Tells it like it is.
Victorian State Government
For a government who have been in power for over a decade, it appears to me their becoming less and less professional. I would have thought professionalism would get better with experience. Two big examples lately have hit the headlines:
Several weeks ago the health minister announced they were going to roll out health checks for all employees of businesses in Victoria. All fine and dandy, it is a noble cause and a great way to get the Premier and Health ministers smiling mugs on the front of the daily newspapers. Problems started when asked about the content of the checks and how the program was to be implemented. The response was along the lines of: Errrr ummmm..... you want to know what???? ahhhh..... well those details are yet to be considered....... we are here today to make the announcement so we can all feel warm and fuzzy....
Then yesterday Mr Brumby announced a raft of new measures to counteract problem gambling. Amongst them was reducing the limit from $10 to $5 on a single spin of a pokie machine due to be phased in over the next few years. When asked which machines it will apply to both the Premier and Gaming Minister on several occasions said "all". This was news to the execs at Crown who have a $10 limit as part of their casino contract with the state governement that is valid for many years into the future. Several hours later a statement was relased acknowledging that Crown was exempt from the new limits.
Also as part of the announcment self imposed betting limits for problem gamblers, limiting their losses for the day/week/whatever. Again, great! However once again, when pressed for detail the response was - well ummm actually we have no idea how we are going to do it but we thought we will make the announcement anyway.
My confidence in the Government is getting very shaky. Any minister making an announcement should be totally accross the detail. Anything less is disgraceful. Further more, to make announcements out of the blue about stuff you have no idea how you are going to implement is plain crazy and not the mark of any competent manager.
Add to this the public transport ticket fiasco - already a year late and probably another 2 before it starts to be rolled out, costing at least $500million (nobody has come clean on the true cost). Plus our teachers, ambulance men, police, nurses and firefighters all either taking or considering industrial action for one reason or another. I really think managing this states affairs is beyond Mr Brumby and his team. Everywhere you look there are examples of short sighted reactions and lack of propper planning and thinking concepts thru.
Reaper
Ecotech Power
Dont forget the new P-plate laws :P
Originally Posted by alien
Thats Dr to you.....
You think thats bad, take a look at the rotten mess which is the NSW Labor Government!
we like the bun
Vic Labor have recently managed to avoid disasters that plagued the previous Labor Cain/Kirner govts. stuff ups like those mentioned by Reaper above are common.
voters didn't like Kennett's perceived autocratic style and despite arguably doing a pretty good job in many areas, they prefer the softer, cuddly Labor party at state level.
the major concern is not gaffes like those above, it's the growing strategy of state govts being paralysed by fear, i.e. doing nothing to avoid major screw ups. the problem is it works with voters, the gradual build up in infrastructure demand caused by lack of govt investment doesn't hit people between the eyes and they learn to accept it. spending $1 billion on a new fwy or rail line, while arguably needed, is much riskier.
voters need to learn to judge govts on what they didn't do, as much as what they did but didn't get quite right.
Your freedom ends where mine begins
^^^ Agree with that...
When the federal election was on Labor was burning John Howards arse when he mentioned interest rate increases...
Since the new government has come in the interest rate has gone up 3 times!
But people voted for them because "They didn't like John Howards" or "Its time for a change" or "Kevin 07 has a nice ring to it..."
Tells it like it is.
Your point is well made and stems back to the underlying issue that is our state governments decision making procedure is flawed. You are right about infrastructure too.
Till the desal plant earlier this year (which was catagorically off the agenda according to the ALP during their state election campaigne), No extra water capacity has been commissioned in this state since the Thompson Dam was completed in the early 80's. Several years of below average rainfall and a near disaster has finally prompted this government to act. Of course their solution was to blame the people - use less water they say. The public went nuts installing water tanks and minimising their usage but that can only go so far in a city with such a fast growing population.
