VE Brake upgrade - How to fit pads?

[Tom_1569]

Im in the middle of fitting my VE Brake upgrade kit.

Must say its all a piece of piss so far, except how do the squel plate things work with the brake pads, I cant work out how they go on.

Does anyone have a diagram, photo or a really good way of describing it lol.

Cheers, Tom

[pillzor]

youre in the VR- VS section.

[Tom_1569]

youre in the VR- VS section.

Your point? Did you read the title?

Anyone fitted the Upgrade kit and fitted those metal plate things?

[keza87]

I have the upgrade kit installed on my VX and remember that when I got them the small metal plates had been bent in transit and I had to bend them back.
From memory they aren't top or bottom dependant and the small arms that were bent need to go close to the disk. There really was only one way to install them but required a bit of fiddling to get them into position correctly.

Also beware that the pads go on a certain way. I made that mistake and discovered there is an inside pad and outside pad. There are 'pins' on the back of the pad which allow for correct locating on each side of the disk.

[Tom_1569]

I have the upgrade kit installed on my VX and remember that when I got them the small metal plates had been bent in transit and I had to bend them back.
From memory they aren't top or bottom dependant and the small arms that were bent need to go close to the disk. There really was only one way to install them but required a bit of fiddling to get them into position correctly.

Also beware that the pads go on a certain way. I made that mistake and discovered there is an inside pad and outside pad. There are 'pins' on the back of the pad which allow for correct locating on each side of the disk.

Hmm, still a bit confused, might take that knowledge and go arm my self back to this stupid car.

Currently have foot going to the floor, yet one wheel is locked on

[keza87]

yeah the wheel that is locked on you would have installed the pads around the wrong way. It can be difficult to get the damn thing off again.

It doesn't sound good that the pedal is going to the floor. Have you bled the brakes properly?

[Tom_1569]

yeah the wheel that is locked on you would have installed the pads around the wrong way. It can be difficult to get the damn thing off again.

It doesn't sound good that the pedal is going to the floor. Have you bled the brakes properly?

Whats properly?
They have been bled, bled and bled, still no luck.

[Tom_1569]

Hang on...

Standard VE calipers, and mounted at the back, VS are mounted at the front. So when the VE caliper goes on the VS the bleeder nipple is on the bottom. You didnt happen to put the right on the left, and vice versa to over come this? Thats making sense to me if thats what you did, would explain air in the system and it just being gay. Gonna try anyway.

[Tom_1569]

**** YES, Your a legend mate, figured out the clips.
Not sure on the pads, all look the same, but will double check.

Will try calipers on opposite sides.

[Wombles]

Hmm, want to give me some tips to checking out the M/C, never done it before.

Also Ill stop spamming this thread.

PROBLEM HERE

From memory, the pistons are held in by a couple of cir clips?
They were a bitch to get out and put back in...

[Tom_1569]

Ok, Pads and clips are now in correctly.

Bolt one caliper on the opposite side, it now looks right, despite being wrong, which may be right.

Waiting for Nemesis to to come back with Maccas, then fitting the other caliper and bleeding it.

Aiming for some 1am Road testing and bedding in, then leaving town at 8am for Marysville cruise if all goes to plan. If its the master, then **** IT, Im walking to Marysville.

[Tom_1569]

Brakes work.

All sorted, and it pulls up ****ing hard. Throws you right into the seatbelt haha, but locks up easy in the wet, so will bed them in tomorow morning before the cruise.

I took some photos of how the clips work, as Im sure im not the only one thats stumped, I asked a few people who looked at them, all gave a WTF expression.
And Left claiper goes on the right and vice versa (well worked for me.

[keza87]

Glad to hear everything went well! Yeah I also forgot that your supposed to mount the callipers opposite to what they are stamped.
I am surprised you did not get any instructions.

[Tom_1569]

Glad to hear everything went well! Yeah I also forgot that your supposed to mount the callipers opposite to what they are stamped.
I am surprised you did not get any instructions.

The instructions were worse then vague, pretty much, Step 1: Fit, Step 2: Bleed, Step 3-9: Bed in procedure.

Got there in the end, and damn happy with the results.

[5.0L UTE]

Hey bud how much the brake up grade set you back

[Tom_1569]

Hey bud how much the brake up grade set you back

I think just the VE upgrade kit is $725 or $765, I cant remember, I bought a heap of other crap at the same time. Not_an_abba_fan is who I got it off.

Definitly a worthwhile conversion, and easy to justify, running up the back of someone would have cost me 1800 in insurance claim, or half that on brakes and most likely be able to pull up

[jokerflingo]

I think just the VE upgrade kit is $725 or $765, I cant remember, I bought a heap of other crap at the same time. Not_an_abba_fan is who I got it off.

Definitly a worthwhile conversion, and easy to justify, running up the back of someone would have cost me 1800 in insurance claim, or half that on brakes and most likely be able to pull up

I have stock brakes on my VS Ute, along with 8inch tyres versus what ever the standard is. I can tell you here and now id rather pay $700 or so dollars on some fat tyres to provide the extra grip for braking then brakes for some small tyres.

My stock brakes can lockup my wheels pretty easily. So im not sure that your comment is 100% valid.

[Tom_1569]

I have stock brakes on my VS Ute, along with 8inch tyres versus what ever the standard is. I can tell you here and now id rather pay $700 or so dollars on some fat tyres to provide the extra grip for braking then brakes for some small tyres.

My stock brakes can lockup my wheels pretty easily. So im not sure that your comment is 100% valid.

HUH?

I just spent nearly a grand one tyres, so Im pretty sure my tyres are more than adequate.

