Why so many 4WD's?

[BOGANV8]

Yeah ok quick release may be some form of a option the only down sound that i can see is that the mounts may not be strong enough for when the car does go remote places and hits a roo then the bar may move because its not mounted as strong but aside from that well then yeah thats something to that could be looked into.. but i would say you would be right the cost would play a big part..


I guess the only reason not really a valid one is "because they can" same as people can have bonnet scoops on their cars people can have fast V8s, people can drive round in cars that sound loud (legal loud) BECAUSE they can.. and i not saying everything that people do is right or i agree with it but they can do it and who am i to stop it. Thats life like it or move to Antarctica and live in a igloo..

^^^^^^Not having a go at anybody but what else can ya do people will do and drive what they want.. I am member on a 4X4 forum and the same goes there Commodore drivers are not that high liked either for a simliar reason dart in and out of traffic and cut 4WDs off blah blah so its the same as this people hate for wheel drives why so many, other people hate commo drivers why so many blah blah..

Its a never ending battle..

[wingwang99]

I thought the point of this thread was on mothers and other drivers of 4WDs who don't need them, not how getting hit by a Lamborghini would be better than a bullbar.

WTF guys hijack the thread much?

[nicko]

Nicko, you have the attitude of a stereotypical 4x4 driver, which is the main reason why we continue to despise these things on our roads. It's not cool to intimidate other road users with the sheer size of your vehicle.

And you sir have the attitude of a stereotypical non 4x4 driver. Just because they scare people on the road doesnt mean they should be banned. When you get your licence you no exactly the type of cars our on the road and you HAVE to learn to deal with them. I HATE trucks and old people behind me but im not telling people to get them banned from our roads.

you cant fly over the bonnet of a van, truck or bus so why dont we get them banned aswell because they are going to do just as much damage as a hilux with a arb fitted bar. yeh?

If your going to ban bull bars then ban trucks, vans and buses in built up areas aswell. Same if not more damage inflicted so it shouldnt matter if they are needed on our roads or not because your complaining about the damage a bull bar does to people.

you obviously dont like 4x4s on the roads but plenty of people do. its called life.

[stocky]

If your going to ban bull bars then ban trucks, vans and buses in built up areas aswell.

trucks vans and buses serve a purpose in these areas. i dont see many kangaroos jumping in front of cars in the CBD

[nicko]

trucks vans and buses serve a purpose in these areas. i dont see many kangaroos jumping in front of cars in the CBD

Yeh but your not going to fly over the front of a non bar fitted hilux with a lift anyways so your ****ed with or without a bar stocky.

a bullbar is hardly going to affect the chances of someone being able to roll over my car if they get hit by it. It will be lifted so they cant go anywhere but straight forward, bar or no bar

[stocky]

Yeh but your not going to fly over the front of a non bar fitted hilux with a lift anyways so your ****ed with or without a bar stocky.

a bullbar is hardly going to affect the chances of someone being able to roll over my car if they get hit by it. It will be lifted so they cant go anywhere but straight forward, bar or no bar

yeah but a hilux with a lift kit and no bull bar means you have a better chance of going under the car and clearing it without getting a big solid metal bar into your side. i know what those hiluxes are like. theres one just like that in my garage. why not stick big spikes on it as well if your theory is that no matter what the pedestrian is ****ed?

[nicko]

if your on your knees and a lifted lux hits you your still going to get **** up an die. You would have to be lying down to make it under there, and if your lying on a road well your asking for it. Im just saying that in a fair few cases a bullbar is not the killer, its the car itself and banning a certain car on the roads is NEVER going to happen ( on the grounds of people not liking them).

even harder to go under a lux due to the ifs anyways lol. ill just follow the law and not WALK on the ROAD and i dont think ill get hit.

[stocky]

i was talking about a standing pedistrian. if you keep changing the situation then yeah, any car is an instand death for a pedestrian. why not say that the guys gonna be dead if hes charging at it ready to headbutt it? any car looks bad in that situation.
and with the hilux, i could lie down and mine would go right over the top of me easily.

[nicko]

your ****ed if your standing kneeling rolling jumping dancing singing.......... Unless your flat on the road chances are your going to die. I said kneeling because i though you meant that if you were crouched down you wouldnt die thats all. The bull bar will just make you dead about 0.00001 of a second faster

[davey g-force]

And you sir have the attitude of a stereotypical non 4x4 driver. Just because they scare people on the road doesnt mean they should be banned. When you get your licence you no exactly the type of cars our on the road and you HAVE to learn to deal with them. I HATE trucks and old people behind me but im not telling people to get them banned from our roads.

What valid excuse do you have for driving one of these big ugly beasts in the city? I said VALID excuse. None.

At least trucks, vans, buses have a purpose and the drivers of such vehicles are licensed accordingly.

[klaw81]

You guys are also overlooking another danger associated with bullbars...the reduction or elimination of the crumple zone. The crumple zone of a vehicle protects the vehicle's occupants by dissapating the force over a few seconds, absorbing some of the momentum and reducing the ferocity of the deceleration. The addition of a bullbar all but removes the crumple zone, making the vehicle less safe for the driver and passengers.

That in itself isn't so bad (you can reduce your own safety if you choose, in the same way smoking is legal but it's a stupid thing to do) but you also greatly increase the chances of killing the occupants of any car you happen to hit. Where a normal vehicle would crumple when striking another car - say a T-bone collision - a vehicle with a bullbar literally punctures the other car's panels. The force is not disappated at all (since the crumple zones are "protected" by the bullbar) and the other car's occupants have little chance of survival.