It was only when the water Minister's back was to the wall that he decided a desal plant wasn't such a bad idea. Mind you, the Mitchell (?) river in SE Gippsland which was earmarked by the Bolte Governement of the 60's as a good site for a dam was discounted as it doesn't provide enough water and the associated environmental lobbies enevitable protests. Anybody remember which river was the first to flood when we had a downpoor last July? And again in September (or whenever it was)? The Mitchell River.
Reaper
TURN MY HEADPHONES UP
How about Kevin Rudd's language? His choice of words are poor and he really doesn't sound smart when he is talking. Sounds like a 5th grader to me. Although I don't have any examples, every time I hear him on the news I just laugh at him fumbling with his words. He runs this country...
<---Brad Quaid = internet stalker
Try living in south west Vic, the state government doesn't even consider anything this side of Geelong to be part of the state.
A while ago brumby suggested that we (the only part of victoria without access to a close based rescue helicopter) were in need of a chopper.
Now that he is in power he wont talk to any of us about it. No matter how many letters or pickets we do he still doesn't care.
It is way to easy to make statements when you aren't in power... and then do nothing about them when you finally have the chance.
Brumby is bad for the state.
Ahhh yes, the labor government. Should've voted Liberal eh?
Infidel Bear
Mini Putt 2 Champion!
*sigh*
I see the Federal government has just named ANOTHER new authority...the Murray Darling Water Authority...
This is about the 10th new authority that will do nothing and will have no power. When the hell are Labor going to start actually governing this country rather than just introduce new authorities and studies etc....pathetic, really pathetic.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
- Theodor Seuss Geisel
Tells it like it is.
It is currently reported on Sky that the Vic government have had a change of heart and are now going to sign the Murray-Darling water management plan. I guess i'm a tad cynical but surely the change in government hasn't had anything to do with it?
To delay agreeing to such a scheme just because "the other mob" are in power is reprehensible. Both state and federal governments are elected to govern and what has happened here is a gross dereliction of duty by our state government. They are not fit to hold office.
Reaper
I Jizzed in my pants
Unfortunately with all governments that have held power for a great number of years they all grow complacent. The Vic government needs a kick in the arse to make them pull their heads out.
We still have about 2 or so years before the next election, hopefully a party will put up a decent contender against labor.
Who knows what was done to sweeten the deal for Brumby. I doubt it would have just been Rudds charm. You'd have to think he'd be getting something out of it other than just the satisfaction of not bowing down to a Federal Liberal Government.
Signage, Splash Backs and Display Systems
"No, I'm not a pessimist. At some point the world shits on everybody. Pretending it ain't shit makes you an idiot, not an optimist."
Banned
Don't like John Brumby, he appears very arrogant and dictatorial to me. Not coming to the table and negotiating with the teachers and just sending in Minister Pike to say no, was poor.....he will most likely see a very strong backlash from both the electorate and the teachers.
Last edited by commsirac; 28-03-2008 at 07:23 AM.
we like the bun
who are the teachers going to vote in? the liberals? lol that's throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
teflon steve bracks had a smooth style and was not arrogant or dictatorial. but he didn't get much done either.
Banned
? Can't imagine teachers on mass voting liberal, LOL, or waiting for the next election to take action. I was thinking of that the backlash would take the form of more immediate and pointed action.....reduction/elimination of services for weeks at a time.....
Infidel Bear
Mini Putt 2 Champion!
If teachers are so well off that they can afford to be without wages for weeks at a time then i doubt they need a pay rise.
Voting a government out is the best form of industrial action anyone can take. If libs were smart(yet to see an intelligent state lib leader in Vic since Kennett) they would be doing the typical labor ploy and jumping on the "we will do what you want" bandwagon.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
- Theodor Seuss Geisel
<---Brad Quaid = internet stalker
Yeah as a teacher i will certainly back that. I know we should be paid more for both what we put up with and what teachers in other states get for doing the same job but a) I'm not a union member because it is difficult to find the extra $500 odd to join per year and b) i sure as hell can't afford to take days off let alone weeks off without pay.
