petrol - hydrogen supplemented engines

[immortality]

watched a interesting news article this evening where a mechanic fitted a small hydrogen producing unit on a falcon. he's claiming 20%+ increase in economy. the unit used straight tap water, it then added the hydrogen gas into the intake before the TB.

claimed to have made the unit with a couple hundred dollars worth of parts avail from the local hardware store. after having read a few articles on the web this seems to be a genuine way to increase combustion efficiency, cleaner burning engine.

thoughts/comments please

[vztrt]

got a link to the website.

[immortality]

Water car cuts bills - Northern News news on Stuff.co.nz
Hydrogen Oxygen G.S. - HOGS

[TWOJZ]

doesn't work

there's already another thread discussing this which is still active.

the concept is good, but you simply can not produce anywhere near enough hydrogen to get any positive effects to fuel consumption.

[TWOJZ]

Run your car on water?

[TWOJZ]

Water car cuts bills - Northern News news on Stuff.co.nz
Hydrogen Oxygen G.S. - HOGS

lol, the first link there, the guy is using distilled water! thats going to produce NO hydrogen.

the whole point is that the water has to be conductive, normal tap water will conduct a bit due to minerals in it, but distilled water will do nothing! lol

[immortality]

the news article i saw is not the one listed above. the one i saw did use tap water, they did a test with the modified falcon and a standard falcon over a 100km trip. didn't catch the figures because the kids were gasbagging big time unfortunatly

they also mention a gas reffered to as HHO which is supposidly different to hydrogen. (i never paid attention in my chemistry class at school lol)

[burnz]

the news article i saw is not the one listed above. the one i saw did use tap water, they did a test with the modified falcon and a standard falcon over a 100km trip. didn't catch the figures because the kids were gasbagging big time unfortunatly

they also mention a gas reffered to as HHO which is supposidly different to hydrogen. (i never paid attention in my chemistry class at school lol)

yes seen that on TT, but who's to say the other guy wasen't fanging it.
17L/100 on a hundred kay trip for a six???
i get 9 in my eight!!

[TWOJZ]

the news article i saw is not the one listed above. the one i saw did use tap water, they did a test with the modified falcon and a standard falcon over a 100km trip. didn't catch the figures because the kids were gasbagging big time unfortunatly

the figures they claimed were 5 litres in the hydrogen car, and 21 litres in the standard car!!!

HAHAHA!!!

the video is linked to somewhere in the other thread.

[burnz]

Today Tonight videos on Yahoo!7
click video tab and browse two brothers

[immortality]

yes seen that on TT, but who's to say the other guy wasen't fanging it.
17L/100 on a hundred kay trip for a six???
i get 9 in my eight!!

yes well, i get less the 10lts/100km in the V6 and thats going for it, not nanna styles

[VRV6BT1]

To my knowledge hho is the hydrogen atoms and an oxygen atom.

Apparently this method is a valid.

If you do some research you will find that the 'water' powered car was devised some 40 to 50 years ago but was quashed by the oil companies.

Im no conspiracy theorist, but think about it logically, the oil companies have interests in the automobile manufacturing companies.
If we all had water or hho powered cars the companies would not have a stranglehold on the market, setting car prices and the ever increasing petrol prices.

Anyway, that's my two cents, but I'll have a cent change for my thoughts.

[immortality]

i certainly think it warrants some thought. although the 2 lads said the standard falcon used 21 liters we all know they should use about the same as the early V6 engines (it also suggests that they aren't great mechanics cause it should be running better then it is), so less then 10liters really. taking that into consideration 5ltrs used on the modified falcon is not beyond the realms of possibility. it's easy for someone to say it doens't work but i haven't seen anybody back that up with anything yet

[burnz]

their may be somthing in this working.
but it loses credabilty with TT and one car 5L/100 and the other 21L/100.
maybe if they said 7L/100 and 9L/100 respectivly, it would be more plausable.

