3.0 litre V6 for the Commodore

[andyman]

But Holden is australian and it would be the same technology we are currently seeing? And as you stated it's a petrol engine not a diesel so it's not exactly in the same league .

ok then, explain to me how the charging system on a ve works, i bet you cant, i guarantee you the technology is in the ve, everyone just doubts it because they just think its a bogan mobile

The DI 3.6L will make its way into the higher class V6's, like the SV6 and Calais(-V), but I don't think we'll see the DI 3.6L in the base Omega and Berlina models because there is only a 3% saving in fuel efficiency when compared to the high output alloytec...

So the DI version would only match the current fuel economy of the base Omega and Berlina (about 10.6L per 100km, maybe 10.5). They'll want to get the VE under 10L per 100km which is where its competitors are (Falcon and Aurion) as that 9.9L figure can be a big sell point. So to me, it makes sense Holden would go that route. It just doesn't make sense from the torque/drivability point of view.

umm no, the di (LLT) version does more than 3% better economy, it depends on how its tuned, in australia they will make it say 200kw its an increase in power over the previous LE0 (port injected) version but having it detuned they will gain more economy out of it, the LLT can and is tuned in some cars and are around Low 9's Per 100km

[revv_head]

No need to get angry bro.

[andyman]

No need to get angry bro.

hmm sorry long day at work if you know what i mean, too much going on

[hingo1983]

I don't see a problem with the 3.0L as long as it provides equal/more power and torque as the 3.6L. It also should be built in Australia. If not, I wouldn't be impressed.

[Sphinx]

here's a nice little pdf showing the various configurations of the LLT. It gives them plenty of scope for power increases in later models.

http://www.gmpowertrain.ca/Product/3...LT%20Specs.pdf

[revv_head]

hmm sorry long day at work if you know what i mean, too much going on

no worries bro.

[andrewmac]

From what I have heard and read, the Zeta platform has had quite a bit of weight saving applied to it so VF or whatever the next major update is could very well be lighter than the porky VE.
I also have a feeling the commodore will no be getting the 3.6 DI motor either.
I dont like the idea but if holden have a motor which can produce 225 Kw and provide good fuel economy, why not just make a lower power version at say 195- 205 and then have a sports version at the full 225 ??
The comaro which uses the DI v6 avg is around about 10.2 L/100Km and thats calculated at 50% city 50% highway and its actually HEAVIER than an SV6.
So it stands to reason that they would not bother with a 3L motor when they could get it out of the 3.6 with a bit of development.
The only reason I could see to take the 3L route is that there would be little development required to slot it in and easier and cheaper than to engineer the 3.6 DI for fuel economy.
I have heard it is possible they will just keep the 3.6 without DI as is for the higher end model.
I hope Im wrong but too many things don't add up.

[1991_Vn2nV]

umm no, the di (LLT) version does more than 3% better economy, it depends on how its tuned, in australia they will make it say 200kw its an increase in power over the previous LE0 (port injected) version but having it detuned they will gain more economy out of it, the LLT can and is tuned in some cars and are around Low 9's Per 100km

Ok I will re-state it. GM claims 3% better fuel economy on the LLT than the LY7 and when they replaced the LY7 with the LLT in the Cadillacs, it made a 3% improvement in fuel economy.

Yes it can be detuned to return better economy but nobody knows what it could be detuned to, or how much impact that will have on the fuel consumption. You may as well stick to the facts, the numbers we already know.

[67rce]

I can see a major problem with the 3.0L V6 Commodore.

1. The car will be too heavy for a low torque motor, forcing it to be revved harder, and as such, increasing fuel comsumption.

2. The Omega and any other model which is fitted with the 3.0 V6 will effectively hand private sales to Ford for anyone who wished to tow, but cannot afford the extra $$$ to get the 3.6

3. StarFire anyone??

[hsvtj]

as far as i'd heard the smaller v6 would be an option..

and although most of us dont like the idea of the smaller engine with less torque, theres a lot of people out there who will buy brand new commodores who dont care about torque levels, as long as its cheap to run

[levymetal]

why don't they try and develop a good CVT (continuously variable transmission) instead of pissing around with engines that rarely run at their most efficient rpm? if they got one of these, no matter what you want to do you'll always the most efficient power/economy being delivered at a constant rate.

[BANKS]

why dont they just use FI? problem solved or am i missing something..

[greenfoam]

Holden can't make a forced induction motor as the basic engine because no P platers would be able to drive it. Not that they would anyway

[Calaber]

In today's economic climate, economy is numero uno. Performance is down the list. If they can somehow get both in one package, they would do so, but if the cost to achieve both exceeds the returns, or makes the car uncompetitive price-wise, economy will always get the nod.

[BANKS]

Holden can't make a forced induction motor as the basic engine because no P platers would be able to drive it. Not that they would anyway

Because all car makers know that P platers are the majority of the market...

Also, P plates actually buying a $30000 car as their first car would be .0000000001% of total sales.

Everyone wants economy but you'll never get a 1800kg+ car with a 3lt n/a v6 to get any respectable economy. It will only take a couple of bad reviews from the car mags to completely destroy the reputation of the car, as much as fuel economy can be a major selling point, it can also be a the final nail in the coffin.

[greenfoam]

I reckon most P platers do a fair bit of driving in the family car, but anyway I agree it's going to be a disaster, it might show good fuel ecconomy Melbourne to Sydney or other such super freeways. But as soon as a few corners and hills in the real world come into play and a bit of stop start it's going to be rubbish

[stocky]

I reckon most P platers do a fair bit of driving in the family car, but anyway I agree it's going to be a disaster, it might show good fuel ecconomy Melbourne to Sydney or other such super freeways. But as soon as a few corners and hills in the real world come into play and a bit of stop start it's going to be rubbish

yeah but they should just do what ford do, and offer the forced induction as an option

[greenfoam]

Ford are talking V8 options for all models including base models again for next year with the new V8, just how it should be. That'll shake Holden up a bit

[levymetal]

that is good news, and i hope they do it. i think power windows and cruise are already standard on base model cars anyway, and they are the only 2 features i actually use . i would happily drive an exec v8.

[greenfoam]

And I dont use or like power windows and cruise, My car has the buttons to make cruise work but no cruise :P