore in Australia at the moment, am in 2nd place for my class in Australia (Street C) and know the current Australian record holders for Street A, Street B, Street C and Street Max. I can tell you NONE of those guys use caps, and for good reason.
Ive posted this before in another arguement about caps, but this was a test one of my good friends did when he was competing:
Technical - Capacitors Tried & Tested - Mobile Electronics Australia

Anyway this is not the place for an arguement.....this has been discussed to death and we're never going to come to an agreement. If you think caps are worth the money and do make a difference thats fine by me. Also, if you wish to "voice" your opinion on forums about caps thats fine too, but be aware that others (like me) will voice our opinions too. In the end its up to the topic starter / person asking for advice to choose which advice they take.

[bezz]

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[shiftySLE]

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good input!!


Holdenboy, what sort of numbers are you getting, a lot has obviously changed since I was spending the thousands on stereos. Have to admit, haven't been into them as much, engine work is my hobby now. what gear are you running?

[holdenboy]

PB is 150.3db so far (on Termlab). I am yet to test alot of things that will increase my score. Running a Schneider SPA7000x 4000wrms monoblock, 2 x SPL Dynamics 15" subwoofers and an Optima YT D31, soon to be 2 of. This really isnt too much power either, the record holder uses over 10,000wrms and is getting high 155s.

Trust me, caps offer nothing to DB drag systems. Money is much better spent on a decent high output battery.

[shiftySLE]

looks that way aye, last time I put a system in was when the Orion Ntense subs and extreme amps came out, so you prob can work out how long that was, my mate built that little red Suzuki mighty boy car or whatever it was with the 8 15" Rockfords in it, that blew a few people away (almost literally). Not really into it now but still appreciate a good system.

Still using Yellow Optima's but, love them, best battery ever I reckon. Got almost nine years car to car with stereos and V8's in most of them on the same battery.

OP - appears that caps would not be the way to go.

[holdenboy]

The odessey (spelling) is probably a better battery, especially the monster 2150 (RRP >$800) and then theres the Digital Designs battery, 9600CCA of grunt, but several throusands worth too.

With the new "class D" techology out now, kw's of power are becoming cheaper by the minute almost, so therefore numbers go up. Now smallish boxes with HUGE port area is the norm, im using a 10" I.D. port in my car