For those reason i do not strike. It's like being between a rock and a hard place... People think because i don't strike i don't need the payrise when infact i don't strike because financially i can't afford to.
(and the work waits!!! nothing worse than missing a day and doing 2 days work when I get back to school).
Infidel Bear
Mini Putt 2 Champion!
Well said, It seems the ones who want to cause this action(usually overpaid union heavies) seem to not have to worry about income.
Living with a teacher, I can say they deserve pay rises, there is no doubt about it, but so do nurses, so do police, so do fire staff, so do ambo's etc. This Labor government isn't giving anything to our essential services.
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
- Theodor Seuss Geisel
<---Brad Quaid = internet stalker
i wonder if it is because they are 'essential' that they think they will just keep happening without upkeep. Could be something in that.
Banned
Yes, school teachers dont earn a lot of money to be able to take a week off. Unfortunately, you are going to be a lot more out of pocket if you wait until the next election to take some action. What makes you think you are going to be better off under another government, especially considering the liberal governments track record in shutting down the state system. They are just only going to come up with the same excuses as the present government regardless of whether they promise to give you any pay rise.
Yes, school teachers dont earn a lot of money to be able to take a week off, and care about their students, feel compelled to take catch up the work they missed etc(there wont be any work to catch up on if the students are sent home and there are no sub teachers, if you dont get paid, dont do any catch up work, its that simple).......but that's the very sentiment Brumby is relying on in continuing to exploit you.
Essential service? since when do our fire, police, nurses and ambos etc close down simultaneously for weeks at a time. An important service for the future of Australians it is, essential in terms of there will be a threat to public safety and possible anarchy without it, no.. I dont think we need to call the army in to take classes if the teachers walk out.
From what I can gauge, there is enormous public support for the teachers on this matter. Call his bluff, if they government doesnt fold after a week of no school,(free babysitting) Id be very surprised. It wont even be the teachers that have to be "in his face", it will be all the concerned parents and the media that will give him an absolute flogging.
Last edited by commsirac; 28-03-2008 at 09:20 AM.
Tells it like it is.
How much do teachers earn? I don't see how anybody can form an opinion on these pay disputes unless they know what the facts are.
For the public to say that <insert occupation here> should be paid more is daft unless they know what the rates are.
Reaper
<---Brad Quaid = internet stalker
I've never said we'd be better off under another government, we weren't before so why would we be next time? I think you missed where i said I CAN"T AFFORD TO TAKE TIME OFF. The money needs to be in my account. I understand it needs to happen but personally for me it can't happen.
Can tell you aren't a teacher. It certainly isn't that simple. If i leave the department WILL find some eager graduate to fill my spot because out of uni the wage looks pretty damn good to them. But can you imagine all the underpaid experienced teachers leaving and our schools being run by graduates?
There is indeed work to catch up on. I still have to do the paperwork. Believe it or not i could be busy at school for weeks on end even without the kids there. Unfortunately actual teaching seems to be about 20% of the job now.
Like i said above, if i can't afford it then i doubt everyone will drop work for a week.
That said i would hate to think how the kids would end up if that happened. It runs far deeper than you could imagine.
<---Brad Quaid = internet stalker
I'm on less than 47k. Range is between 45 and roughly 65 and takes 10 to 12 years to reach that. There is nothing over 65k unless you take on a Principal job and even the pay scale for what they do is pathetic.
Banned
Who are you calling daft?, most people would know, its been all over any newspaper worth reading, geez they could even google it.
vlv8vic could confirm, my recollection says about $60-68K four year trained, three year less) 12+ years experience and depending on any postion of responsibilty held. First year outs ~ $40+K? not much for trained professionals.
Banned
Best not to assume, what I do and dont know. I dont come on forums and post uninformed drivel. If you feel compelled to do paper work that you dont get paid for, that's your problem..........you can still do it at home while you are on strike anyway........you are meant to be taking at least 20+ hours of face to face teaching per week aren't you, so you spend another 80+ hours doing paperwork? you lose credibility when you exaggerate.
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