Do Job agencies undermine democracy?

[vp_commo]

So if you do not take the dirtiest stinkiest job they offer you then you are in breach of 'not accepting suitable work' (which has quite genral and flimsy criteria).

They screen out everyone who has no experience in the job and ignore transferable skills?

They can make you work for somone who pays low wages and poor benefits simply by enforcing the ('breach of suitable work act 1991'. social security).

In effect they undermine such things as 'choice', 'freedom to find suitable employment' and 'opportunity'.

So are these 'agencies' democratic? or totalitarisn?

[ari666]

its easier to find a new job if you are currently employed. you are more of a risk to a potential employer if you are long term unemployed, or even just redundant.

the idea is to get a crappy job to pay the bills while you try your hardest to find other more suitable work.

[Reaper]

Anybody who knocks back a job that they are otherwise able to undertake simply because it's beneath them or they don't want to do it is nothing more than a job snob and should have their dole revoked immediately. Pitty it doesn't happen otherwise 90% of the dole leeches would be gone.

Reaper

[Ozzie]

You feel any better now youve made a poll?

[vp_commo]

You feel any better now youve made a poll?

A bit better..
I really want to hear peoples opinions on this and the 'crap job' argument.


Dan

[STEALTHY™]

You should edit the first post so people understand your talking about the government allocated agency used by centrelink for job seekers. And not job agencies in general.

The whole centrelink thing is a joke. I was required to sit in a small room (supposedly learning job seeking skills) for 4 weeks, just to get $210 a week (less than my rent). I told them to shove it after the first day, no-one in their right mind would spend money on fuel etc to get to a place just to sit in a room, when you could be out canvassing for jobs.
I'm a firm believer that you should be able to choose what job you want to undertake, i'm not going to work twice as hard for half the money that a job i'm qualified for would give.


If you were infact referring to all agencies, you must have just joined with a dodgy one. I'm registered with a few, one of those has given me work since jan last year, through 4 different jobs. The first job was, as reaper puts it, below me. I left when a more suitable job came avaliable. Been at the same site for the last 8 months, decent job, average pay, but i wont go back on the dole, at all. And they didn't care when i left the other jobs. First job was crap, so i left for another job, which turned out to be a 1.5 hour trip each way. Then they found me a closer job, so changed Worked there for a few months, but they were a bunch of wankers (and i can usually get along with anyone), so i resigned from that site.

[Reaper]

You should edit the first post so people understand your talking about the government allocated agency used by centrelink for job seekers. And not job agencies in general.

The whole centrelink thing is a joke. I was required to sit in a small room (supposedly learning job seeking skills) for 4 weeks, just to get $210 a week (less than my rent). I told them to shove it after the first day, no-one in their right mind would spend money on fuel etc to get to a place just to sit in a room, when you could be out canvassing for jobs.
I'm a firm believer that you should be able to choose what job you want to undertake, i'm not going to work twice as hard for half the money that a job i'm qualified for would give.

What a crock of shit. Nobody should be obliged to take a job they don't want to do however if they do knock back a job they are otherwise capable of, their dole should be revoked on the spot. No iffs buts or maybe's.

If you were infact referring to all agencies, you must have just joined with a dodgy one. I'm registered with a few, one of those has given me work since jan last year, through 4 different jobs. The first job was, as reaper puts it, below me. I left when a more suitable job came avaliable. Been at the same site for the last 8 months, decent job, average pay, but i wont go back on the dole, at all. And they didn't care when i left the other jobs. First job was crap, so i left for another job, which turned out to be a 1.5 hour trip each way. Then they found me a closer job, so changed Worked there for a few months, but they were a bunch of wankers (and i can usually get along with anyone), so i resigned from that site.

No problems with that what so ever - do whatever you have to do to earn an honest dollar to support yourself and of course you move on when something better comes along.

Reaper

[STEALTHY™]

What a crock of shit. Nobody should be obliged to take a job they don't want to do however if they do knock back a job they are otherwise capable of, their dole should be revoked on the spot. No iffs buts or maybe's.

