Some power, but not much

[Penrod]

There is a problem im having now with my EFI VK, I have very little power going to the starter. I tested the battery, and have plenty of power there, but when i turn on the ignition the volt meter on the dash reads only about 8 volts. It used to read 11 or so. At first i felt it was just the battery had droped a cell, but my new battery was the exact same.

I have read before that the ignition barrel in the steering colunm can break down, is it posible there cound be a short in there? Causing stray power? I alredy checked that no wires had fallen off, and there are no other shorts or malfuctions that i can detect.

Is this somthing that anyone has discovered before? I'm alittle stumed by it.

[Matt0]

If you can, get a 2-3 metre jumper lead with small crocodile clips on each end. 10 amp cable is enough. Connect it to the starter motor solenoid (hot wire it) and turn the ignition on until the dash lights show. Next have a mate connect it to the positive battery terminal whilst you are in the car. The car will start. Compare readings from before. Are the results the same? This is the way I would do it as you know what to try next. If the results are the same then you know it isn't the ignition circuit or the barrel etc.

[Matt0]

I also should mention not to rely too much on dash volt guages as there is voltage drop and especially in older cars where wiring might have been butchered about. Test the battery directly with a volt meter or multi meter. Results would be much different and more trusting.

[Penrod]

Matto wrote>

If you can, get a 2-3 metre jumper lead with small crocodile clips on each end. 10 amp cable is enough. Connect it to the starter motor solenoid (hot wire it) and turn the ignition on until the dash lights show.

Yep worked. It started as good as ever.

Also i tested the old battery with my multimeter, it was reading only 6 volts now, and was completly dead flat. There might be a fairly serious kind of short in there. Is there anything comon that goes wrong on these, that you'd recomend i look to first? I was going to start with the wires in the steering column.

[Matt0]

Good stuff

Next step, alternator regulator! From experience, it sounds like a faulty alternator is killing your battery. I had a customer who had noticed their volt guage peaking to 16 for a bit and then lowering to normal, around 13-14 volt. Basically it turned out to be a cactus volatge regulator (also a brush assembly on Bosch alternators) which caused the battery to be virtually cooked and I mean cooked. He couldn't start his car one day and the RAC was around and inspected the battery cells. There was virtually no electrolite in the cells. Battery killed. New battery and a change over alternator fixed all the problems.

With your car running and the multimeter connected, run it for 5 minutes looking at the multimeter. The voltage range should not drop below 13.4 and not above 14.4. If you see it peaking at any stage above say 15v, then your voltage regulator is stuffed. Simply take the alternator to a parts place and show them the brush assembly and get a new set. About $45. Or if you can't do this, an auto electrician will charge you $130 plus $40 labour.

Check the cells of the old battery to see if they contain acid.

[Penrod]

I apologise for being so slack in getting back. I have literaly renewed or replaced everything on this car. I am now growing rather tired of it.

I found that, the safty switch on the gear selector was full of dirt and crud. I cleaned it out, tested the circuit, and found everything was working. Problem solvered. Or not.
Would running the engine for a short with a faulty voltage regulator (if that is the problem) cause any harm to the new battery i used? Yesterday, i ran the car without any trouble. Again this morming, but this afternoon it was the same as before. I never used it i just ran it for a time then shut it off. I have a feeling there might be an intermitent fault in the started motor, because now i cant even hot wire onto the starter.

Thanks for your help and ideas.

[Matt0]

Get your battery tested. Just because it reads 12v doesn't mean that it's ok. If an alternator regulator fails, it can peak and if it does then it starts to cook the battery and burn some acid but also makes your headlights brighter too and shortens their life but don't worry about the bulbs for now. I would check the charge coming from the alternator. I would check the voltage at the alternator for 2 minutes and see if it peaks or dies a great amount.

You said your car ends up the same as before. What does it do? Does it just drive along and then cut out? How long would the motor run before it dies? Is your car on gas?

I would rule out injectors and possibly ECU. As for the starter motor, it either turns when the solenoid is engaged meaning when the solenoid wire gets 12v or it doesn't or starts clicking. Gah the dreaded click but that can happen when the battery is stuffed or the starter is stuffed. Another thing to look at is your ignition coil. Is it the original one? Maybe if it is it could have ended up like two recent ones I got where the windings were shorting but check that after everything else.

mmmm what else. Not much left apart from some wiring. Throttle body shouldn't cut out but the position sensor might be weird but you should be able to start the car even if it is going dead. See how you go.

[Penrod]

You said your car ends up the same as before. What does it do? Does it just drive along and then cut out? How long would the motor run before it dies? Is your car on gas?

Yes. I got home one afternoon, turned off me car, went to start it in the morning and nothing. I got a slight click then nothing. I swaped the battery, and it was still the same. I "hot wired" onto the starter, and that worked. I cleaned the contacts in the neutral switch, tryed the key and it worked.

I started the car, ran it for a short time, then turned it off and rode me bike to work. That night, after it had not been used, the battery was dead flat again.

I removed the starter, and tested it with jumper leads off the same battery, not power to turn the starter, just the throw out. But the starter works off of a known good battery. The alternator is less than 1 year old so it should be delivering alot of power, i guess i might be posible that i could "cook" the other battery after just a short amount of time.

I will send the starter and the alternator into the local auto elecs and get then tested on monday, just to be sure.

Im pretty sure the problem is in the battery, the starter, or the key operated swich in the steering column. When the starter turns the engine just starts, no problem. There are no wires in the car that could short and flaten 2 batterys, without completely burning off. I will know more after i have the alt and starter checked.

[Matt0]

The VK's didn't come with a relay for the starter circuit to the starter motor solenoid. Have a look if you can find one put in. The associated wiring to the solenoid switch might be the source of the problem. I have repaired a VK's starter circuit wiring before and it was amazing it could ever start in the first place. Part of its wiring was melted down and ended up hanging in the engine bay like a piece of fuse wire. As for the alternator, I recently replaced a alternator with a reco one and within 6 months, the regulator packed up and I had to replace it.

[Rossco]

Had similar problems with a VK Calais a while back. Worked sometimes and not others. I had a relay put in for the starter and problem fixed. The dizzy works off the same circuit and the new high performance one I put in wanted the full 12 volts, not the 9 volts that the stock one was being fed.