5ltr won't crank when hot

[levymetal]

Hey everyone,

I've got this problem where my car doesn't like cranking when it's hot. I've just had to walk home because my car wouldn't start after driving it then stopping to get some money out at an ATM (at 2am this has shitted me right up the wall). Usually it's bad at cranking when hot, ie when I fill up with petrol, it only just starts, but it's never not started on me. It kind of sounds like a dead battery, but the car starts fine when it's cold. Also put the lights on, with blinkers, radio, everything seemed to work fine and lights only *just* dimmed slightly when blinkers flashed. Doesn't seem like a dead battery. Yet the engine won't even crank and everything goes dead when I turn the key.

Is there any reasons why this may happen? I'm so ****ing sick of this piece of shit I have for a car.

[VrWagz1]

If everything is going dead when you turn the key (instead of just dimming) then you have issues with your power supply. Have you had a look at your battery terminals closely, they may need cleaning. And how old is your battery. Can you swap it with another car(freinds family neigbours) to see if it fixes your problem. If it has removable caps how is the water level in it.
Given that info i would say your starter motor is fine and its more to do with your battery/wiring, for some reason its not capable of delivering high currents and it should be a simple fix when you fnd it.

[levymetal]

I've just cleaned the crap off the terminals and topped up the battery with water (it was really low, took half a litre of water). I also haven't got a ground from battery to body, so I'll have to get some thick wire and fix that up too.

I'm thinking it has issue arises when it's hot because the water level was so low, the water was evaporating inside the battery when hot but condensing when cold. Or perhaps the resistance in the wires was increased when they are hot and it just proves too much for them to handle. I'll have a look and see how it goes for now anyway, hopefully this will have fixed the issue.

Thanks for your input

[Morton]

The battery took half a litre? Wow - that's extreme

[clubsport_replica]

i had the same problem in my stroker vn ss it turned out to be one of 2 things or both (not sure as did both at same time) replaced alternator, and also removed all grounds cleaned the metal around them and retightend up and also cleaning gunk out of power connections there one near the battery, then i had never had the problem again..

also helps before you start to make sure you battery is in tip top order pretty sure shops still do free testing......

[90lxcn]

dont know how you treat your car ( regular services / fluid checks ) but i make it a habit to check my fluid level and clean the terminals during my weekly fluid check / car wash / bay wash but then again so many things went wrong with this car when i first got it i am now anal about preventative maintainance then again im still driving it to work with screwed front shocks go figure

[VrWagz1]

I've just cleaned the crap off the terminals and topped up the battery with water (it was really low, took half a litre of water). I also haven't got a ground from battery to body, so I'll have to get some thick wire and fix that up too.

I'm thinking it has issue arises when it's hot because the water level was so low, the water was evaporating inside the battery when hot but condensing when cold. Or perhaps the resistance in the wires was increased when they are hot and it just proves too much for them to handle. I'll have a look and see how it goes for now anyway, hopefully this will have fixed the issue.

Thanks for your input

good stuff. Also when ya do the chasis to battery - terminal check your block to chasis earth strap. Its is just behind the alternator somwhere there and bolts onto the front of the passenger wheel arch there somwhere. Mine when i gave it a tiny yank just pulled out of the lug and was almost usless, so i crimped it up properly.

[stocky]

good stuff. Also when ya do the chasis to battery - terminal check your block to chasis earth strap. Its is just behind the alternator somwhere there and bolts onto the front of the passenger wheel arch there somwhere. Mine when i gave it a tiny yank just pulled out of the lug and was almost usless, so i crimped it up properly.

yeah those things suck. i remember that thing came out when i first bought my car. re did the crimp and its held on for months so far

[pjdm1980]

Just make sure you use distilled water in your radiator and battery or can decrese your battery life.

[sxy-tme]

sounds like a bad earth to me

[levymetal]

As it stands, the problem is still happening. What I haven't done is connect a proper earth from battery to chassis, and check the other earth points. Tomorrow I'm going to jump the car off another battery and see if it starts any better.

It's strange though, does anyone know why the problem only exists when the engine is hot? It cranks so perfectly when cold you'd think there's nothing wrong with the battery or earth points at all.

[88GreenVN]

As it stands, the problem is still happening. What I haven't done is connect a proper earth from battery to chassis, and check the other earth points. Tomorrow I'm going to jump the car off another battery and see if it starts any better.