Reaper

I would agree with that, IF there were suitable jobs in each field. There aren't. It cost money to go to a place of employment every day of the week. If your getting $10 an hour, thats bs plain and simple. The whole setup of the dole is a joke anyway, so its basically a moot point.....
The people you see on ACA and TT who have 5 brand new cars and never work wont be getting the dole, there so many hoops to jump through its not even worth the piddly amount.

[Reaper]

I would agree with that, IF there were suitable jobs in each field. There aren't. It cost money to go to a place of employment every day of the week. If your getting $10 an hour, thats bs plain and simple. The whole setup of the dole is a joke anyway, so its basically a moot point.....

There are never going to be a range of jobs available in every field. Never have been and never will be. The world does not owe people a living - surely even the most daft amongst us are bright enough to study and/or gain skills to qualify them to do jobs that are available in their area??? It should not be societies burden to support every tom, dick and harry until their dream job comes along

Reaper

[MasterOfReality]

Beggars can't be choosers.

[STEALTHY™]

There are never going to be a range of jobs available in every field. Never have been and never will be. The world does not owe people a living - surely even the most daft amongst us are bright enough to study and/or gain skills to qualify them to do jobs that are available in their area??? It should not be societies burden to support every tom, dick and harry until their dream job comes along

Reaper

The idea of the dole is to support you while you look for suitable work. I completely agree if its someone who never works and just sits at home playing xbox. But forcing someone to go to a job earning ****all stops then from job hunting for a real job.

[vp_commo]

I live in Greenslopes and applied for a position of 'car washer' not detailer 'car washer' at a car yard in Moorooka.

I rang them up and drove up for an interview first thing in the morning (first there).

There was two guys washing cars (that where on work visas and going back soon, hence 2 new positions available).

The work was $600.00 a week before tax 38 hours.

I turned up in a clean collared shirt, jeans, shoes and said I could easily do the work when interviewed.
Much to my suprise they guy said he had some other people to interview before he made a decision.

I never heard from them again..

I could give you a million stories like this one.

My point is this, I cannot even get a shit job, it is incredibly difficult at the moment...

But why are these 'job agencies' flourishing?
There is one on every street corner these days (yes the government allocated ones ).

I have my forklift ticket, construction white card, confined spaces, cert 3 in IT, construction experience, degree in science, government experience, own transport, close to public transport.......??

Cheers

Dan

[STEALTHY™]

Because if your hired through a job agency, its less money for an employer. They dont have to pay sick/annual leave for you, and if you injure yourself its the job agencies workcover that is claimed. Not to mention they can just say your no longer required whereas if you were on their books, its alot harder to sack you.

[vp_commo]

yeah it figures..

The Jobsearch website is bloody off tap too, you cannot even contact the employer and 99% of the time you have to apply online which is absolute bullshit because each agencie looks after its own clients first (the ones registered with them).

When applying online all your transferable skills are ignored, I would not be suprised if the first round of submissions are screened out by OCR (character recognition) software looking for keywords.

And if it does get to the job agencie they have a very shortsighted and linear outlook on job seekers, only those who have exact previous experience get a look in, anyone else who needs a job and is keen to work gets swept to the waste paper basket.

In a sense they are doing employers a disservice by only sending the same type of employee to them, reducing any diversity, new ideas or competetive change.

Cheers

Dan

[ari666]

The work was $600.00 a week before tax 38 hours.

LMAO! the minimum wage for a full qualified mechanic is around 720 before tax. 600 bucks a week for washing cars sounds like an awesome job for a few months. great way to get some cash up to look for other work.

2009 decision
In its 2009 general Wage-Setting Decision the Commission has decided to:

•maintain the standard Federal Minimum Wage (FMW) at $14.31 per hour ($543.78 per week); and


•maintain the adult rates of pay in Australian Pay and Classification Scales (Pay Scales) at their current levels

a lot of people dont take jobs cos' they think they are worth more, which often isnt true. your only worth more than minimum when you have served for a long period of time and have demonstrated that you are an asset to a company.

how are you gonna prove that if you never accept an entry level role?

