Starting problems VL manual

[Holdfast]

Wrong thread before.

I’m having problems starting my manual VL in the morning and when she cools down.

This is what happens:

She turns over and nearly starts but won’t, sometimes there’s like delayed ignition (pre ignition). So I roll her down the hill and clutch start. No problems at all and I go screaming off. She runs like a charm, no missing or anything like that.

If I run her until operating temp I can turn her off and then she’ll restart but if she cools down then no way will she start.

I’ve left her sometimes so that the bonnet gets all the afternoon sun and she will start.

Here’s what I’ve done:

Replaced the battery

Replaced the Power Transistor

Replaced the Fuel filter.

Replaced the Coolant Temperature Sensor.

I’ve checked the codes on the control module but they seem ok.


Now I’m asking for some guidance because I just don’t know what to do.

Regards Holdfast

[rattattack1313]

sounds like a bugger of a hassle mate..I woulda said the battery, straight off.....but if you have already replaced that...the battery leads are ok???

[Bax]

Dodgy starter?

It's harder to turnover a cold engine, because its cold... lol- It might be struggling a bit?

[Holdfast]

Yeah, it's struggling ok. I'm sick of clutch starting down the hill.

The neighbours must think I'm nuts.

I'm stumped on this one.

Well if you think of anything between laughs please drop a note:-) lol

Regards Holdfast

[Holdfast]

Well, the old VL just cooled down again and she aint goin so it's down the hill and clutch startin.

Spose we we go out on the wallop my mates can push

[Holdfast]

spose the next thing to do would be a timin light but surely it must be fuel?

What about the catalytic converter would that do anything to stuff it.

[Bucket]

im leaning towards bextor here, if she starts by clutch, you are really only cutting out the starter, does it kick over like a flattish battery some times, slowly? . . . Go to an auto elec buddy, VL's are an auto elec's best friend.

[Holdfast]

Thanks Bucket!

I put a reconditioned starter in about 2 months ago.

But if that were the problem why would it strat no worrries when it's warm.

I can run the car for 10 minutes and then it will start first time every time until it gets cold

[Bax]

Because when the cars warm everythings lubed, the oils not as thick, everythings alot easier to crank so to speak. The only things I can think of really are battery/ spark, and starter.

I could be very wrong, but if it starts when warm, makes me think starter even more. Just because its easier to start.

[harry3]

the way my nissan 6 likes to be started from cold is turn on ign and wait until the fuel pump stops pumping, then work starter motor briefly without touching the accelerator and it starts first time every time

[Holdfast]

Gee, I'm a dunce

Here I anm talking about the starter motor and I'm thinking alternator.

The starter motor has never been replaced

Do you think I should buy a newy or just get a reconditioned one or get the NRMA out to confirm what's wrong.

[Holdfast]

Just put a starter motor in only cost $45 from the wreckers. At least she starts up.

Now I'll just have to wait and see if sheel start up when cold

here's hoping :-)

[Bax]

Hopefully she's all good for you mate.

[Holdfast]

Disappointment

Well, the starter motor cramks no worries but she won't start.

Sort of nearly does but just seems to be starving for fuel or something.

Damn! :b:

I also noticed that after about 6 attempts at cranking ahe would have a bit of pre-ignition. What could cause this?

Anyway, if you have any more ideas I'd be greatful

Regards Holdfast

[Holdfast]

Do you think the timing could be out?

[vlrad]

maybe high tension leads
Sounds like the leads and dizzy connection could do with a WD clean up. I had a car that had not started for 6 months and it would crank preignite/fart backwards and would then start. Once I got it started the spark appearred. On cranking the spark was weak because the started was using lots of current. I changed the coil to a really good one and after that it started.

[vlrad]

Maybe fuel return is not airtight
If the return to the tank is not airtight then air could maybe jet into the lines overnight. In morning would have aerated fuel being pumped in - like sucking air throgh a straw. After the air cleared then the fuel pressure would be right.

