VN V6 MEMCAL Modification

[AntBoy1979]

Hi All.
Just joined up after sticky beaking the forum for a few weeks.
After an hour of browsing I was hooked, after a few days I was bitten awfully bloody hard by the bug that must be sneaking about this site! Now I own a 1989 VN V6 Berlina. LET THE FUN BEGIN!

Firstly, I'm looking at playing with eproms while I get money together to start tinkering mechanically. I'm most interested in setting up a dual program chip, SV3800 for daily driving and something more aggressive for digging trenches at the lights! I need to save for the programmer/emulator I want, so I have been playing with memcals and looking at info on moates about the 2 timer. I have made 2 self contained 2-timer memcals but have no way of testing them beyond a multimeter!

If some-one is interested in programming me an eprom with SV3800 and a burnout program I'll fling a 2-timer your way. it's fully self contained in the memcal, just a single blue wire hanging out. Just to make sure I got it right can some-one please confirm my wiring?

1/ Pin1 removed from memcal base
2/ 10K resistor soldered between pins 1 and 28 on 28pin socket
3/ wire from pin 1 on socket to ground through switch to activate second program
4/ solder socket into memcal base

Thanks for having me as a member and I look forward to learning a lot more from you all in the future, and also being a valuable contributing member myself.

P.S. I'm looking into making a self contained 4-timer next, feel free let me know if this has/can be done or just your thoughts on the matter.

[delcowizzid]

delcohacking.net • View topic - Eprom memory bank switching has everything you need to know to switch upto 4 bins on one chip .i send out the odd twin tune eprom with a resistor and switch wire attached to the eprom itself they work good just have to make sure you have the same base code on each half of the chip or it causes issues

[AntBoy1979]

Thanks delcowizzid, that was a great help.
Can I ask for your thoughts on good bins to use with a 4 bin switcher for my stock V6?
Thanks

[delcowizzid]

well if you have one good tuned bin it should be fine for all situations really the only time i could see a need for 2 is if its raining and you need some traction as its hard to pull into traffic when you get tuned on the edge

[AntBoy1979]

finished making the 4 bin switcher. I've been looking through custom bins, standard bins, HSV bins. I downloaded Tunerpro and had a look at some different bins using what I think were the appropriate XDF files, trying to compare differences between bins, some of it stands out and makes sense but the bulk of it might as well be written in Spanish. Is there anywhere to look for a dummed down explanation of what it all means?

[AntBoy1979]

well if you have one good tuned bin it should be fine for all situations really the only time i could see a need for 2 is if its raining and you need some traction as its hard to pull into traffic when you get tuned on the edge

The main reason for going with a 4 bin switcher is for on road bin comparison, it seems like a logical alternative to a real time emulation. It would also mean I could just buy a basic burner, which I could afford by next week instead of saving for a month!
The other reasons would be the wank factor and that I just enjoy tooling around with gadgets, seeing how they tick, pulling them apart and seeing how many different ways I can put it back together!

[greenfoam]

So long as you remember the difference between the SV3800 tune and the best one you can make for the V6 (on a car that is running correctly) will be about...... 4 rwkw on a good day, It's not going to be enough difference to dig a trench. I can't see the point in running two. No stock V6 can spin the wheels without brake anyway unless you have shonky tyres. Mine used to get to 60mph in under 7 seconds and it was wheelspin UNABLE 100% never

[AntBoy1979]

Willem programmer and 4 SST27SF512's on their way, YIPPEE!
Still researching the programming aspect of the 4 bin switcher.
delcowizzid, in the link you posted there seemed to be a bit of difference in opinions on switching between bins. Does grounding pin 27 go up or down a bank?

"QUOTE"

Re: Eprom memory bank switching

by delcowizzid » Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:03 pm
ok to switch 4 16kb bins on the 27C512 or 27SF512 which should be the same.you need to connect a second 4.7k or 10 resistor from vcc to address pin A14 and remove the pin from the pcb and a wire to a second switch or even a rotary switch would be easier and connect both pins to it instead of 2 switches and earth it as well as the other pin now you have upto 4 combinations of both switches on or off to choose what addresses in the eprom are output as shown below.

A15 = 0, A14 = 0; 0x0000 - 0x3FFF
A15 = 0, A14 = 1; 0x4000 - 0x7FFF
A15 = 1, A14 = 0; 0x8000 - 0xBFFF
A15 = 1, A14 = 1; 0xC000 - 0xFFFF



Re: Eprom memory bank switching

by VL400 » Fri Mar 20, 2009 9:39 am
The best way is a 4k7 or 10k resistor from VCC to pin 27 (Address Line 14). Then ground the pin 27 to select the lower address range, 0x0000 to 0x4000 - in terms of ECU memory mapping thats 0x8000 to 0xC000. Leave the pin open and you will get 0x4000 to 0x7FFF (0xC000 to 0xFFFF). Remove the pin from ECU, gives you control and not the ECU of what memory to select.

