Workplace Industrial Relations Reform, Good or not for Aust?

[Hot-Rod]

Yello People,

Over the past several months a lot of conversation at my workplace has taken place in regards to the proposed Industrial Relations Reform. It's seems to be that the Govt is going to make it law soon and i was wondering if i could get some views on everything from you guys.

I think it's an attack on what we have worked so hard too get in regards to rights and standards in the Australian Workplace.

Anyway tell me your thoughts and views people.

[AussieHolden]

Well my view is that Libriel have never been for the workers of Australia never have so they don't care and they are anti unoinist's as well.

They are going to make it alot harder for the little aussie battler to get ahold of that aussie dream of owning there own home if not already since they came to power.

We need to chuck the liberals out of seat and restore Labour ASAP.

My 2cents.

[bangers]

yeah cos labor really did alot for australia (sarcastically). i'm not saying i agree with the changes but labor sure as hell isn't going to do any better. you can't honestly say you want beazley in power. just look how bad the labor state govn. is. they screwed NSW.

[vztrt]

The law was past just before Christmas. I dont think you can do much now.

[clixanup]

It's seems to be that the Govt is going to make it law soon...

Welcome to November 2005.

Too late to worry about this stuff now, mate.

Anyhow, I bet at least half your colleagues voted Liberal at the last election. They made the choice. We have to live with it. I bet they'll still vote Liberal at the next election too. People are idiots.

All these "Free Trade" agreements are seeing Australia cop it up the rectum, but come election time, remember that the lying bastard who is John Howard has nothing but your best interests at heart.

All you have to do is look at the current state of Australian Manufacturing to see exactly what Johnny has done for this country.

[bommodore]

does anyone else find it odd that most people seem to hate the libs but they keep getting in

[bangers]

does anyone else find it odd that most people seem to hate the libs but they keep getting in

no. cos we still remember how bad labour was. remember keating spent 10,000 on a table. the free travel poli's got at our expense. and the debt we were left in at the end of their time. plus we've had Carr stuff NSW and send GST to other states even though they are financially sufficient without it. Look at our hospitals and roads and thank labour for that. so your job was cushier under labour, boo hoo. look at the bigger picture of our economy. even the FOX owner,whats-his-name, and the late Kerry Packer said that our economy has benefited and even taken off thanx too liberal. so stop whinging.

[clixanup]

cos we still remember how bad labour was.

Nope. Its because of all the fear, uncertainty & doubt the Liberals seem to create come election time.

Keating was the best PM this country ever had. Interest rates & the national debt were well & truly on the decrease when Johnny took over.

plus we've had Carr stuff NSW and send GST to other states even though they are financially sufficient without it.

You're just a well of mis-information aren't you? The distribution of GST revenue is decided by the Federal Government. So, thank Johnny instead. Speaking of GST, do you remember the time - ohh musta been around 1996, just before an election - when Johnny said "A GST is not part of our policy and it never will be". WHAT WAS THE FIRST THING HE DID? He's a lying prick.

even the FOX owner,whats-his-name, and the late Kerry Packer said that our economy has benefited and even taken off thanx too liberal.

Have a guess why? Liberals & big business have always got along, because as they say, "One hand washes the other."

You're a legend mate. Keep voting Liberal even though you don't understand what you're voting for.



As I said before, have a look at the state of manufacturing in this country to see exactly what Johnny has done for us.

[bangers]

so you like a prime minister who calls this country the arse end of the world. good for you. and thats a crock about debt coming down. keating racked it up, then turned around and showed the last budget where it came down abit. you're a good judge of character aren't you. ohh yeah.. and labour has never lied have they cos they're all little angels. those d*ckheads love giving money out so all the idiots think they're great and they don't realise where the money is being taken from. it's taken johnny years to rectify the problems labour caused.

[clixanup]

so you like a prime minister who calls this country the arse end of the world. good for you. and thats a crock about debt coming down. keating racked it up, then turned around and showed the last budget where it came down abit. you're a good judge of character aren't you.

Well, at the time I was studying Economics at Uni, so I had a fair idea of what Keating was doing and where the economy was headed.

And it was Bob Hawke who called Australia the arse end of the world. Check your memory.

[clixanup]

does anyone else find it odd that most people seem to hate the libs but they keep getting in

I'm guessing that there's a conspiracy between the Freemasons and the Liberals. Wouldn't surprise me in the east bit. Frickin' Tories.

[bangers]

no it wasn't. i spose it was old bob who caused an uproar touching the queen too.

[clixanup]

those d*ckheads love giving money out so all the idiots think they're great and they don't realise where the money is being taken from.

Hello? This describes Johnny's "Baby Bonus" to a tee. Funny how they mostly pay it in election years...

[clixanup]

no it wasn't. i spose it was old bob who caused an uproar touching the queen too.

