New Demerit Point Laws. Unfair?

[TheGenesis]

Okay guys,

I'm on the logbook stage of my 'L' plates. When I got my logbook on Thursday, I was handed a brochure about the new demerit point laws and it's got me thinking..

Is this only in Western Australia? ..or is it a national thing?

On 'L' plates and Red 'P' plates you can only accumulate 4 demerits before you lose your license or your learners permit. Whilst green 'P' platers can only accumulate 8 demerits before losing their license.

A far cry from the current 12 points.

One of the guys my Dad works with rear ended a Getz with his Lancer a few weeks back, he copped a $100 and 2 demerits. If he was a red 'P' plater on a long weekend, he would've lost his license.

Does this sound unfair? What's everyones opinion on this?

[Krisp]

you wont have a problem if you dont do anything wrong

[Pickle']

the laws are shit but what ever really you have to deal with them.. we also have here (not sure if its national) but any speeding offense for a p plater is minimum 4 points so if your on your reds 1 speeding offense and your gone.. its all pretty shit but you cant do much

[jas98]

wow, you get 8 points on your greens? we and i think nsw and vic only get 4 (im in qld) ilost 8 points from speeding,and licence and money (my only ever fine) fine. got 4 back now though

i do think the nsw laws a bullshit with teh red p plater (not sure in vic is the same or sa)

i was told the onther day there was a red p plater here that got fined sum ridiculous amout and like 3 points because his p plate was slightly on an angle so now he has like 4 on teh back and 4 on the front, seriously how is haveing a p plate on an angle dagerous??? wtf am i a better driver if i was to get a laser leveler and make my p plate dead straight?

its revenue raising these p plater laws

[Krisp]

im kinda happy by them, the less p platers on the road the safer my bull bar becomes

[gopher]

most p platers that i encounter don't deserve to even have a license let alone extra points

[minux]

Does this sound unfair? What's everyones opinion on this?

With the current state of driver training in this country it is very unfair. Learner drivers are taught to pass a test, with no real life skill they are then expected to drive on fairly hectic roadways. On this basis alone licences shouldn't be lost on government inadequacies.

[Calaber]

I don't think new drivers have anything to complain about with the points system. In the 1960's, when the provisional license system was introduced in NSW, P platers didn't get second chances. One offence - bye bye license for three months. My mate was booked for speeding a week after getting his P's and was walking a few weeks later.

[accentstencil]

I don't think new drivers have anything to complain about with the points system. In the 1960's, when the provisional license system was introduced in NSW, P platers didn't get second chances. One offence - bye bye license for three months. My mate was booked for speeding a week after getting his P's and was walking a few weeks later.

I was just about to say the same thing. We had no points system when I was on P's. Lost it for 3 months for not displaying P plate. So 4 points is not bad.

[Grennan]

We only got 4 points here. You get no sympathy from me.

[nathanVY]

8 points on your greens? we get 5 points on Ls & Ps regardless of colour!

EDIT: Speaking of which I got one back the other day

[TVR-190]

Reds get 4, Greens get 7 in NSW. but we lose more point than a fully licensed driver for a few offences.

[LS1FUN]

Here in Victoria Red and Green P plate drivers get 5 points.

Driving at night without headlights on is 1 point but driving without a P plate displayed is 3 points. Whoever thought of that needs to be hurt, bad!

[Stressball]

In QLD it's 0 points on L's, but you'd have to be a prick to a cop to actually lose a point. In theory your instructor should lose the points, not you. Then we get 4 points on reds, and then back to 4 points for the 24 months on greens.

[kuzman89]

The L's and P's test are a joke in Vic, it is unfair that after passing these tests you are expected to be a decent driver on our roads, and face bigger penalties if you stuff up compared to fully licensed drivers.

[soop]

I agree, they're in expirienced yet have more onus on them to be better?

Accidents happen, and will happen when inexpirienced. There should be a buffer zone to give people a chance.

[CHA53R]

pretty sure greens in vic is 6 points and red 2 ls dont have points..

[jules]

the road is not a fun park. stop treating it like your private race track and you won't care about demerit points.

i understand the attraction - i was a mad driver on my Ps and got caught for all sorts of stuff, but that doesn't make it right. sorry, but the cops are right - people have got the idea that they've got some kind of right to break the road rules, that it's a national pasttime or something. it's not - do the crime, do the time. *flame suit on*

[kuzman89]

It's not about breaking the law. It's about drivers with barely any experience being put in unfamiliar situations.

[Darcon666]

Back on the OP question.... yes it's fair as far as I am concerned...When I got my L/P's(Yes back in the Dark Ages when they only had a horse a cart.... lol) we had NO fracken points you whingeing, snotty nosed twats, so count your blessing I say.

As for drivers abilities... well maybe we should take a leaf out of the German way of getting your license....

3yrs of training by a government(RTA equivalent) person not your friends/parents or private school, Cost > €5,000, + private school that is logbooked @ your expense with minimum of 1000hrs-split in 3’s across city/hwy/rural roads.... then a probationary period of 5yrs.

As an instructor friend of my said once to a student.... “This is NOT a game...You crash–You die!!!!” but no one take any notice.

[Drawnnite]

if its good enough to have it on p's make it the same on a full licence.

as for unfamiliar situations, advanced driver training is the answer. however it costs money. so it'll never happen.
fines from inexperienced driving and stupid behaviour looks better then paying to stop this.

a licence is a priveledge not a right. and there is no select button to reset that crash

[soop]

All they do is keep asking for money...
None of these measures stop the problem. People learn from their mistakes. Basically what these new rules are say is don't make a mistake.

Now, if you're not going to teach people properly in the first place how can you expect them not to?
You can't.
But god that's an easy way to make money isn't it...

[ClairBear]

It's not about breaking the law. It's about drivers with barely any experience being put in unfamiliar situations.

How is being caught speeding not breaking the law? There are signs everywhere advertising the limits, all motorists are aware of the basic road limits so P Platers who choose to flout this law deserve to be penalised, after all as you and others point out these are inexperienced drivers, therefore it is detrimental that they don't speed and risk losing control.

[soop]

Yeah but its not just speeding.
P-platers are under allot more scrutiny. Which is fair enough. But the repercussions are 4 times that of a full licensed driver. So they're being picked up for very small indiscretions (I.e, P-plates being on the wrong angle) and then getting arse raped for it.

That's not fair.

I'm no longer on my P's, haven't been for a year or more. But I do remember the bullshit that goes on.

[ClairBear]

Soop I agree totally. With 3 adult children I have lived through the P Plate era and heard all the tales. Luckily none of my 3 lost their licence during their P Plate phase, they all drove like bitches and ensured their plates were fixed and all the other bullshit stupid rules were followed to the letter.

Yes it's pathetic to gain demerit points (you don't have them to lose, you actually are awarded demerit points for infractions) for having a plate not on display after it fell down along with a plethora of other stupid and pedantic infringements that get handed out.

As most of the other long timers like me here know, my argument has long been that instead of hammering home hill starts and reverse parking for new drivers, a defensive driving course should be compulsory for all those on their L's. How many of these kids could control a car that slides out of control? Most would panic and hit the brakes.