"END QUOTE"

[rob drag racer]

S. No stock V6 can spin the wheels without brake anyway unless you have shonky tyres. Mine used to get to 60mph in under 7 seconds and it was wheelspin UNABLE 100% never

yeh like mine on the vp race car (wouldn't bite traction until 3rd ) but dry old rubber will do that as well as huge weight reduction

[AntBoy1979]

Hi there greenfoam, thanks for the input. My VN has 170000 on the clock and was a one owner ( My Nanna! ) So it is barely run in. Have had it looked over, it still has the original shocks in good condition. If I tramp it at the lights most of the time it just launches, but every now and then it looses traction and squeals half way across the intersection. So I think I have a good base to work on for a bit of a performer.

Something I'd like to try is running an oxygen bottle. As a school kid in metal work, we were learning about the effects of oxygen, how it makes fire possible, it's % in the air etc. for a demo the teacher lit a lighter, the flame was 3/4 of an inch high, using an oxy set he applied oxygen to the lit lighter and the flame grew to nearly 2 inches. This gave my inquisitive little mind an idea, an idea that cost me a few straps across the arse! When I got home that afternoon, I was straight out to the shed, fired up Dad's brush cutter and at full throttle and the revs not going any higher I used his oxy set to squirt oxygen into the carby, The revs picked up fast, really fast! within no more than a second, ping ping ping BANG!

Some years after that experiment I learned that adding the oxygen alone leaned out the air/fuel ratio, had I adjusted the fuel as well I might have had a better result! I just had to try it again, this time on my own weed whacker, after adjusting the carby and adding a tube into the carby giving a gentle flow of oxygen, hey presto! My $99 piece of s*** whipper snipper had the balls to whack the shit out of the toughest of blackberry bushes without the revs dying off!

If I were to run an oxygen line and a fuel injector on it's own pump into the manifold, with a switch on the accelerator pedal controlling the pump and a solonoid on the oxygen line so it only activates at full throttle, would I need to alter the spark map dramatically? I'm not looking for a Nitrous boost equivelant, just feeding the engine some more oxygen rich air to burn the fuel hotter and more completely.

Comments would be greatly appreciated. Pro's, Con's?

[delcowizzid]

there are cons one you wont find a solinoid or injector made of heat resistant material that doesnt have grease or oil imprenated into it which brings us to con 2 pressurised O2 when it comes into contact with grease or oil goes BOOOOOM.

[AntBoy1979]

Your gonna love this one! How about a RCAI? ( Really Cold Ait Intake )
An intercooler style air con with a cowl on the back piped to the airbox?
Or would using it draw more power from the engine than power the colder/denser air would give it?

[AntBoy1979]

there are cons one you wont find a solinoid or injector made of heat resistant material that doesnt have grease or oil imprenated into it which brings us to con 2 pressurised O2 when it comes into contact with grease or oil goes BOOOOOM.

Hmmmm, OK. How about plumbing the oxygen into the airbox instead?

[rob drag racer]

the hole pressurized 02 idea was something i bought up to greenfoam a wile back another issue is leaning out as a result of not being able to balance the flow of o2

[delcowizzid]

if you want extra O2 NOS is the way to do it thats what it does produces oxygen

[AntBoy1979]

Yeah I know what nos does, is nos safe around grease and oil? Hence why they use it over pure oxygen? As nos is illegal for street use, I thought O2 might be a viable alternative, fed in pre air filter maybe? Is Oxygen bad news around grease regardless of whether it's in it's liquid or gaseous form?

[AntBoy1979]

Got my willem today, hooray! Still tooling around with the ARBP bin, learning more and more as I go, still don't know what about half of it all does, been spending every night after work till nearly 2am and all weekend for the past 2 weeks studying it and looking up terms and their meanings and what they do. Have been looking at the TCC with a bit of interest, how much torque can it take? was thinking about having it come on a lot earlier and staying on for more rapid speed increases going from a 60 zone into an 80 zone. but don't want to risk breaking it if it can't handle it.

[AntBoy1979]

just finished burning my first bin, It's just a straight copy of the basic performance mod tutorial by greenfoam, I really had to restrain myself from adjusting the TCC as well, will wait till I know more about it I think. It is absolutely PISSING down and the wind is cold as ice. I wish I had a garage, or at least a carport!

Is it safe to disconnect the ECM without pulling the fuses? I might wire a power switch for it in the glovebox next to where I plan on relocating the ECM. That way I can change chips quickly and easily without popping the hood or removing the kick board.

