VN wont start

[stocky]

If anyone here knows about smokey_dj's car, you know that he has had trouble starting it, or keeping it running once it starts. The car takes about a minute of cranking until it finally starts, and after that it cuts out. Many sensors have been replaced, and the battery was charged. I have hooked up the ALDL cable to the car and have taken a readout when he attempts to start the car. if anyone can understand these charts, can you point out anything that could be causing the problem?

[SweetWagon]

sorry not related to your post, but i noticed Exhaust Gas Recirculation in that log, do series 2 buicks run an EGR? I know the Ecotecs do but do the buicks? cheers

[88GreenVN]

Not a lot of data to look at. You can see some good data on a VN thread "post your ALDL here thread"

The Car strugling to start or stay running - can be many things and if the main sensors have been changed it most likely can be fuel supply - blocked fuel filter or bad fuel pump. The CAS/DFI unit can be dicky or the ECU may be on the way out. Also check the injector wires as they can cut fuel supply..

Probabley be fuel supply/pressure. Can you hear the fuel pump when ingition on/off. Should pump for a few seconds after turned off.

[1vngal]

The white VN had the same problem to what you are describing. That wouldn't run, turn over and fire, but not actually run. Not for any longer than 3 or so seconds anyway.

We all ruled out a fuel problem as there was fuel getting to the motor, but it actually turned out to be the fuel pump. One swift kick on the tank, and away she went.

[smokey_dj]

ok heres whats been done tested.....

ecu new
dfi= 2nd hand was working at changeover
coil pack " " " " "
cas = new
oil pressure switch = new
map sensor = new

fuel pressure check = perfect
power draw to fuel pump = perfect
fuel pump 6-7 months old and running well (the right noises)
i have spark
i have all injectors firing

[1vngal]

ok heres whats been done tested.....

ecu new
dfi= 2nd hand was working at changeover
coil pack " " " " "
cas = new
oil pressure switch = new
map sensor = new

fuel pressure check = perfect
power draw to fuel pump = perfect
fuel pump 6-7 months old and running well (the right noises)
i have spark
i have all injectors firing

My fuel pump was only about 4 months old when it died/nearly died. And you could still hear it priming and stuff. Not saying it's definately your problem, but I just don't want you to rule it out as we did because every test that was run showed the fuel pump to be in perfect working order, and it turns out to be that. Just something to think about.

[VN_Luke]

why don't you find out why it's not starting and trace the problem?

if it's not starting, then check for injector pulse to see if it's there...
if you have injector pulse, and fuel pressure etc in the rail is fine, check to see if you have spark in each cylinder, make sure that the spark plugs aren't completely fowled with unburnt fuel from previous attempts to start it or something.....

i bet it's a dody wire somewhere, or something along those lines..... you need to analyse it properly to find it, rather than just replacing random parts and hoping you get lucky !

[14secvp]

My mates just had the same problem with his vn,garage checked it out found nothing.auto sparkys had it for four hours found nothing said maybe the ecu took it home cleaned the plugs and she was away again you would think the garage would of checked all the simple stuff but no what a waste of $300 at the sparkys.

[stocky]

turns out it was the coolant temp sensor

[88GreenVN]

turns out it was the coolant temp sensor

So the VN's back on the road.

Just for the record How did the coolant temp sensor stop it from starting?

My VN temp gauge stopped working for about 6 months and it was just the wire had come of the temp sensor. (The car never got hot in all the time I'd had the car) I closed the connector a bit and it worked fine after that.

If my car had no temp signal at all from the sensor.....

[smokey_dj]

lol im sure everybodies curious so heres the info

it was as stocky said the coolent temp senso infact it had absolutly fried
but get this for confusion
car was cutting out and dieing at 1/2 way up on the temp gauge
coolent temp sensor when checked by holden yesterday (ambiant temperature in melb was 28 degrees coolent temp sensor reading (-30 degrees)

and the fact it was burnt out was an earth leak from the ecu a wire had slightly frayed and sent continous earth to the sensor which over time fried the guts out of it

but heres the worst thing cars now doing some other strange things including...

intermmitant acceloration
speedo jumping everywhere
engine light on and off like a strobe

and the WORST thing about it is the ###n thing broke down again yesterday after holden claiming it as fixed and needed to be towed home YET AGAIN!!!!!!!

