V6 Ecotec Transmission Leak?

[wortus]

Put this in the VY thread but no one seems to be able to help, anytone here got any idea?

My auto trans has been using a bit of fluid. I refilled it last service and since then it has travelled avout 3000km and needed around another 200ml. Checking under the car today the only sign of leakage is around the starter motor, there was some trans fluid on the 2 bolts holding the starter motor in place and a bit on the plastic cover plate underneath it. I took off both plastic cover plates and the inside of the bell housing is clean, no fluid nor is there any comin gout of the drain plug inthe bottom of the bell housing and it is also bone dry there as well.
Does anyone have any idea where this leak could be coming from? I can't see how it could be an oil seal on the input shaft given the inside of the bell housing is dry and free of any trans fluid.

[The1]

oil in radiator? the trans tank on the side of the radiator has been known to split letting coolant or oil either way.

[wortus]

oil in radiator? the trans tank on the side of the radiator has been known to split letting coolant or oil either way.

No that is OK there is no trans fluid in the radiator or coolant in the transmission. It's just trans fluid on the starter motor mounting bolts and I was wondeing if anyone would know where abouts a leak would be to cause fluid to be present there but none to speak of inside the bell housing.

[The1]

im not sure, so youve also checked to make sure your trans cooler hoses arn't leaking?

[hako]

Realistically, 200ml could be caused by the way the dipstick was read 3000km ago and how it is read today, after all it's only about 2 or 3mm on the dipstick and the fluid temperature when read or even the location (level/sloping ground) could account for that. The fluid on the starter motor bolts could be from spillage 3000km ago. Leaks anywhere will show their presence, usually if bad the slipstream will spray fluid all over the underbody.
I'd keep an eye on it, but wouldn't be too worried about it. Good Luck.

[wortus]

Realistically, 200ml could be caused by the way the dipstick was read 3000km ago and how it is read today, after all it's only about 2 or 3mm on the dipstick and the fluid temperature when read or even the location (level/sloping ground) could account for that. The fluid on the starter motor bolts could be from spillage 3000km ago. Leaks anywhere will show their presence, usually if bad the slipstream will spray fluid all over the underbody.
I'd keep an eye on it, but wouldn't be too worried about it. Good Luck.

Thanks Hako. I'm going to climb under it again and check however I was relieved when there was no fluid in the bellhousing. It may have been a bit more than 200ml as it was down about 6 to 8mm below the add marker. I also had to add about 1.2 litres at the last service but that was since owning the car 18 months/18,000km. I was pretty careful and used a clean funnel to fill it up. I have cleaned the area and will check it if and when I notice the level on the dip stick falling again.

[hako]

The initial 1.2 L would have me worried!....what was the colour?
To be 100% honest, I never check my transmission fluid level, however at least once a month I lie on the ground and have a good squiz at the underbody looking for oil leaks from engine, trans, diff and each wheel caliper. Also look for oil being spun out of uni joints and anything that catches my eye. I figure if it leaks it will leave evidence.
However. when I was looking for a 2nd car, one prime candidate was a series 2 VY. Research revealed that they had a bad batch of radiators with the side tanks splitting at around 150km or so...so maybe check the oil isn't in the coolant - however I cut my last plastic radiator apart and I cannot figure out how the oil cooler can fail as it's made of tubular aluminium and pretty thick.
Dexron 111 is a strange oil - not sure if it absorbs water as I've had open containers of it and the water (from rain) has sat on top or mixed thru the top layer and turned the oil white (emulsified), so if it is leaking into the radiator then I'm not sure how you would detect it...does it leave sludge on the cap, or does it sink to the bottom and stay there or does it emusify?
We need an oil engineer.

