Ve omega audio

[Pickle']

Hey guys,

I know there is probably another thread with this same question, but obviously everyone knows the factory speakers in the ve are shithouse. my question is do i need to run an amp with new speakers or just new speakers.. by just running new speakers without an amp will i get more sound or will it just be a cleaner sound. if i need to run an amp how do i go about it ive heard you need a LOC but i will also need a kicker 3 sixty.. i have no idea what the kicker thing is or what it does.. some help would be great as i dont want to have to cut my arm off for a Pro install i just want a better sound.

[HCVP]

It's very hard to say if you will get clearer sound, speakers only produce the signal you send them. If the source (head unit) is of poor quality, then a better set of speakers will only highlight this even more.

Most after market speakers have a higher sensitivity rating, so they will be slightly louder with any given amount of power. Without an amplifier, they will be limited to the factory units power output, which would be very low. You wouldn't be getting the most value for money installing a decent set of speakers, and then limiting their potential.

Just concentrating on the front stage for now, what is it you don't like the most about the factory speakers? There may be some other things you could look at doing to get the most out of what is in place, rather than just completely replacing components.

[db_notso]

your sound qaulity or noise ratio will improve if you get some nice threeway speakers and replace the factorie speakers
the ve radios have amplifiers in them and go pretty bloody loud you may just need to play with your settings a bit more like the ddl volume control if you got it!~

[HCVP]

db_nostro [Quote] - your sound qaulity or noise ratio will improve if you get some nice threeway speakers and replace the factorie speakers
the ve radios have amplifiers in them and go pretty bloody loud you may just need to play with your settings a bit more like the ddl volume control if you got it!~ [Quote]


Choice of speakers do not change THD or SNR.

If the VE Blaupunk systems do not have any power output issues then why do people bother modifying the head units with LOC's

The VE range use a 2 way component setup up front, are you reffering replacing them with a 3 way coaxial, or a 3 way stage all together...?

[Pickle']

Sorry bud. uh basically i have played with all the settings have the bass at -6 i think is what it goes to and it distorts like crazy at any kind of high volume. i do like to listen to my music. i already have a 4 channel amp here but dont know weather to bother installing because i was told the quality gets WORSE?

[HCVP]

Does this amp you have, have it's own high and low pass filters? If so, you could look at running your factory speakers on a HPF and look at adding a sub.
The other approach would be to amplify a set of replacement speakers, and run them in full range.

But it will come down to how much you are willing to spend. Either of the above two options, will still set you back a fair bit if you want to get the most out of each component, and ensure that everything is installed correctly.


On a side note, amplifiers do not reduce, or improve sound quality. They do just what their same says they do, they "amplify" The source itself, in this case your head unit, is responsible for the level of sound quality sent to the amplifier, which is passed onto the speaker. The only real way an amplifier is likely to have an effect on SQ, is if you are using a very high end source, and then compare two different amplifiers of very different build quality.

[Pickle']

yeah the amp has high and low pass filters. i think ill try a new set but its gunna have to be installed professionally so either way its gunna cost me i guess ill just leave it to the guys who know what there doing

[HCVP]

Amplifying a set of replacement speakers will definately make a difference. But just remember that at the end of the day, a 6-6.5'' speaker won't defy physics, low fq output will improve slightly, but the overall output, or volume the speaker puts out will always be limited when run in full pass.

See how you like it when you replace your speakers, you might be happy, or you might want to go a little further. Obviously your next step after this would be to run your speakers on a HPF with the addition of a sub.

If you find your unhappy with the sound quality, you can look into adding an external processor. But for the money you pay for a good one, i'd leave it out until the very end, and then decide for yourself whether it's nessacary or not.

[HCVP]

Sidenote-

"Phreddy" from ASR ASR Audio & Electronics is located in Sydney. He is highly regarded amongst the forum, you might want to see if you can get in contact with him to assist with the install rather than going to a specialty store.

"Joe Belissimo" from Shopping Secure is our forum sponsor for car audio, he is also located in the Sydney region. I remember Joe actually got together with Phreddy a while back and installed some components in a VE, so i'm sure they would both be able to assist you.

At the very least they would give you advice from experience. Being such a new vehicle, a lot of places still haven't worked on them yet, so if your paying by the hour, you may wind up paying more....

[Pickle']

thanks heaps for all of your help mate. i will replace the speakers in a few weeks.. or when i get some money and see how that goes then add an amp if needed i will contact phreddy. all my installs in the past were through doran pro audio.. he is blood good but not so cheap when your not buying a complete system from him. ill see how i go. but thanks alot for all of your help mate.

[HCVP]

No worries i made a slight edit also i think i may have dragged it out a little too much lol

[05LVH]

cant see the point in changing speakers and running them of the puss factory head unit.

I used an Audiocontrol LC61 converter in mine added a jaycar 4 channel amp, dd splits and 12" dd sub.
Big improvement from standard but definately no trophy winner.

great value though considering it was only around $1000, did the install myself

[Pickle']

for 1000 im better off going to doran pro audio he will give me a pair of 61/2 splits and a pair of 2 ways with a 12 inch sub and monoblock amp and run my 4 channel amp with sound deadening in the boot and all 4 doors installed for $1150. n i know it sounds good because he did the same thing in my brothers xr6.

What is the converter? by dd are you talking digital design?

[HCVP]

Why are they including a second set of speakers? I can only assume this is for the rear fill? At that price what ever coaxial you put in the rear is not going to be of much better quality than what is allready in place.

They should be insisting that you dissregard the rears and just use the factory rear speakers, and put the money saved towards a better set of fronts.

The amp should be bridged to provide the most amount of power and headroom for the front speakers, rather than being used to drive 4 individual speakers.

