First Start Up

[mischa]

Will be starting my new engine on the weekend.

Ive had to put the dizzy in and had a good guess at the timing. Now I also have to run the cam in when I start the car so that means 20mins of 2000-3000rpm. Now is it ok to do this without the timing set right? I dont really want to leave it to idle while i set the timing.

[Darren_L]

you can static time the engine and get it very close.

ensure the distributor rotor button is lined up with #1
enable field service mode,
breaker bar on the front crank bolt, turn engine to 12 degrees BTDC, compression stroke on #1 cylinder.
hook a spark tester or earth a spark plug up to #1 ignition lead
Ignition on, twist distributor back and forward slowly until you see the spark tester/plug spark.
tighten up the distributor bolt and your base timing should be set to 12BTDC. Check it with the timing light once the engine has run for a while

I got mine spot on using this method

[Pub247]

dont forget to pack your oil pump number one tip for freash starts id be more worried about having oil pressure than running the cam in

[mischa]

Thanks, Ill have to do that once its in the car then. Right now ive just done it by eye lining it up. When you say field service mode is that the same as diagnostics mode?

Yeah pub ill be doing that to, cant run a cam in with no oil ive been told of two methods tho, one involes just turning the crank and the other filling it with oil before start up.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

The only way to ensure instant oil pressure on a Holden V8 is to pack the oil pump with grease or vasoline. Also fill the filter with oil before you screw it on and you won't have any dramas.

It's up to you whether you crank it over without the plugs in for a bit or just fire it straight into life. I prefer the fire it straight up method.

[DANNY8]

Apparently vasoline is better then grease coz it's petrolium based and breaks down straight away, where as the grease doesn't break down as good. I set my timing how Darren does his, altho mine have all been carby so I just put the balancer timing mark on 8-10 degrees with number 1 piston at tdc (compression stroke), then slot the dizzy in so the rotor button is lined up with number 1. Fires straight away providing nothing else is wrong lol.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Apparently vasoline is better then grease coz it's petrolium based and breaks down straight away, where as the grease doesn't break down as good.

Yeh, i use vaso, but if you don't have vaso and only have grease it will work fine.

[mischa]

I was just going to fill it up with oil via the pressure switch above the filter just before i start it. Was planing to crank tell i got pressure.

Next question. The two vacume hoses coming from the front of the manifold (stock EFI) to the rear. Small one goes to the fuel reg and the big one to the AC controls/vacume ball?

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Big one goes to the MAP sensor.

Do yourself a huge favor, pop the oil pump off, undo the cover plate and pack the gears with vasoline. Bolt it back on and not worry about getting oil pressure.

[mischa]

So the small one is for the fuel reg? Cool thanks.

Say on the cam instructions specificaly not to use grease. Say to prime thorugh the pressure switch.

Please note: 253 – 308 Holden engines - oil priming. Oil pumps on these engines can be
lazy to pick up oil from the sump on initial fire-up. The practice of filling the oil pump with
grease in an attempt to rectify this is not recommended. Fill oil pump and filter with oil.
The oil system can be primed thru the oil pressure switch hole with an oil can or pressure
primer.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Ahh well, it's always served me well (vasoline that is). Good luck getting oil pressure.

[mischa]

Yeah might aswell go with what it says there. After all if I do it all to there specs and somthing goes wrong I cant be blamed.

[Pub247]

yeah its funny that me personally id pack it with vasoline. I've also used new pumps that say the same thing not to pack them but they wont get oil pressure unless you do i dont think your going to be spinning it fast with starter to get oil pressure. Just pack it/prime it plug in a mechanical pressure gauge fire her up and if it doesnt get oil pressure within 30seconds at the most shut it off

[Blown V6 Hatch]

yeah its funny that me personally id pack it with vasoline. I've also used new pumps that say the same thing not to pack them but they wont get oil pressure unless you do i dont think your going to be spinning it fast with starter to get oil pressure. Just pack it/prime it plug in a mechanical pressure gauge fire her up and if it doesnt get oil pressure within 30seconds at the most shut it off

Exactly. I've never had any success getting oil pressure with a Holden V8, unless i pack the pump with vaseline. Also agree with not cranking it on the starter, turn the key and fire it up. If the pump is packed and the filter it primed, it will get oil pressure as soon as it fires.

[ari666]

last time i changed a pump i had to pop down to safeway with filthy hands to get a jar of vasalene. check out chick had a bit of a LOL. i think i blushed.

[mischa]

Thanks guys, I think ill try the vaso then.

Got a even bigger problem now. The flywheel dosent fit on the crank!

I measured the crank spigot to be 63.3mm where is the flywheel is 63mm. Not a big problem I can get that machined out. But the PCD of the bolts are different to! The Cranks PCD is 92.6mm/3.6" and the flywheel is 91.15mm/3.59".

Can anyone tell me what flywheel i need for the crank or what pattern it is?

[Blown V6 Hatch]

What crank is in it? Do you know?

It should fit, but remember that the holes on the crank flange and flywheel are not evenly spaced. So measuring the PCD isn't really valid as all the holes are in different spots. This is so the flywheel can only go on 1 way.

As for the spigot, the only way that could be possible to fix it (apart from getting someone to bore out the flywheel slightly in a lathe) is to run some emery paper around the crank spigot and the flywheel bore until it fits. It will be a bit time consuming but it will probably do the job.

[ari666]

um, i think you may find that the holes are offset, so by spinning the flywheel round eventually all the holes will line up.

at least i think so. i havnt heard of different flywheels between holdens b4.

[mischa]

Ahh forgot about the offset when measuring. But still when putting the flywheel up to the crank lining up all the holes I can only get one bolt in because it then pulls the whole flywheel off center.

Ill have a go with the paper. I was going to take it somwhere to get the center machined 0.3mm out but if they do that and it dosent work ive stuffed a flywheel!

Once again thanks guys. Im off to put the fuel tank in, worry about this tomorrow.

BTW im pretty sure its a eagle crank.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Ahh, Eagle crank explains it. We've had the same problem with an Eagle crank, all we did was spin the flywheel up in the lathe and just take a little bit out of the bore. The bolt holes all lined up though without any problems. Hope the crank doesn't break on you...

[immortality]

spigot bush is a interference fit so should be a touch bigger then the hole in the end of the crank. chuck it in the deep freezer for a few days before fitting and it will go in easier

eagle crank, yuk

[Blown V6 Hatch]

spigot bush is a interference fit so should be a touch bigger then the hole in the end of the crank. chuck it in the deep freezer for a few days before fitting and it will go in easier

eagle crank, yuk

He's talking about the flywheel bore onto the crank spigot. Not the spigot bush into the crank.

[mischa]

Altho the spigot bush just sits in the crank. Easly movable by hand.

Ill take the extra off it and see how I go. Not my choice in crank, came with the engine.

[mischa]

you can static time the engine and get it very close.

ensure the distributor rotor button is lined up with #1
enable field service mode,
breaker bar on the front crank bolt, turn engine to 12 degrees BTDC, compression stroke on #1 cylinder.
hook a spark tester or earth a spark plug up to #1 ignition lead
Ignition on, twist distributor back and forward slowly until you see the spark tester/plug spark.
tighten up the distributor bolt and your base timing should be set to 12BTDC. Check it with the timing light once the engine has run for a while

I got mine spot on using this method

Ok, done this. All thats happaning tho is the fuel pump relay is clicking. No spark tho.

[Blown V6 Hatch]

Well, obviously the first thing to do is find the reason for having no spark.