[wortus]

The initial 1.2 L would have me worried!....what was the colour?
To be 100% honest, I never check my transmission fluid level, however at least once a month I lie on the ground and have a good squiz at the underbody looking for oil leaks from engine, trans, diff and each wheel caliper. Also look for oil being spun out of uni joints and anything that catches my eye. I figure if it leaks it will leave evidence.
However. when I was looking for a 2nd car, one prime candidate was a series 2 VY. Research revealed that they had a bad batch of radiators with the side tanks splitting at around 150km or so...so maybe check the oil isn't in the coolant - however I cut my last plastic radiator apart and I cannot figure out how the oil cooler can fail as it's made of tubular aluminium and pretty thick.
Dexron 111 is a strange oil - not sure if it absorbs water as I've had open containers of it and the water (from rain) has sat on top or mixed thru the top layer and turned the oil white (emulsified), so if it is leaking into the radiator then I'm not sure how you would detect it...does it leave sludge on the cap, or does it sink to the bottom and stay there or does it emusify?
We need an oil engineer.

The trans fluid is pretty clean and not discolured, the cars service records show it was serviced by Holden on schedule. I never paid much attention to the transmission fluid level as like you I checked under the car and there was no evidence of any major oil leaks, infact the engine block on this car is so clean it has rust on the unpainted bits as does the diff. The underfloor of the car around the transmission is also very clean with no oil at all, there is minor evidence of stuff being spun out around the rear seal but it's black, not oily and ever so minor so I guess it's probably normal and off the seal? There is also the same mark on the underside around the centre bearing.

The coolant and trans fluid have definately not mixed as they are both their normal colours and there is no evidence of any oil in the radiator or water in the trans fluid and the radiator and overflow are remaining full.
After I refilled the 1.2 litres it did not go down so I assumed it had been underflled and had over time (18 months) dropped to the point it was noticable in the way the transmission changed gears given the level did not drop for a long time.
I am going to check it again, maybe the car was not fully warmed up, how much does this fluid expand and rise on the dip stick from cold to normal operating temp? I have also cleaned up the starter motor bolts and will check them again in a week or so.

I've read before that the radiator tanks can fail in these cars, mine is OK and appears to be the original one as is more or less everything in the engine bay as the radiator/heater hoses, alternator etc all have those paint blobs on them. I have a tube of that epoxy stuff you knead together incase anything happens (other than the tank coming off or a hose barb completely snapping) in an emergency. I think the radiators are fairly in expensive to replace if you can fit it yourself.

[The1]

All the manuals i have read state to check the trans oil level after the car has been driven to operating temperature, then check the level on the dipstick with the engine running and in Park, as this keeps the oil circulating through the oil cooler.

There is quite a bit of difference with my car between cold and hot and at operating temp and with engine on. At cold with engine off it reads on my dipstick about 10cm above the normal hot readings.

[hako]

I think if you look at the actual dipstick it has 2 levels - one for cold and one for hot - if so this will give you an idea of how much it expands with heat. Car is not here so cannot double-check.

[The1]

hmm mine just has the hot readings on the tip of the dipstick, nothing up where it sits when it's cold, maybe later revisions had a indicator for cold level as mines a series 1

[wortus]

When I checked it the engine was up to temperature, running and in park. There's only 1 set of levels, it's 2 holes in the dipstick for minimum and maximum level and it tells you to check when hot. The power steering has hot and cold levels on it though.
I checked the level again yesterday and the level was a bit high so I took some fluid out through the dip stick tube with a plastic tube and syringe. All I can think is that it wasn't hot enough even though the engine was up to temp. I'll keep my eye on the level and check the underneath every couple of days.
Hako may be right that the fluid sitting on the bolts was from a previous overfill. I'l post back what I find. Thanks for your suggestions.
If it is indeed leaking around the starter motor and the bell housing is dry I really don't know wher eit could be coming from other than a breather maybe?

[hako]

The breather is an open ended rubber hose that connects to the top of the transmission - open end of it usually is somewhere near the dipstick

[My Vs Commodore]

Try checking the trans sump gasket, now if you do do that make sure you don't touch anything in the sump cause it could stuff something. Go to repco or supercheap and ask for a VY tans sump gasket you will get the gasket and the filter for it, be carefull with the gasket it is made out of very thin cork. Good luck buddy.