[TWOJZ]

i certainly think it warrants some thought. although the 2 lads said the standard falcon used 21 liters we all know they should use about the same as the early V6 engines (it also suggests that they aren't great mechanics cause it should be running better then it is), so less then 10liters really. taking that into consideration 5ltrs used on the modified falcon is not beyond the realms of possibility. it's easy for someone to say it doens't work but i haven't seen anybody back that up with anything yet

ok, i made a hydrogen generator, it was on a 2 litre camry, it drew 110amps from the battery, it made no difference.

is that proof, when there's people out there with hydrogen generators, that use only 10 amps of current, and claim they work?

[vlv8vic]

It does work, though i debate the figures. It would only be something close to 10% improvement. Remember they are from Portland which is quoted as "Moe on the coast".

[rb26dett]

TT promoting unsafe vehicle modifications!!

[TWOJZ]

It does work, though i debate the figures. It would only be something close to 10% improvement. Remember they are from Portland which is quoted as "Moe on the coast".

no, it would be like 0.01% improvement.

if you can't at least have the engine idling on straight hydrogen, you will never get anywhere near 20% improved fuel economy.

ok, my 2 litre camry, runs the injectors at 4% duty cycle at idle.

for you to get a 25% improvement at idle, this would need to be 3% injector duty cycle.

this means, that you have to inject the HHO after the air flow meter, so the ECU doesn't detect the hydrogen, and oxygen, as normal air, and inject just as much fuel.

now, the problem with this, is that even if you inject the HHO after the AFM, the engine will still want a larger volume of air than the hydrogen generator can produce, so it will still be sucking in air through the intake, and therefore, be adding just as much fuel.

anyway, on my camry, the HHO added after the AFM made no difference whatsoever to the injector duty cycle.

now, a 1% injector duty cycle difference at idle, would be a 25% saving, however, at 60km/hr, I believe the camry sat at around 15% duty cycle, so, IF you could even get a 1% injector reduction at 60km/hr, you would have a 7% saving.

taking into consideration the extra fuel used while accelerating, you'd average out somewhere around a 10% saving (keeping in mind that you do spend a lot of time at idle)

but this is all theory! and it did NOT work with a hydrogen generator, that used 110amps of current, and produced 10 times the HHO as most of the others people talk BS about!

ALL the ones that have been on TV, have used 10 - 20 amps! some people dont even say how much current it uses, because they have no idea what they're even doing!

if a 110amp HHO generator doesn't work, then a 10 amp one will do NOTHING!

however, if you have a glass jar full of water sitting under your bonnet, aren't you going to drive more carefully?

realistically, most of the HHO generators, will give you about a 0.01% improvement in fuel economy, and that is the facts!

[immortality]

maybe your HHO generator was faulty

[TWOJZ]

maybe your HHO generator was faulty

lol, that doesnt even make sense.

there is nothing to the device

its electrodes submerged in a slightly conductive solution, then when current it passed through it, it separated the H2O into hydrogen and oxygen.

anyone else wanna argue that it will work? when it clearly wont?

[vlv8vic]

TT promoting unsafe vehicle modifications!!

What is unsafe about it? They had all the safety requirements in place.

lol, that doesnt even make sense.

there is nothing to the device

its electrodes submerged in a slightly conductive solution, then when current it passed through it, it separated the H2O into hydrogen and oxygen.

anyone else wanna argue that it will work? when it clearly wont?

It'll work, and does, however i teach kids all week so i'll back out of arguing with you on my time off.

[TWOJZ]

It'll work, and does, however i teach kids all week so i'll back out of arguing with you on my time off.

i just told you that it doesn't work, and won't work

I gave proof, facts, reasons, why it won't work

are you really arguing with that? lol

[vlv8vic]

yep.

You wouldnt understand
lol

[TWOJZ]

yep.

You wouldnt understand
lol

it doesn't work, end of story

do you not understand that?

[rb26dett]

What is unsafe about it? They had all the safety requirements in place.

Maybe I should have said highly defectable then.