Help identifying engine!

[azzfox]

Hey all, I have a 91 VN V6 which needs a new harmonic balancer. But in order to get the correct balancer I need to know what motor is in it exactly. I have suspicions that its from a VR because it has "VR" written on the intake manifold in texta. But need to find out if its actually from a VR or if its just the manifold.

In other words, does anyone know any differences between VN, VP and VR V6 engines? Is it possible to find out via the engine number somehow?

Cheers.

[social]

well mate i could only tell you the difference between the series 1 vns and series 2 / vp / vr because the s1 has the radiator pipes running to behind the back of the engine where the others dont, hope that helps

[azzfox]

I should have mentioned that! Series 2 radiator hose setup btw. Thanks anyway.

I have also noticed that the engine oil dipstick location seems odd as it sits under the top radiator hose which makes it tricky to remove. On our VP (lexcen if it makes a difference) its at the front of the motor. That have to do with anything?

[Bz Kn33z]

S2 VNs have the oil dipstick at the front of the sump, insted of down the side of it, the top rad hose on a vp is like an L shape from radiator to manifold, on S2 or Vr engine it could be the same but the s2 vr engine is like the VS ones.
Does it have a plastic protection plate over the CAS and around the Harmonic Balancer?

[VR38]

VR has crank angle sensor for duel fire system.

[azzfox]

Yes it has the plastic protection plate over the CAS.

Probably wont show much but heres a quick pic from a few days ago:
http://i243.photobucket.com/albums/f..._1300Large.jpg

[azzfox]

VR has crank angle sensor for duel fire system.

Please explain.

[Zuicider]

best way to check is to look at the cas if it look like this Holden VN VG & VP Ser1 V6 Commodore Crank Angle Sensor - eBay Other Engines, Components, Engines, Components, Car Parts, Accessories, Cars, Bikes, Boats. (end time 22-Mar-09 18:07:48 AEDST) u will need the vn vp harmonic balancer with the narrow teeth at the back or if it looks like this Holden VP VR VS VT VX V6 Commodore Crank Angle Sensor - eBay Other Engines, Components, Engines, Components, Car Parts, Accessories, Cars, Bikes, Boats. (end time 08-Mar-09 17:25:57 AEDST) u will need a vr one. noting that vr is written on the manifold means bugger all as sumone could have upgraded it from a wreaker

[azzfox]

Cheers man. I guess Ill have to take the balancer off and go from there.

While Im on the subject, would anyone know what size jaw puller is needed to take the balancer off?

[social]

tbh mate the harmonic balancers are a b**** to do if you dont have the right claw piece, just make sure you get one with the claw bolts angled straight then at the bottom angles inwards otherwise it wont work, and to remove its a lock in to solid ground / cement or the engine bay chassey with the ratchet / breaker bar and quickly turn the engine over for a split second, it will undo the h / b quite fast if i do recall

[camstatic]

The not-so obvious change from VP-VR is the addition of a cam-angle sensor in the VR engine, located just up and left of the water pump on the timing cover. The earlier engines are a little harder to tell apart. I tried to find a pic on google image search for you, but no dice. Good luck.

By the way: I had my VIN number, year/month of manufacture, still with the original engine, and I still ended up with the wrong balancer. Just grab the most likely one, if it doesn't fit nicely, return it in its original packaging and most places will swap it over for you, with a small price adjustment.

Edit: With Social's H/B removal tips, hitting the key with a breaker bar on the bolt, and against the pass side chassis rail is indeed the best way to loosen the bolt in the backyard, but make sure you rip out your efi relay first. :P

[88GreenVN]

If you find the engine number beside the water pump outlet (will start with VH) I can tell you approx what month the engine was made.

[VR38]

Please explain.

VN-VP fire all coils at once, VR fires three lots of twin/duel coils at separate times.

[azzfox]

I had a look at the cas and it looks to be white. So Im guessing its the small cas and I need the VN/P balancer.

Im aware that it will be a shitty job getting it off but Im not afraid to give it a go . 200+ lb/ft doesnt make it sound fun though . I have heard about getting the bolt undone that way. Bit iffy about it but probably the only way Im gonna get it off lol

I couldnt find a cam angle sensor.

Tried to find an engine number but its probably caked under a layer of crap . Ill have another look later when I feel like cleaning .

[Zuicider]

wouldnt have a cam angle sensor

[azzfox]

I just had another look and I found a suspicious sensor. Its sticking out the side of the timing cover just above the oil filter, and it has nothing connected to it. Could that be it? :S

EDIT: Sorry, its not actually on the timing cover. But still I have no idea what it is lol

[ScoHar]

I always thought the VR engine had a S bend type rad hose which met up with the housing in between the p/s reservoir and belt tensioner, also your engine has the later coils.

[azzfox]

I believe that was for engines with ABS as the module got in the way.

After some scrubbing I found the engine number. VH1203830

[briney]

probably the best way to pull these balancers off, ( particularly if you want to reuse it. ) is there are 3 slots in the front of the balancer. behind these slots are three 1/4 unf threaded holes. if you get a bolt type puller, you can use 3 bolts to pull on the centre. it can strain or break the rubber if you pull on the outer ring. hope this makes sense.

[azzfox]

So there is threaded holes after all? I just thought there were none and needed the claw type puller to pull via the slots? If thats the case Ill just get the standard type puller.

[briney]

yep, and they are hidden a bit, but if you fish around in the three slots you'll find them.

[azzfox]

Took the thermo off and stuck my head in the bay to find a few threaded holes . Thanks for the heads up!

[Pub247]

You should be able to get the right sensor with the engine number but theres a chance it might not be the orignal setup

[Morton]

Just going by the alternator in that pic, I'd be calling VR - but you never know. Engine number will be the winnar here I think

[88GreenVN]

I believe that was for engines with ABS as the module got in the way.

After some scrubbing I found the engine number. VH1203830

I place that engine number to be June 1991.