V6 stroker

[sircruisealotVS]

i need some help guys, after much deliberation ive decided im goin to stroke my V6 ecotec with C.O.M.E. racings stroker kit.
ive been lookin into it and researching it quite a bit for the last few months but there's some things i just cant seem to find out....so if anyone has done this to an ecotec or even just has some knowledge of this avenue of gaining power i would appreciate it heaps.
what im trying to find out, is what is recommended/neccessary when the ecotec is stroked out to 4.2L?
will i need new injectors? will the stock fuel pump be sufficient? will the stock trans and converter be up the punishment?
its questions like these i keep thinking of that have been stopping me from goin straight out and getting it done, as im not too sure how much money im goin to need for all this yet..and all the extras can really add up.
any help/info would be great.

[Boonz]

well a bigger converter would be advisable for getting more power to the ground, the injectors should be fine as its not exactly going to have extreme power differences, bigger throttle body possibly, cam, probably should look at getting a complete stage 2 trans-they are ready for just about any mods you can throw at it

im no expert tho im just thinking what is obvious

[sircruisealotVS]

thanks for the input mate....i have heard of the 4L60e being able to take pretty decent power and torque, thats why i was wondering whether it would be sweet to leave stock....i think my best bet if no one knows for sure is to try it out as it is and see if she takes it, if it goes on me then ill get something stronger.
anyone else with anything to say on this? the more info i can gather for my stroking project the better i can plan it out. not just for the questions ive asked either, if there's other things i should bare in mind then let me know.

[MBS206]

I've watched MANY 4L60E gearboxes be turned from 4speeds, to 2 speeds quite quickly (Without a single tool!) on relatively stock engines.
Alot of them can't handle the abuse, unless they're in VERY good nick.

It's advisable to keep the gearbox serviced ALOT (Prob every 5000 - 10 000KM) if you're going to abuse it whilst stock.
If it fails, go for a stage 2, or 3 kit (Stage 3 being fully manualised)

[HoZy]

I wouldnt waste the money stroking a 6, look into a 5l v8 conversion mate.

Cheers
MaT

[sircruisealotVS]

no offence mate but i dont want another v8 or a turbo or supercharged v6...
i want a stroked v6, for many reasons... something different to what everyone else has...better power to weight than a v8...more reliable than a turbo or supercharger, cheaper rego, and the real stinger..it's practically invisible (it looks just like any other stock v6) so the ol' insurance company doesnt have to know about it.
plus i dont care about "wasting" money on a car...if you look at it that way then everything most car enthusiasts do to their cars is a waste.

[jNINE]

Have to agree on the benefits of a 6 over an 8. We have both, a stroked V8 and a worked 6, and the 6 has all the benefits you mentioned, while the 8 sits there 99% of the time because of the cost to run the damn thing, and it's general unpleasentness to drive in city traffic and the nasty feeling you get parking it somewhere because it's so obviously un-stock. My (unstroked but worked) VR 6 puts out a healthy 207rhwp and will give your average 5L a run for it's money, but looks like every other white VR out there! I also changed insurance to Shannons when I changed the engine and they had no problems listing the engine mods on my policy and I pay a lower premium with higer agreed value than I did with RACQ.

[matts vncommo]

i hear the cost 2 do this the right way would b around the $10.000 or more

[HoZy]

Have to agree on the benefits of a 6 over an 8. We have both, a stroked V8 and a worked 6, and the 6 has all the benefits you mentioned, while the 8 sits there 99% of the time because of the cost to run the damn thing, and it's general unpleasentness to drive in city traffic and the nasty feeling you get parking it somewhere because it's so obviously un-stock. My (unstroked but worked) VR 6 puts out a healthy 207rhwp and will give your average 5L a run for it's money, but looks like every other white VR out there! I also changed insurance to Shannons when I changed the engine and they had no problems listing the engine mods on my policy and I pay a lower premium with higer agreed value than I did with RACQ.

207rwhp is about 154rwkw, You sayin your rides quicker than every n/a 5l on this site?

Cheers
MaT

[jNINE]

207rwhp is about 154rwkw, You sayin your rides quicker than every n/a 5l on this site?

Cheers
MaT

In standard guise, quite possibly. I said it will 'give your average 5L a run for it's money'. A 5L has more torque and therefore may have the upper hand over longer distances, but the 6 being lighter will have a definate advantage over shorter distances.

But, depends on the circumstances, and I just wanted to point out that a V8 is not the be-all and end-all!

