Regassing VL

[nvs_sle]

Orright i really know nothing when it comes to aircons apart from the fact they keep you cool and u dont realllly need them....
i got a vl which is in need of a regas and was wondering how much it costs.....ive been told its around 120, but i just wanna know for sure!
cheers

[andyman]

i think they have to drain the compressor and regas it with the new type? or something like that. the old type gas isnt green house friendly or something

[Christina]

im after the same question with my vt!

[Trevor 062]

From memory when I had my VL regassed they had to change the condensor or something similar so it would suit the new type 134a gas...So it might be a bit more than the $120

[andyman]

suit the new type 134a

is it 134a or is it r34a

[Trevor 062]

Actually R134a

[5ltvsstaty]

hey guys as someone who does air con as a sideline to my work i can tell you the only change to the system when going from r12 (old) to r134a or similar (new) is the change of gas a change of condensor is not req but if it hasen'
t been changed for a while a new reciever drier is on the cards (anything from $20 to 120) however most of the late model stuff dont run then but about $100 to $120 for the gas and service

[commsirac]

hey guys as someone who does air con as a sideline to my work i can tell you the only change to the system when going from r12 (old) to r134a or similar (new) is the change of gas a change of condensor is not req but if it hasen'
t been changed for a while a new reciever drier is on the cards (anything from $20 to 120) however most of the late model stuff dont run then but about $100 to $120 for the gas and service

This is typical of the aircon business in this country, most places that service ac do it as a sideline and have no idea!

There is no system that will work as well that was designed for r12(the old stuff), when r134a is put into it.
Some may deliver adequate but reduced performance, some may not and changes to tx valve and condensor, condensor cooling and even compressor may be required to bring the system up to acceptable levels.

[commsirac]

i think they have to drain the compressor and regas it with the new type? or something like that. the old type gas isnt green house friendly or something

The new gas aint greenhouse friendly, that's why there are strict licencing laws about its use and recovery.

The old gas r12 or freon, was phased out because it is a cfc(chorofluorcarbon) and is responsible for degradation of the ozone layer.

The VL in question. Is it running the original r12, possibly not, most places stoppped regassing with it at least a dozen years ago. Look for any stickers indicating what it may have been regassed with.

[5ltvsstaty]

yes its a sideline coz where i work i dont get enough of em to see me through the year but when you can get air out of the vents at down to 1 - 2 deg c i think that is pretty good and so do the guys and gals that spend anything up to 14 hrs in the cab on days up to 40 deg i have not had any complaints so i think i might have some idea. We cant all be experts but we can be damn good at what we do

[commsirac]

yes its a sideline coz where i work i dont get enough of em to see me through the year but when you can get air out of the vents at down to 1 - 2 deg c i think that is pretty good and so do the guys and gals that spend anything up to 14 hrs in the cab on days up to 40 deg i have not had any complaints so i think i might have some idea. We cant all be experts but we can be damn good at what we do

Sorry, if I came on a bit strong there. Vent temps of 1-2C? not on new commodores, they are designed not to do that.

Anyway, if you are interested in improving your knowledge/diagnostic ability, suggest you visit Automotive AC Information Forum - ACKITS.COM

I was frustrated with the lack of expertise available in Melbourne in solving an ac problem I had and went searching on the net. The ^ was the best forum I found(not that they solved the problem......had to nut that out myself), if you follow through all the threads where people have problems, then you will learn a lot than just the couple of dozen cars a year you may work on that dont display any specific difficulties.

[Nevyn]

I wanted to get the VN regased, even thou the missus complains the car is like a ice box when I turn it on, but I want to fit the climate control box.....was told $120 if it was a straight regas and service, but if it still had the old gas then they would need to change the O rings and all up it would be $220-240....in my area there are some places, like natrad for 1, that won't even look at doing it unless it already has the newer gas, but thats because they don't have the equipment to remove and store the old gas.

[5ltvsstaty]

apology accepted and i will have a look at the forum as we can all learn from others dont tend to do a lot of cars but do do a lot of heavy equipment.The current systems should pull down to 3-4 C no problems at all tyhe best of the lot used to be the old undert dash units did one recently in a valiant that pulled down to -1 thought i must have broken thermometer customer very happy tho he has it ducted into glovebox to cool; his beveridges !! Just a hint if you want your a/c to gas up at its best get it done on a hot day. I also use a gas called hychill it is a propane based gas with lots of advantages 1/3 the normal quantity, lower pressures, enviro safe, better cooling, and even if you get a leak in the cabin the quantity is so small it is not dangerous no risk of explosion or fire and at least you can smell it not like some.

[commsirac]

apology accepted and i will have a look at the forum as we can all learn from others dont tend to do a lot of cars but do do a lot of heavy equipment.The current systems should pull down to 3-4 C no problems at all tyhe best of the lot used to be the old undert dash units did one recently in a valiant that pulled down to -1 thought i must have broken thermometer customer very happy tho he has it ducted into glovebox to cool; his beveridges !! Just a hint if you want your a/c to gas up at its best get it done on a hot day. I also use a gas called hychill it is a propane based gas with lots of advantages 1/3 the normal quantity, lower pressures, enviro safe, better cooling, and even if you get a leak in the cabin the quantity is so small it is not dangerous no risk of explosion or fire and at least you can smell it not like some.

