Welcome to Just Commodores, a site specifically designed for all people who share the same passion as yourself.

New Posts Contact us

Just Commodores Forum Community

It takes just a moment to join our fantastic community

Register

VW Vs EPA drama ?

Grennan

Slayer of Stupid Threads
Joined
Mar 13, 2007
Messages
2,513
Reaction score
78
Points
0
Location
Glen Waverley, Victoria
Members Ride
VE SSV G8 Sportswagon
OK, this is getting bigger by the week.

Audi have now admitted that some of their vehicles are affected and Skoda must have been caught up in it too as they use so much VW architecture. Just how many vehicles will eventually be involved, even VW probably can't say for sure.

In Australia, the Golf had been increasing its market share steadily over recent years and has been in the top 10 for some time. I wonder what effect this issue will have on sales of new Golfs and other VW models, if any. And are Australian spec VW's affected?

The Australian Spec VWs are affected, last count was 450,000 or so. Its a global architecture rather than just a program set for the US.

With that being said. Our EPA laws probably wouldnt need the system in order to pass, so apart from the publicity part of it, there probably wont be any actions apart from those concerned owners who purchased the car based on environmental issues - aka Oh theres free cash, im totally green now.

Im honestly, pretty shocked, that rival manufacturers havent lined up with their hands out yet due to loss of sales based on what is now, flat out lies, about the combination of power, economy and emissions.
 

Noeleter

Active Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
819
Reaction score
120
Points
43
Location
Brisbane
Members Ride
VEII Equipe Sportwagon
That's the thing with any debate, find evidence to support your arguments. Scientific data is the same, you can find data to support your agenda if you only look at certain time frames.

VW manipulated their software to pass emissions testing in California. This was to pass the CARB's stringent standards so the car can be sold in California. One small market compared to the rest of the world. It meets standards just about everywhere else. I don't believe it's as much a conspiracy against VW as Skydrol seems to think, but I also don't think it's that big a deal. How many people here that argue "green" and are pro man made climate change have actually modified/tuned their cars?

A similar situation on a different scale. If you modify your car and it doesn't comply with emissions standards, you pay the price if you get caught. If you sell thousands of cars that don't comply you pay a bigger price. However, as far as global warming is concerned You tube is generally not considered a scientific journal!!!!!!!!!!
 

Not_An_Abba_Fan

Exhaust Guru
Joined
Aug 18, 2006
Messages
14,639
Reaction score
1,364
Points
113
Location
Bunbury, WA
Members Ride
Strange Rover
Im honestly, pretty shocked, that rival manufacturers havent lined up with their hands out yet due to loss of sales based on what is now, flat out lies, about the combination of power, economy and emissions.

Don't make any noise and they won't look at you.

Rival manufacturers are doing the same things. They won't make a fuss or they will be investigated too.

It's funny that the ICCT was actually doing a test in the real world to prove that diesel cars were greener. VW should have said don't do it, we know our cars a greener, shhhhh.

A similar situation on a different scale. If you modify your car and it doesn't comply with emissions standards, you pay the price if you get caught. If you sell thousands of cars that don't comply you pay a bigger price. However, as far as global warming is concerned You tube is generally not considered a scientific journal!!!!!!!!!!

It's not about compliance or getting caught, my point was how many people are berating VW but are doing the exact same thing?
 

Immortality

Can't live without smoky bacon!
Staff member
Joined
Apr 15, 2006
Messages
22,472
Reaction score
19,914
Points
113
Location
Sth Auck, NZ
Members Ride
HSV VS Senator, VX Calais II L67
Ok - for those who think VW did pass the emissions test legitimately - put simply they didn't. Temporarily changing operating parameters to pass a test and then resetting them for normal use does not in any shape or form constitute passing a test.

Bob Lutz on the subject: VW faces 'about the worst situation': Ex-GM exec

If this problem was found to be an inadvertent error this story would be over within a few weeks - VW cop a fine, recall/rectify the problem and move on, no bigee. The problem is that VW by design set out to deliberately and wilfully deceive and circumvent emissions standards which is a whole new ball game. Then there is a small matter of what to do with 11 million or so cars which it would appear the best minds in the rest of the auto industry can't figure out how to get their claimed performance & emissions all in the 1 package. In truth I'd suspect most owners wouldn't care about the emissions bit however dangle the carrot of potential compensation (aka free money) and I'm tipping most will start caring very quickly.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/23/business/international/volkswagen-diesel-car-scandal.html?_r=0

One thing I've gotta say - there would have been many people involved in engineering the emissions and engine control systems for these cars and it's got me fkded how they managed to keep it quiet for such a long time.

I read an article that says people have known about this issue for a number of years but it has only now finally raised it's ugly head. Unfortunately I can't find the bloody article any more :(
 

Skydrol

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 4, 2013
Messages
1,043
Reaction score
10,916
Points
113
Location
USA
Members Ride
Pontiac G8 GT
No making this stuff up; just came on CNN (Cable News Network) that is a creditable news network from our Cable TV.