[88GreenVN]

lol im sure everybodies curious so heres the info

it was as stocky said the coolent temp senso infact it had absolutly fried
but get this for confusion
car was cutting out and dieing at 1/2 way up on the temp gauge
coolent temp sensor when checked by holden yesterday (ambiant temperature in melb was 28 degrees coolent temp sensor reading (-30 degrees)

and the fact it was burnt out was an earth leak from the ecu a wire had slightly frayed and sent continous earth to the sensor which over time fried the guts out of it

but heres the worst thing cars now doing some other strange things including...

intermmitant acceloration
speedo jumping everywhere
engine light on and off like a strobe

and the WORST thing about it is the ###n thing broke down again yesterday after holden claiming it as fixed and needed to be towed home YET AGAIN!!!!!!!

I'd swap out the ECU - else it's got more that one wire making contact with something it's not suposed to.

[88GreenVN]

Oh the other thing is to check the connectivity for the DFI unit if its been on/off several times. The pins can open up abit.

[smokey_dj]

its brand new tested on 4th nov this yr

[88GreenVN]

Was the memcal swapped over? or was a new one included?

[smokey_dj]

nah same mecal just swapped there was nothing wrong with it it was
tested and ive also tryed stockys memcal

[88GreenVN]

Do you have a security lock in the glovebox? This stopped my wagon for on/off 3 months. One night the car just stopped and had to get a tow home It killed a heap of bits when the DFI unit fried.
To fix my wagon from stalling: Replaced the following.
CAS
DFI (did these first)
MAP
Manifold sensor
Oxy sensor
Oxy sensor plug (hard wired)
Ran new wire from ignision to ECU bypassing all the dash/security.
ECU last.

This took a heap of counting to 10. Then I got the ALDL cable
ALDL hooked up to the laptop and getting the car to stall whilst driving.

When I put the data into excel it looked as if the fan call from the ECU killed the engine.

But it was a combination of several things and this forum was a great help with many people posting hints. The wagon runs sweet now infact best for a long time so I dont regret all the bits replaced. I've had the car from new 918yrs) and had been a very cheap car to run.

I just put the ATFY 4410 memcal back in and has solved the lack of power. VERY HAPPY NOW!!!!.

[SweetWagon]

So the VN's back on the road.

Just for the record How did the coolant temp sensor stop it from starting?

My VN temp gauge stopped working for about 6 months and it was just the wire had come of the temp sensor. (The car never got hot in all the time I'd had the car) I closed the connector a bit and it worked fine after that.

If my car had no temp signal at all from the sensor.....

they run individual sensors, one for the gauge, one for the ecm.

[88GreenVN]

they run individual sensors, one for the gauge, one for the ecm.

Where be the one that fried?
The gauge sender is back of motor in the manifold.

[SweetWagon]

yep, you will find the ecm temp sensor just a bit further below the gauge sender. the gauge sender is only a single wire which sits next to the MAT sensor. The temp sensor is below them on its own.

[88GreenVN]

Thaks for that I'll go have a looksee in good light tomorrow.

[seveprim]

Mate it says in the file "Fuel Pump Relay Faliure"..try swaping your fuel pump relay with your horn relay (they all the same relays) fuse box next to battery is where it is remember no fuel no start !!!
The reason is in the file it states the relay failed along with cal pack missing but imagine it still would with start with a bad memcal(limp mode maybe )

[14secvp]

good old winaldl saves the day mate had his vn in the shop total cost $300 told ecu fried plugged my lappy in and look at that coolant temp 29 degrees let it idle for an hour still 29 degrees fried temp sensor now runs sweet used to stall all the time take heaps of cranking to get going no wonder the choke must have been well on flooding it .Also had bad hesitation off idle must of been drowning its self.