[HoZy]

Never said a v8 was be all an end all but spend the same money on it and you get more bang for buck, that's all i was saying

Cheers
MaT

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Yes, but there is nothing better than hosing a v8 with a v6! Muhahahahaha. I love the look on v8 drivers faces when they get beaten by my v6 Torana, PRICELESS!

[hinterland]

I wouldnt waste the money stroking a 6, look into a 5l v8 conversion mate.

Cheers
MaT

rather a 6 any day better fuel- lighter- bang for bucks is higher-i defenetly wouldnt say waste of money.

[sircruisealotVS]

i hear the cost 2 do this the right way would b around the $10.000 or more

no way man..im in communication with C.O.M.E. at the moment, their sweet n/a stoker engine which has:
an acid diped block, all machining, honing, clearancing and balancing done...stroker spec cam grind, rollmaster timing gear, forged stroker crank, forged "l" beam conrods, cast pistons, aftermarket harmonic balancer (either romac or powerbond), rebuild ported heads with bronze valve guides, C.O.M.E's inhouse valve springs, plus all the other relivant parts (just too much to all write down) and their real time dyno tuning for that engine.
costs $7700, but thats if you get them to build the whole assembled engine for you (which im not planning on doing), so thats about the most you'd pay...freight is included in the cost.

[1991_Vn2nV]

A VS SS runs 0-100 in 7.34 seconds where as a completely stock 3.8litre VP runs 0-100 in 8.1 seconds with only 127kw. It doesnt take alot to shave off 0.8 seconds off a 0-100 run to be beating stock VS SS commodores.

The 3.8L V6 VN's and VP's will also beat any of the 80's V8's with ease, providing they're not a Brock or Walkinshaw of course and it will even give alot of the old GTS 350's a run for their money and throw in a few hundred dollars and u'll be beating all of the GTS 350's as well.

A V8 is gonna have more potential for maximum power of course, but most people dont want a pro drag car, just something thats quick enough for a few street drags that will shame jap crap turbo 4's and beat a stock V8. Plus there are all the advantages of cheaper insurance, petrol etc.

A V8 is not always better than a V6. Take a 122kw 5L VL and put it against a 127kw V6 VN and the guy in the VL will be getting a very good look at the rear of the VN, yet its only a 1 model difference.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

A V8 is not always better than a V6. Take a 122kw 5L VL and put it against a 127kw V6 VN and the guy in the VL will be getting a very good look at the rear of the VN, yet its only a 1 model difference.

You have to compare eggs with eggs! You are talking EFI versus Carby, EFI is a hell of a lot more advanced than a carby and in stock versus stock form a EFI car should go better than a carby car. And also the VL V8 was totally loaded with power robbing polution gear! If you want to see the difference from carby to injection all you have to do is look at a VN 5L to VL 5L same engine in the 2 cars except the VN has injection.

[1991_Vn2nV]

Fair enough. Whatever way you look at it, its personal preference. Each engine has its advantages. For an engine that you can pick up for $300 from most wreckers, the 3.8L Buick V6 has alot of advantages and the HEC (Holden Engine Company) 5.0L.

Technology is a whole different story too. I mean we're now at a stage where VN-VS engines are so outdate its not funny. From the V6 with the Alloytech 190 to the 6.0L Gen IV with 260kw. With the VE these power ratings are set to go up even further, with the Gen IV 6.0L in the current VZ's being 264kw out the crate, theres only room for improvement. Theres also statements on the GM website pointing to HSV getting the 6.4L variant of the Gen IV for their HSV's. Also, HSV says the GTS name will make a comeback with the VE series 2. If it follows suit of the last GTS which took the Corvette 300kw engine, the next GTS will be looking at the current 373kw 7.0L Gen IV in the new Corvette.

Can you say bye-bye Ford?

[HoZy]

Take a 122kw about 90rwkw 5L VL(carby) and put it against a 201kw 5L VN(EFI) about 150.2rwkw.
That's 60rwkw difference........ Show's how technologies changed.

Take a stock VN V6, EFI 93rwkw average. Take a stock VN V8, EFI 130-140rwkw average, Tweak the V8 a bit get 150-160rwkw with minimal money, Tweak the V6 a bit and get 110-120rwkw.

Stroke the V6 and get around 145-160rwkw
Stroke the V8 and get around 170-200rwkw

If your stroking a car you shouldnt worry about insurance/price of petrol. If you worry about petrol all the time buy a moped.

It's also cheaper to stroke a V8, More bang for buck than a 6...... A 6 is only good til your off your P's.....