It's strange though, does anyone know why the problem only exists when the engine is hot? It cranks so perfectly when cold you'd think there's nothing wrong with the battery or earth points at all.

Funny you should bring this up.

My 5.0 VN would be hard to start (turn over) when hot. Fires first kick when cold - go for a run down to the road to the wreckers and it would be hard to turn over. Other days it is no issue.....

I may have a look at all the earths while it's off the road.

[v8_stato]

hey man could be the starter motor coz i had the same problem and my starter motor shit itself then i got a new 1 and now its fine in the heat.try that maybe.cheers

[DavoVP]

V8 starters usualy get a bit " lazy " when the engine is hot. But from what your saying its extreemly lazy :P

Im not sure what causes this, buts its a common thing. Even a mates VT ss does the same thing when hot. From cold, no worries.

It might be a good idea to check the pos connection on the rear of the starter, make sure its clean and makeing good contact, when a metal gets hot it expands, that could be your issue.

As a last resort or even when youve saughted all your earthing issues try replaceing the starter.

[levymetal]

This is great stuff! So things to do before new starter:
* Install a proper ground from battery - body
* Clean contact points for engine ground
* Check & clean starter motor positive connection

I was angry before, but now I'm happy knowing I might be able to fix this issue myself

[VrWagz1]

And just before you go new starter motor i would try swapping your battery with the missus's car or somone elses for a few days first too, to see if it goes away. You dont wanna be changing the starter if its only a dicky battery.

[deanos70]

Could be your starter motor is sucking a lot more power to crank when its hot, a relay could be fitted to your starter to boost up the power , shouldnt cost much at an auto elecs to do.

[ScoHar]

Funny you should bring this up.

My 5.0 VN would be hard to start (turn over) when hot. Fires first kick when cold - go for a run down to the road to the wreckers and it would be hard to turn over. Other days it is no issue.....

I may have a look at all the earths while it's off the road.

mine also does the exact same thing, anyluck?

[Calaber]

I can remember this problem occurring with my 327 HT years ago. The problem was caused by the hot starter motor requiring additional power to the solenoid because the heat had created additional resistance in the solenoid wiring. The cure was to add a relay to the small wire to the starter to boost the power avaialble to the solenoid. It worked perfectly after that, but I don't know if it's going to help in this case.

On another thread, Phreddy pointed out that the earth cable from the battery to the chassis is too light and should be upgraded to heavier cable. I guess that applies to all of us, but if you were going to clean and check all connections, this might also be worth thinking about. He also pointed out that a thorough cleaning of the contact point between the cable and the chassis was essential, taking the chassis back to clean metal to ensure a good connection.

[levymetal]

Ok, so there's definitely something up with the starter drawing too much power. You guys are on the right track without even hearing what I've said yet! I tried with my dads battery, and the problem was even worse. Although his battery is not as powerful as mine, it couldn't even crank the motor at all when hot. With my current battery it at least cranks but it's like "EH... 3 seconds... EH.... 3 seconds.... EH", not fast enough to start the car. and then it poos it's pants.

Would someone be able to elaborate on this relay idea? Perhaps this could fix my issue, or maybe it's a sign that my starter is dying and I should buy a new one...

[88GreenVN]

Would someone be able to elaborate on this relay idea? Perhaps this could fix my issue, or maybe it's a sign that my starter is dying and I should buy a new one...

I second ^^^ that.

[VrWagz1]

Its starting to lean towards a dud starter i recon. If you want cheap grab one from a wreckers, if your after the better option a low reduction starter would be the go.
The last thing to make sure of is the main power cable isnt burned or baddly tarnished from heating inside the lug where it is crimped at the battery and the starter end. But im seriously thinking the starter itself is the problem.

[greenfoam]

It's likely the solenoid mine used to crank REALLLLLLLLY slow when it was hot but I dunno my cars constantly changing and it cranks fast all the time now even when hot, well I do have a frustrating issue of not being able to get the engine warm right now

[MasterOfReality]

Mine does this as well.

I got the starter motor replaced around 3 years ago and it did fark all.

I noticed the problem gradually got worse until my battery light came on when driving.

I suspect its my alternator dying or a dodgy earth.

[Dan355]

I wouldnt replace the starter untill youve checked the battery and alternator regulator and wires. I had the same problem with a new starter. I replaced the battery and all leads from it to the starter and the alternator. Theres a white wire coming from the alternator regulator - make sure it has very good contact. That fixed my problem anyway. Heat isnt the problem something else is, heat just contributes to the problem.