Bigger brakes WONT lock up as easy, they dont suffer from brake fade nearly as much, and a VS being 1996 +- they are over 10 year old brakes. Its definitly very easy to justify the slight costs in upgrading as apose to replacing the stock system.

I didnt get them for daily performance, as I rarely use my brakes more then a light peddle, its when my ******** in his brand new Audi decides to slam his brakes on, I know I can stop to

[jokerflingo]

its when my ******** in his brand new Audi decides to slam his brakes on, I know I can stop to

Pretty sure what ever type of brake package you have doesn't change the amount of grip your tyres have to give. If i push as hard as possible in order to stop without locking up the brakes i feel sure yours would be fairly similar, same scenario with brakes locked.

[jas98]

wats the size of rim needed to run ve breaks in a vs? and do u need to upgrade the booster and master?

cheers

[nemesis_adrasteia]

wats the size of rim needed to run ve breaks in a vs? and do u need to upgrade the booster and master?

cheers

i helped tom to do this conversion and he runs 17s, theyre pretty close you wont get 16s over them

also using stock booster and master.

[Tom_1569]

Pretty sure what ever type of brake package you have doesn't change the amount of grip your tyres have to give. If i push as hard as possible in order to stop without locking up the brakes i feel sure yours would be fairly similar, same scenario with brakes locked.

What part of having better brakes do you fail to see an improvement. I dont care when your brakes lock up, you will not pull up quicker with your brakes locked, its common sense. Compound of tyre etc is going to play a much bigger part over the width of the tyre, not to mention my brakes will be cooler than yours (under heavy braking) due to bigger discs, thus reducing brake fade etc. Really I dont care if you think my brakes are no better then your 13yr old Stock VS brakes, its a stupid argument if you cant see sense.

wats the size of rim needed to run ve breaks in a vs? and do u need to upgrade the booster and master?

cheers

i helped tom to do this conversion and he runs 17s, theyre pretty close you wont get 16s over them

also using stock booster and master.

As Nemesis said, 17"s, Ill take a photo when its not raining and Im home. But There would be around 5mm clearance between the caliper and rim. Stock master and booster is fine, as the pistons are smaller then VT or something along those lines of why it doesnt need to be upgraded like the VT conversion.

[jokerflingo]

What part of having better brakes do you fail to see an improvement. I dont care when your brakes lock up, you will not pull up quicker with your brakes locked, its common sense. Compound of tyre etc is going to play a much bigger part over the width of the tyre, not to mention my brakes will be cooler than yours (under heavy braking) due to bigger discs, thus reducing brake fade etc. Really I dont care if you think my brakes are no better then your 13yr old Stock VS brakes, its a stupid argument if you cant see sense.





As Nemesis said, 17"s, Ill take a photo when its not raining and Im home. But There would be around 5mm clearance between the caliper and rim. Stock master and booster is fine, as the pistons are smaller then VT or something along those lines of why it doesnt need to be upgraded like the VT conversion.

HAHA no need to get all bitchy, i didn't say that your brakes are not better then mine im just saying in the same on road normal scenario there would be **** all difference. On a race track or under towing there obviously would be a difference.

I just think your trying to make em sound better then they are.

[Tom_1569]

HAHA no need to get all bitchy, i didn't say that your brakes are not better then mine im just saying in the same on road normal scenario there would be **** all difference. On a race track or under towing there obviously would be a difference.

I just think your trying to make em sound better then they are.

I think your the one that has never seen or used these brakes so makes it awfully hard for you to make a comparison?
Also you came into my thread and made the unrelated comments.

[old mate]

HAHA no need to get all bitchy, i didn't say that your brakes are not better then mine im just saying in the same on road normal scenario there would be **** all difference. On a race track or under towing there obviously would be a difference.

I just think your trying to make em sound better then they are.

in normal conditions, i think there would be a significant difference, not in overall stopping power but in the 'feel' in the brakes and effort required from your foot/leg to apply them. having a better feel of what each wheel is doing under brakes can really improve the performance of the whole braking system. better feedback from the road surface means that you can brake harder as it is easier to tell how close you are to the limit of adhesion.

i think the standard brakes in these utes are a poor effort, but are ok for road use. once you chuck a trailer on the back of them however, the extra mass and associated kinetic energy really make the effort on the pedal quite larger and i would not be 100% confident on a predicable redardation affect stopping from 100k's with a 1,000kg trailer. i know that when i put my enclosed, braked motorcycle trailer on the back of mine with only my bike and some spares and gear, i was very surprised when i tried stopping the first time.

if this ve upgrade does what i think it would do (increase in braking power in relation to the same pressure on the pedal, better feel and a larger heat sink area), it would be a pretty good upgrade to do. less pressure required on the brake pedal on a long trip may be benefitial for fatigue etc.

towing, the extra power would be quite helpful most situations, as the pressure you have to apply to start slowing is actually a fair bit, so it gets reduced. on the track, the ve upgrade would kill stock v6 brakes in an instant, with a bigger heatsink and better power.

in saying that tyres are the main component to brake performance, you are right to an extent, but other things have to be taken into consideration such as suspension, steering geometry etc. if the tyres were the only thing that made a car stop really well, then why wouldn't hsv commodores of the same era as the utes in question run exactly the same brakes, just with better tyres. brakes must make a difference as i don't think the hsv brakes were anything like the stock v6 braking system....

I think your the one that has never seen or used these brakes so makes it awfully hard for you to make a comparison?
Also you came into my thread and made the unrelated comments.

aww c'mon guys, play nice. i haven't seen these brakes or used them either, so i'll probably get the wrong end of the stick soon.

now drink up, its friday night!