Cheers
MaT

P.S- I know I own a V6, Wopdedoo, but I've grown up in a family of only 8's... I've always seen the light.... I just have to start in the shadows because of laws.....

[sircruisealotVS]

yeah yeah, ok...we've all gone and crapped on about pointless sh*t...without anyone really answering my questions (except boona who gave to the best of his knowledge)....its not a pissing contest to see who can quote power figures for engines and models that have nothing to do with the questions initially asked...i just wanted a bit of knowledge from anyone with more experience than me in setting an ecotec up for handling the stroker.
so any help back on the topic would be appreciated.

[1991_Vn2nV]

Take a 122kw about 90rwkw 5L VL(carby) and put it against a 201kw 5L VN(EFI) about 150.2rwkw.

Why 201kw? A stock VN has 165kw and around 123rwkw compared to 95rwkw for a series 2 VN. That is a difference of 28rwkw. Some of that is cancelled out in the extra 66kg that comes with the V8 weighs as well.

I was quoted $1600 for a 4.3L stroker kit here in adelaide from Bradey Cranks and thats good for around 187kw on a stock VN engine. Thats 22kw more than a stock 5.0L. & 187kw in a VN is plenty for 95% of the people here. But at the same time, dont get me wrong, I love V8's and my next car will definitely be a V8, but theres nothing wrong with a V6, especially a modded one.

[1991_Vn2nV]

Sorry sircruisealotVS for getting off topic on your thread.
Have you enquired to C.O.M.E. Racing about what is needed? Im sure they would know more than anyone? Also have you searched for some US companies on a stroker that could fit the Ecotec engine? They have a much larger customer base so generally they can sell theirs cheaper than what we pay here. There was a company developing a Billet crank for the buick 3.8l who i was talking to but that fell through, however they were still releasing other cranks for the buick engine guaranteed to handle 800hp+ or 1000hp+ or something. I'll have a look and give you their website in case you're interested, even if you're not they have info on their site about what is needed to handle the crank.

[HoZy]

187fwkw is only about 139rwkw... Better off gettin a SC14supercharger for about $400 and getting 138-145rwkw proven..
Just a suggestion.... And that's still less rwkw than a 5l with extractors & twin cat hi-flow exhaust which puts out as i said 201fwkw = 150.2rwkw And the 5l V8 will still have more torque.
All I'm saying is stroked V6's are rare for exactly that reason, I have only ever seen 2 in person. And they still struggled for more power than a v8 with breather mods and the torque was nothing compared to them... So yeh the SC14 supercharger for a few hundred might be a better alternative..
Cheers
Mat

[hinterland]

no way man..im in communication with C.O.M.E. at the moment, their sweet n/a stoker engine which has:
an acid diped block, all machining, honing, clearancing and balancing done...stroker spec cam grind, rollmaster timing gear, forged stroker crank, forged "l" beam conrods, cast pistons, aftermarket harmonic balancer (either romac or powerbond), rebuild ported heads with bronze valve guides, C.O.M.E's inhouse valve springs, plus all the other relivant parts (just too much to all write down) and their real time dyno tuning for that engine.
costs $7700, but thats if you get them to build the whole assembled engine for you (which im not planning on doing), so thats about the most you'd pay...freight is included in the cost.

that figure of 7700 is not a good job it might sound good but at the end of the day your only getting about 240 h/p i just spent a few dollars on v6 turbo not stroked including fuel exhaust bla bla bla and and still going hoping for 500h/p plus so it depends on your goals as to what advise your after.

[GMH-DVL]

if going for a ecotec stroker I (me, personally, i know everyone aint gunna like it...) would use super6 injectors, stock fuel pump till it dies lol, custom cam (the come stroker is good but could be improved on...talk to them, they do custom cams), larger primary extractors, single highflow cat, hipo 2.5 inch exhaust, larger throttle body, port matched manifold, if a vr/vs-super6 intake, possibly a mafless tune if i wasnt going to change anything again, then the driveline would need alot of attention rebuild box with steel gears (stronger than pressed alloy ones that are stock), S2 shift kit, lightened flywheel(xclutch or yella terra), trans cooler, larger converter(wouldnt recommened a dominator as they go funny with strokers, TCE have a better record (again my opinion)), balance tailshaft and rebuild diff with lsd and 3.7 gears. this is my plan and i am currently getting funds together, i have half of this done all i need is to complete the trans and buy the pre assembled motor from COME (only $4400). note when this is done it would be advisable to upgrade brakes too

[GMH-DVL]

sorry for got to get the COME S3 heads in that list they would be helpful lol