[Reaper]

Because if your hired through a job agency, its less money for an employer. They dont have to pay sick/annual leave for you, and if you injure yourself its the job agencies workcover that is claimed. Not to mention they can just say your no longer required whereas if you were on their books, its alot harder to sack you.

As an employer I avoid the agencies like the plague. For the short term they aren't bad but their hourly rate they charge me is very high. I presume they give the employee something at the lower end of the scale but wouldn't know.

Reaper

[MasterOfReality]

I have my forklift ticket, construction white card, confined spaces, cert 3 in IT, construction experience, degree in science, government experience, own transport, close to public transport.......??

Cheers

Dan

Are you just restricting yourself to government run agencies?

Why not try seek and the like?

[STEALTHY™]

As an employer I avoid the agencies like the plague. For the short term they aren't bad but their hourly rate they charge me is very high. I presume they give the employee something at the lower end of the scale but wouldn't know.

Reaper

If only more employers were like you. I was on $33 an hour at my old job, the company were paying the agency $45 (every hour) so its a fair bit of mark up. I still dont see why so many company's do it that way, for the money you save on the hourly rate, you could take risk in hiring the person on your own books.

[vp_commo]

Are you just restricting yourself to government run agencies?

Why not try seek and the like?

yes I have been to my fair share of formal interveiws from the seek website when trying for professional positions, just had no luck with the better jobs.

Seek is the same deal with the 'labour hire/part time' kind of jobs, its apply online, but somtimes you can apply to the employer and somtimes there is an email address that lets you see which job agencie is dealing with the job.
So you can ring the direct, if your lucky.

Cheers

Dan

[neet_wagon]

$33 bucks an hour, man I'd kill to earn anywhere near that.

The thing that shits me about dole bludgers is just that, in Bendigo thats all they do is f*%king bludge

they sit around the mall all day thinking thier shit don't stink, while I'm at work, working my injured (work related) arse off to support my family AND pay for thier welfare.

The ones that don't want to work aren't worth the ground they stand on.

[greenfoam]

There all bullshit, they told me I was "unemployable" so since I'm not on benifits I just don't have to listen to that. Probably they don't get any money to help me either so I imagine that can be a problem

[scouser king]

$33 bucks an hour, man I'd kill to earn anywhere near that.

The thing that shits me about dole bludgers is just that, in Bendigo thats all they do is f*%king bludge

they sit around the mall all day thinking thier shit don't stink, while I'm at work, working my injured (work related) arse off to support my family AND pay for thier welfare.

The ones that don't want to work aren't worth the ground they stand on.

Its the same over here in south perth mate.These people are bring the country down from the inside.

[Adds_05]

yeah it figures..

The Jobsearch website is bloody off tap too, you cannot even contact the employer and 99% of the time you have to apply online which is absolute bullshit because each agencie looks after its own clients first (the ones registered with them).

Dan

yes they look after there own because once they put a person into employment they then claim money off the government.if the person remains in employment for a certain amount of time (i think it used to be around the 3 month mark),they then claim more money from the government.if they pay to put a person through a course or buy them work clothes they claim it back off the government.can anyone see a picture here?

[Adds_05]

As an employer I avoid the agencies like the plague. For the short term they aren't bad but their hourly rate they charge me is very high. I presume they give the employee something at the lower end of the scale but wouldn't know.

Reaper

sounds like your talking about labour hire companys,different to what the OP is talking about.ive worked for them in the past.we were getting about $20 an hour and from what i heard they were charging a shit load more than that

[Reaper]

sounds like your talking about labour hire companys,different to what the OP is talking about.ive worked for them in the past.we were getting about $20 an hour and from what i heard they were charging a shit load more than that

Yeah - I was talking about labor hire.

Reaper