timing chains

[Calais_5sp]

Just wondering if any1 knows if any modification are needed to fit a double row timing chain to a s2 v6. Are they just a straight bolt in item?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

They are just a straight fit, although the balance shaft has to be removed.

[samuels]

They are just a straight fit, although the balance shaft has to be removed.

ideal time to check balance shaft bearing at the same time to,bearing is only $14.00 genuine,if it needs replacing,as a majority do when they hit over approx 170,000K's

[pandaman]

They are just a straight fit, although the balance shaft has to be removed.

The balance shaft has to be permanently removed doesn't it? Which means the hole where the balance shaft used to be has to be plugged yes? Not exactly a rip it out and chuck it in kinda job.

[samuels]

The balance shaft has to be permanently removed doesn't it? Which means the hole where the balance shaft used to be has to be plugged yes? Not exactly a rip it out and chuck it in kinda job.

but wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the balance shaft? i mean it's in there for a reason.....could you imagine how unbalanced the motor would feel

well ....well you learn something new everday don't you,iv'e never been asked to install a double row timing chain on a VN V6,you are absolutely correct pandaman

[Calais_5sp]

So really your better off gettin a single row and just changing the balanceshaft bearings while your at it? Unless you get the bottom end fully balanced/ rebuilt?

[pandaman]

but wouldn't that defeat the purpose of the balance shaft? i mean it's in there for a reason.....could you imagine how unbalanced the motor would feel

well ....well you learn something new everday don't you,iv'e never been asked to install a double row timing chain on a VN V6,you are absolutely correct pandaman

I've been reading the SCV6 tech forum out of morbid curiosity. Apparently the only noticeable effect from removing the balance shaft is a slightly rougher idle. Might be some long term reliability effects revving the ring out of what is effectively an unbalanced bottom end though.

[pandaman]

So really your better off gettin a single row and just changing the balanceshaft bearings while your at it? Unless you get the bottom end fully balanced/ rebuilt?

Possibly, depends what you want to do with it. If it's just freshening up a stock engine, a single row chain is probably plenty tough. Going to a double row chain on the standard bottom end is a bit of a tradeoff, you get the extra reliability of the stronger and less stretchy chain, but you get the unkown effects of removing the balance shaft. (Which from what I've been reading have been minimal, even on big power L67's, but still a risk)

The best (big money) solution would be to get the double row chain, and a fresh, balanced bottom end. Question is whether you can justify blowing that sort of money on an N/A v6.

[samuels]

I've been reading the SCV6 tech forum out of morbid curiosity. Apparently the only noticeable effect from removing the balance shaft is a slightly rougher idle. Might be some long term reliability effects revving the ring out of what is effectively an unbalanced bottom end though.

yeah iv'e been doing a bit of chasing up too,as it got me curious ,same answers as you have,i haven't done a timing chain in over 12 1/2 months...from memory aren't the genuine ones a type of double roller chain?

[pandaman]

yeah iv'e been doing a bit of chasing up too,as it got me curious ,same answers as you have,i haven't done a timing chain in over 12 1/2 months...from memory aren't the genuine ones a type of double roller chain?

VN V8 come with a double row timing chain stock, that was a surprise to me when I pulled mine down, as the cam kit I got had a bloody single row chain in it. Although I've never laid eyes on one, I'm pretty sure the V6 runs a normal single row chain, but has the two-row crank and cam gears. Just like the old 253's and 308's.

[Calais_5sp]

So if you ripped the balance shaft out what would you plu g the holes up with. BTW the engine will be gettin rbuilt and balanced and using the acl race series kit but not for a few months. Im puttin a new set of heads and lifters in and was just goin to put the timing chain in now while im at it. So would it be worth it, or would it be better just to go a single rollmaster?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

The reason the double row chain is being used is to stop tensioner wear. When stronger valve springs are used it loads the cam up more and causes more pressure against the tensioner, resulting in premature wear. To get around this, a double row timing chain is used but as said above, it gives a rough idle because the balance shaft has to be removed. If you are not building a high revving performance engine, the need for stronger valve springs and a double row chain isn't there. IMO, just go the standard chain, but use a good quality one. The genuine one is good for over 200k and shouldn't be that expensive.

[pandaman]

The reason the double row chain is being used is to stop tensioner wear. When stronger valve springs are used it loads the cam up more and causes more pressure against the tensioner, resulting in premature wear. To get around this, a double row timing chain is used but as said above, it gives a rough idle because the balance shaft has to be removed. If you are not building a high revving performance engine, the need for stronger valve springs and a double row chain isn't there. IMO, just go the standard chain, but use a good quality one. The genuine one is good for over 200k and shouldn't be that expensive.

Probably good advice. Although a double row chain is also less prone to stretching than a single row which is another reason to use one, when it comes down to it, even a single row chain will last bloody ages.

[totq]

Calais_5sp, if unsure, go the safe way, fit a purpose-made, aftermarket high performance single row chain like from Rollmaster.....i also wanted a double row chain with my rebuild last year because i fitted heavier duty valve springs to run with the higher lift cam and the mechanic advised against removing the balance shaft and fitted a rollmaster high performance single chain instead. Its rated much higher than what my motor can dish out now so i'm at ease with that.

[Calais_5sp]

The problem i have is that i am in the process of installing a turbo setup through my stock engine, i am going to rebuild it but not for a few months. Will a good quality single row be sufficient?

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Yes I think it will be sufficient.

[totq]

Yes, just let the supplier know your turbo/power intentions so he can get you a good single row chain.

[jNINE]

A single row rollmaster (ewis) chain should do the job.

[Calais_5sp]

cheers guys