Steering Problem

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

I thought I would open this problem to the collective knowledge of the forum.

Vehicle: VN V6 sedan.
Problem: When turning left around a sweeping corner going about 30-40km/h the steering vibrates quite violently. But it doesn't do it every single time.

Parts replaced: Both rack ends, both tie rod ends, stabilizer link pins and bushes.

Vehicle has just had a wheel alignment done and it made no difference.

There is a bit of play in the rack itself, moving the wheel, it will move about 40-50mm before the you can see the wheel move. I have had racks with more play than this and didn't experience this problem.

There are a few things that I haven't checked yet, these being the radius rod bushes, lower ball joints and inner control arm bushes. It has 18" wheels set at 38psi. It sits on super lows.

[GTP 85]

could be lower ball joints. I had a similar problem in my VN, also after just having an alignment. Jacked up the front end, grabbed the wheels one at a time and shook them... would have been almost 2-3mm on slop on both sides!

alignment would have been all over the shop

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

I was leaning towards lower ball joints, particularly the LHS, as it only does it when turning left. The weight comes off that wheel so it would shake.

[88GreenVN]

How's the wheel bearings?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Sorry, forgot to add that they are new too. As are the rotors and pads.

[88GreenVN]

Sorry, forgot to add that they are new too. As are the rotors and pads.

is it like the shudder you get when the power steering oil is low?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

No.

If you can imagine a really fat person on a pushbike riding down stairs...that is how violently the steering wheel shakes.

[88GreenVN]

No.

If you can imagine a really fat person on a pushbike riding down stairs...that is how violently the steering wheel shakes.

And the wheel is firm when jacked up and you try and move it from side to side?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

It feels pretty good, a tiny bit of play in the wheel bearings. Like I said, I have yet to check the ball joints out properly.

[88GreenVN]

It feels pretty good, a tiny bit of play in the wheel bearings. Like I said, I have yet to check the ball joints out properly.

hmm if it was power steering pump it would do it in both directions.

Hows the strut top bearing?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

I'm not 100% on those, but I'm pretty sure they are OK.

[88GreenVN]

I'm not 100% on those, but I'm pretty sure they are OK.

with the front wheels off the ground - do they turn lock to lock freely?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Yes they do. The steering is very light as well, to me it feels too light but the missus says it's been like that since she has owned the car. The problem has only started in the last few months.

[GTP 85]

No.

If you can imagine a really fat person on a pushbike riding down stairs...that is how violently the steering wheel shakes.

was just trying to imagine that... haha. sounds pretty severe

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Yeah, it is.

I was going to check the ball joints and bushes last night but I didn't get a chance.

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Bit of an update, checked ball joints and lower control arm bushes, all good. The radius rod bushes are a bit cracked but don't really have a lot of movement.

To me, the alignment seems to be toeing out too far, I haven't adjusted it yet, but it was only done a couple of weeks ago.

The problem is actually getting worse. It will now vibrate as soon as you start to turn the wheel to the left to go around a slight bend even. I really doubt that it is a balance problem as it doesn't vibrate in a straight line.

[LordMayhem]

bent steering arm maybe?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

That was on my mind too actually.

I have a spare VN ....as most people do.... so my next step is to try swapping a few parts and see what happens.

[immortality]

balljoints are spring loaded to take out some of the play, you need to jack the car up and use a bar under the wheel to check em properly. if these are the original i'd say they need replacment.

wheel bearings. reset these with more preload. the bigger/wider the wheel the more load is placed on the bearings. when i went for 14" factory rims to 17" rims there was enough movement to allow the wheel to rub on the inside of the strut when cornering. increasing the preload fixed this (although i never had a vibration/shudder issue like you have)

when going around LH bend the RH wheel is actually under the most load.....

check the radius rod bushes. have a look inside the wheel well, especially towards the rear, if the radius rod bushes are worn enough the wheel will rub at the back of the wheel well at full lock. if these are the original bushes they are almost 100% shagged.

your wheel alignment guy really should have picked up any major issues before doing wheel alignment and adviced you repair before doing said wheel alignment because you basically wasted your money doing it before repair work. did you get a printout of the settings?

what are the shocks like?

just remember that if you can see movement/play in any part when manipulating by hand it will be 10x worse under actual driving conditions as you can never replicate the actual loads seen by hand

[savage1987]

If you can imagine a really fat person on a pushbike riding down stairs...that is how violently the steering wheel shakes.

LOL nice description

I am very interested to see what solution this weird problem has.

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

There is a bit of play in the wheel bearings, I will adjust them as soon as I get a chance and see if it improves.

[immortality]

any updates?

[dynoryder]

maby the radius rod bushes need replacing i have seen my boss show me ****ed ones on the pit he barkes on and off and the hole whell moves a good 1.1/2" maby 2" that is ive seen a few ones like that

tyers are another place to look

the lowerinners might be off the crushtube too this is common

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

No, not yet, I will try to adjust the bearings tonight if I get time.

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Adjusted both front wheel bearings last night. The missus tells me that on her way to work it has improved but the vibration is still there.

The next step is to change over the lower control arm from the spare car we have and see how that goes.