[vlrad]

If timing is advance
You would notice because you have heaps of acceleration and the motor takes long time to comeback in revs
If you have to much then the car will start after you depress the accelerator. This is because the timing retards a little. So when you go for the hill start - see if the car starts with you depressing the accelerator slowly.
Before moving the dizzy mark it - so you can return to your old setting if unhappy with results - I ran a ruler off the tongue on the side of the dizzy near the 12mm bolt and then marked a line in marker on the side of the tappet cover. This way I can put the dizzy back. My crank markings suck and I don't want to use this each time but have a simple reference on the side of the tappet cover.

IF you move the dizzy and problem still there then move the dizzy back as you may have two problems.

[vlrad]

Bypass the ignition switch and hot wire the solenoide to the starter.

I spent two days fixing starters and solenoids only to find my ignition barrel was not working.

[Bucket]

can you give me some more info on the problem, does the car crankover well when cold the same as hot or does it seem to crank slower.

Can you leave ignition on for 10 seconds next time she's cold and then crank, let me know and if it works, ill tell you what i think it might be, dont go ripping anything else out yet.

[Holdfast]

Yeah, well here's an update.

Got the NRMA bloke out to have a look.

He thumped the fuel pump like a rhino, did no good.

Then he reckon maybe I had no fuel, I did.

Then he squeezes the fuel,line to check I had pressure, yep pressure.

Then I explain about how I have to clutch start it to get it goin and all the parts I've replaced.

Then he chucks on the battery leads to see if it was battery probs. I have a new battery, so then he checks the dissy cap and rotor. Rotor is tight, cap is newish but he cleaned all the points.

he's a nice bloke and doin a great job so far.

Then he gets me crankin it over for a few more times and says it's tryin to run backwards.

He gets in and puts the foot on the throttle but she wont start, meanwhile I'm watch her cough and splutter and sh'e tryin to run backwards again.

Then he lightly touches the throttle abd she goes.

he reckons it could be the crank angle sensor but says take it to an auto elec and get it checked out on a computer.

As an after thought just now vl rad mentioned about the ignition barrell. Well last week it was sticking pretty bad so I bunged in some WD. As you push the key forward it wouldn't flick back as normal but now it's ok.

So that's all I've got for you fellas. I have a new spare Crank Angle sensor so do you reckon I should put it in or what?

[Holdfast]

Thanks vlrad and bucket for your latest comments and thanks everyone for your help so far.

Bucket, I've left the ignition on for over ten seconds until the fuel pump has stopped that noise.


The cold crank is the same as the hot crank except that when she's been running for awhile (reached operating temp)and I turn her off she'll start again no worries.

it's only when she's cooled right down that I can't start her again

Cheers Holdfast

[Holdfast]

She still wont kick over :b:

She nearly does but just doesn't get there

[vlrad]

WD40 and wriggle the airflow meter connector - make sure it's on properly -- I say this because my car won't start today and the airflow plug was not connected properly.

The other thing is the dizzy cap I'm using is a little corroded.

The other thing is that I changed a few components and have forgot to erase memory on computer.

Over the last few months - I should have printed the advice out and gone and done the tests on the car - instead I read and read and thought and thought and didn't keep at the car.

For example I checked the timing - it was 2.3 notches advanced at 700rpm - I thought yep this works and went on to drop the tank (why cause it had to be something else I thought) I should have asked myself what is the timing meant to do with revs. Answer advance with revs. If I had used the timing light when I was having trouble with ignition then I could have seen that the timing was retarding due to the crap black (instead of silver) crank angle sensor.

If my engine wouldn't crank then I would ask myself is the coil getting the charge it needs when the starter is being turned. I would look the wiring diagram up and see what should be 12volts on the coil?? Then I would measure it with the car running and then when the engine was cold. I would then think - maybe the power transistor and/or the coil are not bolted cleanly to the engine. Since this is a big heat area on the engine maybe when the engine is hot the transistor earths a bit better.

[vlrad]

read all the postings in your thread - I think you could remove airfilter to see if you are choking the air supply off. Only keep airfilter out for test - put back in asap as dust will root your engine.

When the engine first starts is there a little bit of vapour coming from the exhaust?