Bi-Amp

[VZ-Rob]

Any one Vertical bi-amp their splits system?
I.E. use 2 x 2chanel amps
with a dedicated channel for the bass driver and a dedicated channel for the tweeter for each left and right output?
Just looking to get a cleaner sound

[StoneX]

You need a good EQ if you're going to bypass the passive crossovers.

[bezz]

I don't use 2x2 channel amps, but use 1x4ch to achieve a similar thing. Having separate gain controls for the woofers and the tweeters is great for tuning. I'm only running passive though, luckily my crossovers have separate inputs for tweeter signal and woofer signal.

[lil lucifer]

***bump***

[StoneX]

Why are you bumping it? It was only 2nd from the top...

[VZ-Rob]

I don't use 2x2 channel amps, but use 1x4ch to achieve a similar thing. Having separate gain controls for the woofers and the tweeters is great for tuning. I'm only running passive though, luckily my crossovers have separate inputs for tweeter signal and woofer signal.

yeah thanks Bezz that's it exactly
will run another set of cables to the woofers and need to get another crossover set for the woofers
mine have only the 1 power input bugga!
anybody sell crossovers on their own ?

[bezz]

You can buy them, or if you're feeling adventurous you could build some yourself. That being said unless you really know what you want from the crossover I'd recommend sticking with the ones that come with the splits. Perhaps you can get them as spare parts?

[Joe Bellissimo]

What splits do you have?

[VZ-Rob]

All done
Response 6 1/2"' kevlar splits up front now run the woofer active off the amp using the LPF setting
until the CADENCE - ZRS6K turn up in the mail later this week
WOW instant fix
The sound is much better no more Cross-talk heaps more clarity and detail to the midrange and high frequencies.
No back flush of EMF generated by the woofer getting into the tweeter circuit.

IMO Well worth doing guys and a quick sound mod

[StoneX]

What's the LPF set to?

In 2 way components usually the crossover point is up around 2kHz-5kHz... Most amps don't have crossovers that high.

[VZ-Rob]

G'day StoneX

OK 100% gain, +6db boost, frequency about 225hz
wow! clears the sound right up Mid Bass from the woofers is much more defined and stronger

[StoneX]

Are you still using the passive crossovers for the tweeters? And just running the woofers low passed below about 225Hz?

[bezz]

G'day StoneX

OK 100% gain, +6db boost, frequency about 225hz
wow! clears the sound right up Mid Bass from the woofers is much more defined and stronger

wow that must be clipping like a bitch

[StoneX]

It will only clip if you turn the head unit volume up too high. Bass boost shouldn't be used though.

[VZ-Rob]

mmm! HU was tuned to 40 max
just went & changed it for a test
0db boost 225hz still needed for correct guitar sounds
gain set at 90%

HU now runs out to 45 max before clipping
just means higher volumes at normal listening levels
i.e.
up from 25 to 32 for same sound pressure levels
i'm not looking to get 100db + when listening

[StoneX]

How are you limiting the frequency range to the tweeters???

Those passive crossovers split the frequency up around 4kHz-5kHz, so low passing the woofers are 225Hz is way off.

Other people who've done this with Jaycar Response splits have low passed the woofers at 4kHz and high passed the tweeters at about 4kHz... The passive crossover point is set because that's the frequency range the individual speakers should play.

[VZ-Rob]

Are you still using the passive crossovers for the tweeters? And just running the woofers low passed below about 225Hz?

Yep!
Tweeters run with a seperate amp ,with passive crossovers
set 75% gain, HFP set 1.2Khz no boost
now looking for some high quality 100 Wrms 4" mid drivers and another 2 channels for a bit more fill in sound
and more natural sounding vocals
mounted around the door handle height area

[StoneX]

Ahhh... Yes, if you put mids in to play between 225Hz and 1.2kHz, it'll be all good

[scozz76]

For a passive system, you're best to use the crossover as per the design. ie. Amplifier output to passive x-over then to woofer and tweeter. Passive x-overs require correct loading which is why the values for the components change for 4 or 8 ohm systems. piezo HF speakers don't work well on a passive x-over as they have infinate impedance. The x-over needs to be loaded for correct operation.

X-overs only have 1 input. If you're claiming you've got woofer and tweeter input, you've wired it backwards... in a 6dB/octave this won't be a problem, though it will for a 12dB/octave x-over.

If you want to run an active system properly you need to split the frequencies before the amplifier, otherwise you're wasting your time and acheiving the same outcome (quality) to using the x-over as designed. It's amazing how biased (or brainwashed) we become to our own work.

I've been installing cinema sound systems and performing auditorium EQ'ing for many years.

[StoneX]

Most crossovers have amplifier input and then the individual speaker outputs... Mine have two sets of inputs and the individual speaker outputs to allow seperate amplifiers for each individual speaker

[Tasmaniak]

I have the Clarion SCM-300 which is a 3 way Component set...they have the Bi-Amp option also. Many high-end splits will allow for bi-amping also.

[scozz76]

Seems pointless, the power you gain via active x-over is basically lost through passive filtering.

[Phoen1x]

The passive crossovers limit the power as well as the frequencies going to speakers, so by not connection the drivers through the passive crossover means they get more power.

Just out of curiousity vz-rob, have you sealed and dynamatted your doors? doing this will increase the mid bass quite a bit without adding extra components

[StoneX]

Seems pointless, the power you gain via active x-over is basically lost through passive filtering.

It allows individual control of tweeter and woofer levels.