Im familiar with hychill, it can work as a drop in replacement for r12, but it wont work properly in older vir systems(most in the industry now wouldnt know a vir if they fell over one, let alone how it is supposed to work). I use it in one of my older vehicles that has an underdash system with tx valve. The great advantage of it is that it is cheap and no licence is needed to buy it. There are problems suppliers of reman compressors wont warranty them if hydrocarbon refrigerants(like hychill) are used
Technically though, if the whole system manages to escape via a hole in the evaporator into the cabin, there may indeed be a high enough concentration for an explosion. What probably is of more concern is a sudden release where an ignition source is present and a flame can shoot out under pressure. But I think the probability of it happening is remote. I thinks its use is forbidden in one state in the this country. Basically its the what ifs that have stopped it being adopted mainstream.

In climate control systems, they deliberately dont wont them to get down to 1-2C, there is just too much risk of actually getting droplets of water out the vents......which will collect dirt and deposit themselves on that nice new white evening gown.

[vlv8vic]

approx $200 i believe it is at the mo to get it changed over and re-filled. getting the Merc done soon.

[elemeNtz]

I'd say $200 for change & refill. in Adelaide there was a special at an independent auto shop for $180 last summer if i remember correctly

[commsirac]

$200 ouch. Its really only requires 10 minutes labour and about $20 of gas.
and of course the shop has to have the capital investment of the equipment.

Shop around if its just for a regas.

[ianf]

Depends on who you know and where you go I guess?, but I got my VS regassed this time last year for $50 at a wrecker come repairers place???

[Nevyn]

Depends on who you know and where you go I guess?, but I got my VS regassed this time last year for $50 at a wrecker come repairers place???

and where do u live?

[vlv8vic]

$200 ouch. Its really only requires 10 minutes labour and about $20 of gas.
and of course the shop has to have the capital investment of the equipment.

Shop around if its just for a regas.

yeah it is, i had a chat to an auto-elec the other day who will do mine (family so he can drop the technician fee) - the breakdown was something like this:

new gas $40ish
new rings or plugs or something less than $20
Removal and disposal of old gas $70
Tech fee $80 odd.

Obviously approximates but it was ditching the old gas that was the problem. I wonder if one were to accidently open the gas and it accidently escaped would that part of the fee be waived. Then they'd probably have the EPA up your arse burning off methane. (and rightfully so i suppose...)

[commsirac]

Obviously approximates but it was ditching the old gas that was the problem. I wonder if one were to accidently open the gas and it accidently escaped would that part of the fee be waived. Then they'd probably have the EPA up your arse burning off methane. (and rightfully so i suppose...)

Is this a pre 1994 vehicle? Original gas in these was r12, which does take extra trouble to recover(a separate container anyway)......supposedly there is good money for the recovered r12.
If its $70 for recovering the current r134a gas, then that is questionable.
Yes, there are big fines for letting the gas into the atmosphere, even if you let it out yourself, they still have to suck out what is left and dispose of it in the correct container.
Its really quite silly that they are so keen on recovering the remaining gas as if you are needing a regas then close to half of it has already leaked out anyway . If the concern is that big, they should be banning the gas for use in cars.....as car systems eventually leak it all out. I think possibly the threat from the gas is considerable, just they havent found a suitable alternative yet and dont want to annoy the public by banning ac on cars.

[Nevyn]

I didn't think the r134a gas was harmful to the atmosphere, just the r12, hence the reason for banning it.

[vlv8vic]

Yeah mine well and truly pre-94 as is OP's VL i think he's talking about. It's a pain in the arse really but i guess that's life.

[commsirac]

I didn't think the r134a gas was harmful to the atmosphere, just the r12, hence the reason for banning it.

You could look all this up on google.....but to save you the trouble.

R12 was deemed back in the 80s to be a primary cause of depletion of the ozone layer. Hence it was phased out, the depletion of the ozone layer has slowed, but not stopped. The ozone attacking molecule doesnt die and will continue to destroy ozone for ever.

R134a was developed as it appeared to not have as big an influence on ozone. What wasnt considered as important was its global warming potential, or infra red absorption characteristics, even though the problems of global warming were becoming mainstream around this time. It is one of the worst global warming gasses out there. r134a is also a health threatening substance that humans should avoid being exposed to.

[Nevyn]

You could look all this up on google.....but to save you the trouble.

R12 was deemed back in the 80s to be a primary cause of depletion of the ozone layer. Hence it was phased out, the depletion of the ozone layer has slowed, but not stopped. The ozone attacking molecule doesnt die and will continue to destroy ozone for ever.

R134a was developed as it appeared to not have as big an influence on ozone. What wasnt considered as important was its global warming potential, or infra red absorption characteristics, even though the problems of global warming were becoming mainstream around this time. It is one of the worst global warming gasses out there. r134a is also a health threatening substance that humans should avoid being exposed to.

well thank u for saving me the trouble and filling me in...seriously