Why beef is the new SUV

Lexington, Texas (CNN)This is the story of a giant pile of beef.

Well, 1.27 pounds (0.58 kilos) of brisket, to be exact.

But before I get into the business of explaining where this meat came from, and why eating this stuff has a massive, unexpected effect on climate change, I feel the need to confess something: That huge slab of brisket, which came to me by way of Snow's BBQ, a delightful shack of a place out here in the heart of Texas beef country, easily was one of the most food-orgasm-y things I've tasted.

The phrase "OHMYGOD" dropped out of my mouth, involuntarily.

And I don't eat much meat.

A colleague of mine had a better line.

"I mean, f--- Al Gore, right?"

I write about climate change for a living and appreciate what the former U.S. vice president has done (or has tried to do, in his own wooden way) to raise awareness about what I consider to be one of the most critical issues facing the planet and people. But, in that moment, I had to laugh and agree with my co-worker.

Forget the climate.

This stuff was too good.

Here, take a look.

150924120843-01-two-degrees-beef-exlarge-169.jpg


Daniel Vaughn, BBQ editor at Texas Monthly, and the No.1 carnivore I know -- this is a man who has developed white bumps on his tongue, apparently from failing to eat nonmeat food groups -- helped me dissect the meal. Note the salt-and-pepper "bark" at the edge of the meat, the red tree rings where the smoke that cooks the beef, slowly, overnight, has left its artistic mark. The cloudlike strips of beef were so tender locals insist you peel them apart with your fingers, not a fork and knife.

Knowing the beef's backstory only adds to the experience.

The barbecue "pitmaster" at Snow's is 80-year-old Norma Frances Tomanetz. White hair, red apron. Everyone calls her "Tootsie." Tootsie's shift starts at 9 p.m. and ends the next day after about 600 pounds of beef have been served. Her recipe is simple: salt and pepper. And, in addition to working here -- again, at age 80 -- she also serves as a middle-school custodian, helps manage a cattle ranch and takes care of two sick family members. (They could use your prayers, by the way.)

Texas beef people are lovably tough.

You want to root for them.

But there's "an inconvenient truth" about beef consumption, too, as I would discover on a trip through the supply chain of that meal: Beef is awful for the climate.

Don't blame me alone for bearing the bad news. In a Facebook poll, thousands of you overwhelmingly voted for me to report on meat's contribution to climate change as part of CNN's Two° series. You commissioned this highly personal topic over more widely feared climate change bad guys such as coal, deforestation and car pollution.

Cattle and climate?

They're not often used in the same sentence.

But eating beef, as I'll explain, has come to be seen, rightly, in certain enviro circles, as the new SUV -- a hopelessly selfish, American indulgence; a middle finger to the planet. It's not the main driver of global warming -- that's burning fossil fuels for electricity, heat and transportation -- but it does contribute significantly.

Globally, 14.5% of all greenhouse gas pollution can be attributed to livestock, according to the U.N. Food and Agriculture Organization, the most reputable authority on this topic. And a huge hunk of the livestock industry's role -- 65% -- comes from raising beef and dairy cattle.
 

Not_An_Abba_Fan

Exhaust Guru
Joined
Aug 18, 2006
Messages
14,639
Reaction score
1,364
Points
113
Location
Bunbury, WA
Members Ride
Strange Rover
This isn't new.
 

VS 5.0

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2006
Messages
7,980
Reaction score
14,096
Points
113
Location
Perth WA
Members Ride
VE SSV Z Series M6
I'm hungry !!!!
 

Noeleter

Active Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2014
Messages
819
Reaction score
120
Points
43
Location
Brisbane
Members Ride
VEII Equipe Sportwagon
Sounds like a lot of bull!!!!
 
Joined
Oct 15, 2013
Messages
411
Reaction score
14
Points
0
Age
42
Location
Melbourne
Members Ride
ya mum!
Why VW? Fraud.

You have a very warped sense of what fraud is. VW have NOT committed fraud. I think you need to get a better understanding of what they did.

They were given a test to pass, they passed it. End of story. Why isn't anyone saying "the bloody test is the problem - it should be carried out in real world driving conditions rather than in wind tunnel/lab/testing facility". Some people say VW moved the goal posts. Some people say VW misled everyone. Some people say VW lied by saying they passed the test. Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. The goal posts weren't moved. VW played to the goal posts of the field they were on at the time. It's not misleading to make claims that are true. And it's not lying to say you pass a test (and then include a disclaimer that says "real world figures may vary" like everyone does).

I still congratulate VW for their engineering creativity. Passing a shitty test doesn't make you guilty of anything. Creating a shitty test and then crying foul because someone was able to pass it creatively just means you need a better test.

The world really needs to move on from this whole beat up nonsense.
 
Top