No. Keating dared touch the Queen's shoulder. Bob called Australia the arse end of the world. Keating said we're a banana republic. Get it right.

I was there. You were barely 10 at the time.

[bangers]

better to encourage making our own population rather than import it. and they pay the money every year. you can't honestly say keating and hawke did more for the economy than johnny.

[bangers]

can i just say that i'm not a liberal. i just don't vote for wankers cos they make hollow promises. if labour got someone decent to lead them and made some decent policies then i'd vote for them.

[clixanup]

you can't honestly say keating and hawke did more for the economy than johnny.

I can. And I am. Furthermore, I'm saying it as someone who has studied Economics.

[bangers]

if you say so. lets just say we agree to disagree and leave it at that. i'm not saying that johnny has made great decisions in the past and that he hasn't lied but show me a poli that hasn't lied.

[clixanup]

show me a poli that hasn't lied.

Very true. Its a dirty game, and most of them will do & say anything to get places.

[bangers]

maybe we should become communists.

[Garth]

does anyone actualy know what the new ir changes are?

[Shifty1]

the change that sticks out to me is the removal of unfair dismissal laws to business under 100 employees (I think its 100).

...

[holden#1]

my two cents worth...

Johnny & the Liberals are all about looking after Australia in the eyes of the international community... and also looking after big business.... they don't give a stuff about the little guy.

Liberals = Capitalists
Labour = Commmunists

Capitalism is bad because the rich get richer and get a monopoly on everything...

Communisim is bad because it kills the incentive to get ahead, but hey, everone gets paid the same etc etc...

Very simplistic way to look at it, but the background principles of Liberal and Labour share a lot with these two ideals...

I think that the new IR laws will mainly affect big companies and those of us who have arseholses for bosses.

No anti-dismissal for businesses under 100 employees? terrible...

Then again, if you've got a good boss, and you're a good worker, you've got nothing to fear

[Hot-Rod]

1. Make it easier for workers to be sacked
The Coalition is attacking job security, leaving 3.6 million employees vulnerable to unfair dismissal. It wants to:
* Abolish all unfair dismissal protection for people working in workplaces with less than 100 staff.
* Change workplace agreements so they no longer have to contain minimum award redundancy standards.
* Make sure workers who are made redundant or retrenched due to the 'operational requirements' of a business will not be able to claim unfair dismissal, no matter what size their workplace.

2. Allow employers to put workers onto individual contracts that cut take-home pay and reduce minimum standards
The Government wants more employees pushed on to its AWA individual contracts so that employers can:
* Single out employees, forcing new working conditions on to them one at a time.
* Have more control over your working hours and make more people casual.
* Get rid of work rights like weekend, shift and public holiday rates; overtime; redundancy pay and allowances.

3. Change the way minimum wages are set to make them lower
The Government wants minimum wages in Australia to be lower. This will reduce the living standards for many people who are only just keeping their heads above water. To achieve this the Government wants:
* To stop the independent umpire – the Industrial Relations Commission – from setting minimum wage rates.
* Minimum wages to be set by a so-called “Fair Pay Commission” tasked only with ensuring the economy is competitive – not with balancing the dual needs of a strong economy and wage fairness.

4. Replace the award safety net with just five minimum conditions
Most of the minimum pay rates and working conditions we take for granted are guaranteed in State or Federal awards, which also underpin workplace agreements. The Government’s new laws will:
* Take away any requirement for agreements to be consistent with award rights, and strip down agreements to just five minimum conditions: a minimum hourly rate, 10 days sick leave, 2 weeks annual leave (2 weeks of which can be cashed out), unpaid parental leave and a maximum number of weekly working hours.
* Preserve the 38 hour week in theory - but not extra pay for overtime, weekends, shift work or public holidays. There will be no rostering limits on when you will be asked to work these hours.
* Remove protection for important rights like: limits on when you can be required to work, overtime pay, weekend or night work rates, work related allowances and annual leave loading.

5. Restrict Australians' access to unions and make it harder for employees to bargain as a group with their employer
The Howard Government’s plans will affect everyone’s right to get help when they need it most. The Government wants to make it harder for unions to protect and represent employees by:
* Making it harder for employees to ask unions to make workplace visits.
* Making it harder for unions to legally take industrial action when negotiations break down.
* Increasing penalties for unions and workers.

6. Reduce the powers of the independent Industrial Relations Commission
The Government wants to weaken the powers of the independent umpire in the workplace by stopping it from setting minimum wage rates or considering new award conditions. It will do this by:
* Taking away the role of the independent umpire is a recipe for more disputes and lower workplace standards.

[ucwepn]

This exact thread cause a mega argument at the gmh-torana forum and it was very unpleasant so I wont go into details but I will say that I don't agree with the industrial relations reforms it will never make Australia as competetive as some other countries and it will only lower our standard of living like some other countries. How do we maintain the current standard of living if inflation increases and wages get lower???