Make the stupid stop!
LMAO, like the time Union Reps wanted a workforce of 2000 to stand down until 5 men who were fired for returning to work drunk were reinstated. After that fiasco a large number of workers pulled out of the Union. Also do you not find it hypocritical that these Reps still get paid during strikes? If they were so damn passionate about standing as one and being brothers then they would forgo their wages too.Originally Posted by ozdash
Minux I have visited a few countries and can tell you there are far worse roads and a lot of shitty cars out there we in oz I think have done well with both when you consider the population and the area we take up on this planet
Hey im not saying its a perfect system by any means , every work place IS deffierent buy we cant let us as a worker be unfairly treated , In saying that i dont agree with a walk out for 5 so called drunk members either..
If you're happy to give your hard earned to a fat and lazy bureaucracy then that's your prerogative. Only the lazy really need union protection. I hate how unions piss and moan about "right to be in a union" but as soon as non union labor gets brought in strikes get called. What about the right to NOT be in a union? I was a member of the CFMEU for two years and I couldn't believe some of the shit they got up to.
I used to think like you, that unions were there to protect the working class. Really they're all political now and their main goals are feathering their own nests.
The CFMEU have done no favors for the union movement i agree there , But dont taint all unions the same.
Customize your life.
There must be a good reason Qantas has been known as the safest airline for decades.
Unions are handy when a lady of 50 is injured at work and she fronts the work about compensation and representing them are a group of legal and not so important people at a nice round table sitting across from you. If you want to represent yourself your paddling with a tennis racket. if you want someone to provide support and representation and can afford so go for it. And if that be in the way of unions thats your call again. But i dont see how a union is needed in smaller work forces, but something with an extremely large workforce sure.
I'm 21 and have never been a member of a union although i have seen what they do...
From my experience they argue for arguing sake putting the good of the workers before everything else... the fact that the workers may lose their jobs because the company goes bust is a minor detail to them as long as they get what they want
Would love for Joyce just to say Qantas is shutting down your all fired see you later... the look on every member of the unions faces would be hilarious and i would'nt have a problem with people losing their houses cause of it because they didnt realise that the fact they had a job with good wages was enough... they had to have more so give em less i say
How hard can it be?
Seems the only winner out of all of this is Virgin Australia.
The New Ride - The Class 2 Shuttle Craft (VE)
I'll be he comes to get you, some shopping trolley kind of thing, that gets you where your going nice and slow... Well off you go that's fine, the pleasure's all mine.
When I light the nitro on my HQ 454 Monroe!
Customize your life.
Lets hope its not tiger.
Whatever the big argument in this thread is about... I'm just freaking pissed off that my hubby isn't going back to work as scheduled (miner).
Anybody know what they are sorting out flight wise in the interim??
I'm a girl... I'm blonde... But I drive a really nice car
Who wants chowder?
I've said it before, unions are as useless as tits on a bull.
I've been bullied personally to join unions many times on sites that don't require union labour, that's how these assholes work. I was told i'd be blacklisted from every worksite in victoria if i didn't join.
I'm sorry but if 3 drops of rain hurts you that much that you have to stop work for the day then you're just plain lazy.
Obviously Unsensible
i can understand if your working outside not going back. however if your tools are still out you would go back up to pack up in the wet. why not just stay up there?
i probably work on one of the biggest union sites right now. and it does seem strange. even makes we wonder aswell.
some of the things unions do i would say i like. PICNIC day for example.
however back to the real issue with QANTAS.
lets just say goodbye to them. they have totally messed up and arent happy with what they have.
both sides have acted like children and need to get a foot up the rear.
if they were smart they would have both come to an agreement. hell every other workplace is still able to work productively while this happens. and are happy when it does get there.
its not like this engineers do not get paid nicely anyway. they are being just greedy.
however QANTAS would have preplanned to send work offshore to save a dollar. however it will cost more if it has to come back here and be fixed properly.
however why does the CEO get a multi million payrise when the company was loosing money all year? that is one of the stupidest things ive ever heard of
how about we make the pedals out of sticky rubber and the shoes with steel spikes. at least my shins would like that
Infidel Bear
Mini Putt 2 Champion!