Add that to the fact that 4wds generally have worse braking distances and handling than the average sedan (particularly those with lift kits and heavily modified suspension) and you've got a recipe for a killing machine.

[TVR-190]

You guys are also overlooking another danger associated with bullbars...the reduction or elimination of the crumple zone. The crumple zone of a vehicle protects the vehicle's occupants by dissapating the force over a few seconds, absorbing some of the momentum and reducing the ferocity of the deceleration. The addition of a bullbar all but removes the crumple zone, making the vehicle less safe for the driver and passengers.

That in itself isn't so bad (you can reduce your own safety if you choose, in the same way smoking is legal but it's a stupid thing to do) but you also greatly increase the chances of killing the occupants of any car you happen to hit. Where a normal vehicle would crumple when striking another car - say a T-bone collision - a vehicle with a bullbar literally punctures the other car's panels. The force is not disappated at all (since the crumple zones are "protected" by the bullbar) and the other car's occupants have little chance of survival.

Add that to the fact that 4wds generally have worse braking distances and handling than the average sedan (particularly those with lift kits and heavily modified suspension) and you've got a recipe for a killing machine.

yes but this is meant to be about 4wd's in the city, not bullbars

[klaw81]

yes but this is meant to be about 4wd's in the city, not bullbars

True, but still relevant - collisions occur more often in cities, and at least one third of the 4wds in the city have bullbars (bling for your truck, y'all).

Bullbars COULD be built to be easily removable. Look at the system for removing towbars, which have some pretty hefty loads put on them. Remove a coupling pin or two and slide it off.

[CSP]

Bullbars are still technically ILLEGAL so god help anyone that ever hits me with one.

[xlr8_87]

Bullbars are still technically ILLEGAL so god help anyone that ever hits me with one.

interesting... have you got proof of the law?
not taking a stab, genuinely interested...

[naf33n]

Bullbars are still technically ILLEGAL so god help anyone that ever hits me with one.

im also interested in this comment. we had alot of trouble finding one to suit a VW that would pass ADR, be airbag complient and pass blue slip with the rta, and was fitted to a police car, im aware that technically there is alot it has to go through including crash tests etc.

so im struggling to see how that could possibly be illegal

[CSP]

There's a law something along the lines of "nothing to preject further than the original manufactued proportions of the vehicle".

Not 100% but also not taking a stab in the dark.

I remember there being some controversy given the fact that a bullbar can pass all the ADRs under the sun, but there is still some ancient law that technically, makes them illegal. Maybe it's just aftermarket ones or non-integrated ones. I think the integrated Holden/Ford ones (those butt ugly ones on a few sedans and wagons you sometimes see) are OK.

[FusionX]

Bullbars are still technically ILLEGAL so god help anyone that ever hits me with one.

They are perfectly legal in WA, as long as you met the requirements.

[MEANVY]

I've got a hilux with a bullbar fitted, havn't had a problem with anyone dying because of it because, bullbar or not, you drive to the conditions, not you drive all over the place because you have a ute and it's your right.
Are you guys on here serious about all these things your throwing around? 'oh well if someone gets hit and you have a bullbar on then they can't fly over your bonnet!'
What the hell guys?! Not everyone with a ute and a bullbar is automatically going to start driving up the gutter and hitting pedestrians.
All drivers have to be safe, not just 4x4 drivers!

[VSIIISU]

Lovely how topic changes so dramatically, maybe we should all drive tanks, and save people's lives.

[TVR-190]

wellif were gonna go on about how they are illegal due to some stupid old law, theres also a law that says Taxi's in qld must keep a bale of hay in the boot of the car

[CSP]

And the law in NSW that says a man waving a red flag must walk in front of every car!

[FusionX]

To quote the DPI website:

Bull bars
Bull bars are acceptable equipment provided they meet the following requirements :


A bar is to be adequately bolted to a main member or member bracket (e.g.. chassis rail or sub frame). Attachment by welding is only permitted if the structural integrity of the sub frame is not adversely effected.

It must be constructed of tubular section material and in such a manner that there are no narrow, sharp or protruding sections or jagged edges likely to increase the risk of bodily injury to a person

It must not obstruct the light path of any forward facing lamps

The bar must not project more than 300 mm forward of the vehicle’s head lamps, except where the construction of the vehicle makes this impractical

Licensing Services reserves the right to withdraw or amend the guidelines for modifications in this section. It should be understood that approval to carry out these modifications is conditional upon the owner using the vehicle in a safe and sensible manner.

Should any vehicle owner demonstrate irresponsible or consistently bad driving, Licensing Services may require that owner to return the vehicle to standard.

[nicko]

What valid excuse do you have for driving one of these big ugly beasts in the city? I said VALID excuse. None.

At least trucks, vans, buses have a purpose and the drivers of such vehicles are licensed accordingly.

Licensed accordingly? Some yes but not all. heck i had my p plates for about 3 weeks and was driving 3 tonnes around in a van. Also many buses can be driven on a normal licence mate. Anything you can do in a van can be done with a car and trailer so why not ban vans on the roads.

You crack me up because your so one eyed with your arguments that you fail to see simple answers like that.

I understand i have no valid reason to have a bullbar fitted to my car but so long as im within the law i dont need to have a reason. No NEED to lower your car but people do it, no need to fit blower to your car but people do it. No NEED for lots of the guns in australia so lets ban guns so everyone but farmers and police.



Cousin Slow poke if that law your talking about is true that nothing must protrude from the front of your car is true then is fitting an after market numberplate protector or kangaroo whistles that arent supplied by the manufacturer illegal by definition? It extends from the car doesnt it? I no its a petty argument but unless the law says BULLBAR i doubt you will get anything out of it.