[AntBoy1979]

I'm back from my test drive with the new chip, drove for a few KM's then came back. stomped it at the lights on the way back expecting to spin a wheel, but nothing, just took off, a touch slower than before but the acceleration after 20kph seemed on par with before. The roads are wet at the moment so it was a bit surprising, with the stock ASBY in the wet it would wheelspin with heavy acceleration, I didn't have to stomp it! When I got home and parked it I was watching the tacho, every couple of seconds it would rise to 1000 then drop to 800, I got out and could smell half burnt fuel from the exhaust. I came in, sat down and went through the bin again, comparing it carefully with the greenfoam tutorial, a perfect match. Isn't it supposed to be "better than the average speedshop tune"?

[AntBoy1979]

Still playing with spark maps with varying success. changed the spark map on an ASBY to the "random performance" map posted by greenfoam, burnt it, ran it, stalls at idle. tried adjusting the fuel map several times, still stalls. GRRRR! this is some really fiddly shit! Is the spark map no good for a stock healthy s1 motor or something? No matter what I adjust, I can't get it to run any better than with a stock ASBY. I have been researching every night after work till 2am for weeks. I feel I have a reasonable understanding of the theory, but I just can't seem to make any progress with the practical application.

Any help or pointers on where I'm going wrong would be greatly appreciated guys, Thanks.

[greenfoam]

Keep playing with it and you'll make a gain, you'll just have to find out what your car likes since the crank senor setup vary quite a bit, some of the series 1's wont gain hardly at all (mine hardly did). You really need some way of timing the car gtech/drag strip because on the S1 V6 you probably only have .2 over a full 1/4 mile to gain

[AntBoy1979]

I've been playing with it, and playing with it, and am almost out of eproms. I'm still waiting for some eeproms to arrive, then I can shelve or bin the eproms. When you switch between bins with a 2 bin switcher do you need to bring the revs up for a reset or anything? I run a stock ASBY first then switch to a modified one, then it stalls! have tried holding the revs at 2000 while switching, sometimes the revs pick up, sometimes they drop. Have a few modified bins downloaded from here for comparisons, I'm intrigued by the foam_racing_crispy_95_octane.bin, some of the figures in the F1 table seem a bit outrageous! Why such a high advance? I was under the impression that anything higher than 28 did jack shit!

foam_racing_crispy_95_octane.bin
30.59 29.88 29.18 43.95 43.95 43.95 39.02 36.91 36.56 34.10 33.05
27.77 27.07 26.02 43.95 43.95 43.24 39.02 36.56 35.86 33.05 31.64
24.26 23.91 23.91 34.10 41.13 39.02 35.16 33.75 32.70 30.94 29.18
21.09 20.04 20.04 34.10 39.73 39.38 33.05 30.94 29.88 28.48 27.07
17.93 17.93 16.17 29.18 33.05 33.75 30.59 27.42 26.02 24.26 23.20
17.58 16.88 16.17 26.72 27.77 28.83 26.37 21.80 19.69 18.28 18.98
16.52 16.52 16.17 24.96 24.96 24.96 24.96 20.04 17.93 16.52 17.23
5.63 0.00 3.87 20.04 20.04 20.04 20.04 15.12 12.30 12.66 14.77
9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84
9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84 9.84
0.00 0.00 54.49 6.33 16.88 24.96 24.96 24.96 20.04 16.17 9.84
89.65 1.76 0.00 70.31 11.95 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00

Greenfoam, I'm not looking to prep my car for dragstrips. I'm more interested in the potential gains down low, off the mark and 0-60kph performance. It's a daily driver that never see's over 100kph, I just like to get to the speed limit quickly.

[centy]

Ok on the oxygen subject.
I ask some drag racers about useing owygen years ago, per injected beasts, and was told that they tried it but even with a little o2 over the quarter the heat increase was way to much to use it.
That is aside from the delivery problem.
Maybe if you want big boost for short periods maybe a dirvers air tank and regulator set to 2 or 3 atmospheres. THe tank won't hold much though and you will need to set up a 2 bar sensor and tune.

[rob drag racer]

might as well just do a supercharger or turbo if ya going to that extent

[greenfoam]

28 is about the limt on the early V6 most of the time _however_ since there is quite alot of variation in the base timing amoung them alot of them will go to 33 (especially with a good exhaust on them) and since the cars that peak at 28 only loose about 1hp at 33, then it's well worth trying 33 . You have to realise that tune was made in the stone age, 3 4 5 years ago?, when I knew not much more about it that you do now and while heaps of people run that tune, I still get messages now about it?! dunno how people find such old posts. Anyway I'm sure you can do alot better than whatever I said back then with some practice. I haven't used anything like that in years and years.

If you want to gain 0-100 in a V6 S1 then your best bet is good tyres a stall converter and some diff gears (and pull 100kilos out of it)