Why can't other countries fix it properly? Singapore airlines do not send jets here to get fixed properly. Nor do Etihad, nor do every other bloody airline, why is it only Australians can fix QANTAS jets properly?
Because the shareholders voted upon it? He did not give himself a pay rise, it is voted on through the board appointed by the share owners. These CEO's are paid this money to do exactly what Joyce is doing now, trying to re-structure a company to return bigger profits to all who partly own the business.
PS: It is "losing"
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
- Theodor Seuss Geisel
I know fellow workers who were in a bit of strife for whatever reason join the union at the last resort when they knew their backsides were in a sling.
They knew if they represented themselves they would have slim to zero chance in retaining their job.
I have been personally helped by the union a few times and I would never be without their representation.
The unions have their purpose for all those union bashers out there.
Tells it like it is.
This is one of the problems of our media. The overly simplistic reporting that gets perpetuated into fact within a very short time.
Fact: Alan Joyce's base salary decreased this financial year. (Still a nice earn but a decrease is hardly a multimillion dollar increase now is it?)
Fact: To realize around 40% (roughly) of his bonus the share price must increase by around 50% over the next 12 months. (Not impossible but highly unlikely IMO).
People - if you are going to make claims about a given subject either get it right (and be able to defend it) or acknowledge that said "fact" is an estimate on your part and could be (often most likely) be very wrong/exaggeration/generalization.
Reaper
moderator- for now anyway
Good on them, its unfortunate for all the stranded travellers but I really can't help but think 'sucked in' to these greedy union sheeples.
How many union members will be lining up at their respective branches today telling their unions to stop being dick heads?
Well done Alan Joyce. Standing up to these thugs that don't understand real business was the best and only way to go.
In my view, all under that union should have been dismissed weeks ago, with an option to talk direct with Qantas regarding being re-employed.
Your freedom ends where mine begins
Trying to protect Australian jobs by being a difficult workforce and making the offshore jobs options look more attractive? Interesting logic.
Good luck with that. The more likely situation will be that after the grounding drags on a certain period of time QANTAS says it's hand are tied and in order to prevent the company collapsing they need to hire a workforce overseas to get it flying.
Options 2 is that the grounding drags on, cripples the company, the comapny goes they way of Ansett and all the union brothers not only lose their job, but also cause Australians who work for QANTAS and are not stricking to lose theirs.
The final options is Labor gets involved, at which point the run QANTAS into the ground and see option 2 for final outcome.
In all of the above options, Alan Joyce walks away with a golden handshake and continues living his cosy life.
GO UNIONS!
Infidel Bear
Mini Putt 2 Champion!
Reap, I am unaware exactly of what Joyce gets paid, I was simply explaining the process as to how a CEO gets a payrise. It seems people think they just give themselves one whenever they feel at free will.
None, that would require them to think for themselves. If they did think for themselves there is no need to be in a union!
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
- Theodor Seuss Geisel
Your freedom ends where mine begins
When my old man used to work for an Industrial Furnance building and maintanance company he used to get that on every 2nd site.
we like the bun
this will end badly for the unions.
qantas mgt doesn't see a future in running airlines from australia, with its higher wages. the unions want it to ignore global economic realities, by choosing to make a loss in order to preserve aussie jobs. it is actually illegal for qantas - who have a responsibility to maximise shareholder value - to agree to that.
Fair Work may step in and impose restrictions on qantas' offshoring, but they can't legislate over the balance sheet. if they force qantas into an unprofitable situation, the jobs will be lost through reduced market share.
what qantas mgt are doing is simply acknowledging the reality of a gradual and permanent shift in how the global airline industry is being restructured - using lower cost labour in developing countries. all the tantrums in the world won't change that.
★★★★★
If the ASX doesn't freeze trading in Qantas Monday morning there will be at least some nice cheap shares to scoop up
I have worked both in a heavily unionised company and now a private company and i have never been better off in both pay and conditions without union interference !
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