I think you should run those questions i just asked by them, and post back what they advise.

The convertor reffered to above is a line out convertor, reffered to as LOC. You can either connect an amp using high level speaker inputs, or for better quality signal, a LOC is used.

[Pickle']

i dunno they are called audio wave i think im not sure but the speakers i had them in my last car (vr wagon) and they went pretty good but i had 2 amps running six speakers so yea your probably right and thats what he would do but im not sure if i want to spend the money yet or not. how much is a LOC and how hard are they to hook up yourself?

[HCVP]

LOC's are easy to install, they just have a signal input, which is the signal from your existing speaker wire, and an RCA output. The LOC takes your speaker wires signal, and converts it to a low level output which is more suitable for amplifier inputs.The RCA cables then run from the LOC's output to the amplifiers input. They can be installed by basically anyone who can put a Kinder Surprise together.

You can get them for under $100 for a basic one ,and they go up from there depending on the application.

I've never heard of wave audio before.

[Pickle']

the wave audio is a decent speaker i dunno i hadnt heard of them either but its what doran uses on all his cars so i just went with it.. it sounded pretty nice but would probably go better could you recomend me a set of splits that would get the most out of my amp.

Amp specs http://www.npsonline.com.au/shop/ite...ider-spa-2000m

If im asking something stupid for a reccomend just let me know. i just dont know what speakers

[HCVP]

I can't really reccomend anything without knowing how much you want to spend, and what other upgrades your going to do.

But one thing i can tell you, is that if you concentrate you budget on the front speakers, rather than dividing it between replacing both the front and rear, you will notice much more of an improvement.

The front speakers, or front stage as we call it, is the most important part. Aside from a sub which it's main role is frequencies below say 100hz, your speakers are responsible for everything else.

Rear speakers are of little use or importance, as not only are they located the furtherest possible distance from your ears, but also a sound stage is designed to come front in front of you. If correctly tuned rear fill speakers will be barely audible, if not completely, from the front of the cabin.

This isn't just my opinion talking either. Unless you stated to them that you wanted the rears upgraded, then they should not have been reccomending it to you.

Using 2 out of the 4 channels in normal 4 channel 4 ohm mode, gives you 80 rms per channel. But in 2 channel bridged mode, your amplifier puts out 2 x 250 rms. Bridging the amp to drive a single set of speakers gives you more power, but more importantly more head room.

[Pickle']

yeah what your saying sounds right. i was looking around the $300 mark for the speakers. the only other thing i would be doing is adding a sub but not for abit.. but i do want alot of treble.

Thanks alot for all your help by the way.

[HCVP]

Choosing speakers really comes down to personal taste. I could put forward a set which for the money i think sound very good, while another person might find them too bright or lacking in midrange or slightly too pronounced in bass ect.

Failing that though, i would highly reccomend something from the Boston Acoustics range . I find they have a no nonsense approach and seem to please most listeners regardless of their taste.
Just out of your budget, but a very good speaker for the money - Ryda Car Audio - Boston SC60 6" Component Speaker($319.85)

I've put the Ryda link up because your in Sutherland, and all though it's a little out of your way, last time i was there they had a Boston Accoustics demo board setup, so you might be in luck and be able to audition a set.

[Pickle']

Thanks again for your help ill probably drop out there next week and see them.. cheers.

[db_notso]

once again people have confused volume and clarity!~ good luck
changing the ve head unit will also affect other modules and communications (not badly all will still work) apart from that yeah good luck

[HCVP]

once again people have confused volume and clarity!~ good luck
changing the ve head unit will also affect other modules and communications (not badly all will still work) apart from that yeah good luck

What exactly does that mean?

Nothing in this thread so far has been a bad reccomendation (aside from yours). I've yet to see you contribute anything to the car audio section besides a bunch random posts without follow up, yet alone something useful. So i'd be interested in hearing your thoughts and opinions, and of course what experience you have to base it on....

Aside from my input, there has only been one other reply besides yours to this thread so far, which may i point out was a uselss and incorrect comment about THD and SNR.. I take it then that you dissagree with the advice that i have given to the OP.

People such as myself and a handful of others take quite a bit of time out to give the people asking the questions not only good advice, but also the right answers. So come on mate let's hear it.

[db_notso]

i didnt mean for it to be a personal attack....
anyways in the base models the speakers range for "noise" is not very large and by changing from single cone speakers to component typ 2 or three
is a very effective way to get better sound clarity
fro example if you have one speaker adding another speaker gives more clarity
if you have many mid range speakers adding tweeters (high) and a sub (low) can give far clearer sond that just amplifying the standard speakers
the ve audio system shouldnt distort until about three qaurter range (volume) if you have ddl off etc (for example) most people are happy with how loud it is
but can tell that they cant hear certain ranges of sound aswell as others (low, mid hig for e.g.)
so for MOST people playing with the settings (bass treble etc) they can tell what area they need to improve
most people out there would then be happy changing their rear door speakers for better component type and maybe a sub
however some people think that you need a new headunit and amps for both high and low and mid these people are the best customers for audio stores
as they WILL spend lots of money in order to get what they desiree LOUD and CLEAR
most normal people just want clear sound at a reasonable volume

anyway you can disagree with me if you like on what people like but dont question my experience i have been in the automotive trade for 7 years
i have two qaulifications in the trade one of which being "automotive accesories and body fitting mechanic"
so yeah no need to take it personally i just put out there what i know and people can take it or leave it!~

[HCVP]

Everything you just said was nothing but rubbish.


If your a mechanic and you want to advise and help people, then maybe you should do so in a more appropriate section of the forum.