VS v8 5 Litre Oil pressure issues Sump Removal?

[joely1991]

I've searched high and low for answers regarding my problem, and have found nothing specific, so sorry if there is already a thread covering this..

Basically having Oil Problems with a VS '96 Caprice V8. One day while driving, after about half hour of driving had the Oil pressure light come on and the engine was very tappy. We have changed the pump and still hasn't solved the issue of no pressure, and the old pump looked fine to me anyways (im no expert though). So we continued to search for other causes, such as the relief spring, seems fine.. the drive shaft for the oil pump in the engine is still in tact. Even after running the engine for a minute or so, and then removing the oil cap, i can see no oil is reaching the top of the engine...

So we have come to the conclusion that there must be a problem with the oil pickup or sludge build up. Now with limited automotive knowledge, I don't know the steps in taking a sump of one of these engines. After Reading some threads im led to believe that ill have to atleast lift the engine to get it off.
Can anyone give me a list of steps and out of the ordinary tools ill require?
or is there something else i should be checking first before goign down the path of the oil pickup.

Also I should add that this loss of oil pressure came about a week after doing an oil and filter change. The oil is Castrol GTX 20W-50 and the filter is a ryco
Another thing to note is that we dont seem to be losing any oil, so I don't think the oil is escaping somewhere in the engine.

If any one could shed some light in the situation, it'd really be appreciated

[mischa]

Did you prime the oil pump with vaso?

[joely1991]

Had a mechanic fit the pump and yes it was primed mate

Did you prime the oil pump with vaso?

[drewVHSS]

replace gasket from sump pickup to where it mates up to the block.

[GRPABT1]

If you're lucky you can undo the motor mounts, jack the motor up and jam blocks of wood in to hold it and you might be able to squeeze it out. Otherwise it's motor out or K frame off.

[joely1991]

Okay, when/if i get the sump off, am i better off just cleaning the pickup or buy a new one, which would come with a gasket im assuming

replace gasket from sump pickup to where it mates up to the block.

[joely1991]

Okay, so this will involve removing exhaust, seperating from trans? and obviously an engine crane

If you're lucky you can undo the motor mounts, jack the motor up and jam blocks of wood in to hold it and you might be able to squeeze it out. Otherwise it's motor out or K frame off.

[drewVHSS]

if you're lucky and the pickup isn't blocked but it's just the gasket, you might be able to get enough clearance to redo the gasket.
I've never tried that way, i've always pulled the motor out and done it on a stand.
Alot hinges on such a tiny gasket too.... reason why i think it's either gasket or blocked pickup is you mentioned it ran fine initially for a bit and then lost pressure, this usually means you had pressure that back filled when the engine was off and then ran dry after a little while of running.

[joely1991]

Yeh by the sounds of things the sump has to completely be removed hey. yeah id imagine it'd be fairly fidly doing it like that. yeah that does make sense to me, so its just sucking air basically, cheers for your response

if you're lucky and the pickup isn't blocked but it's just the gasket, you might be able to get enough clearance to redo the gasket.
I've never tried that way, i've always pulled the motor out and done it on a stand.
Alot hinges on such a tiny gasket too.... reason why i think it's either gasket or blocked pickup is you mentioned it ran fine initially for a bit and then lost pressure, this usually means you had pressure that back filled when the engine was off and then ran dry after a little while of running.

[88GreenVN]

I've searched high and low for answers regarding my problem, and have found nothing specific, so sorry if there is already a thread covering this..

Basically having Oil Problems with a VS '96 Caprice V8. One day while driving, after about half hour of driving had the Oil pressure light come on and the engine was very tappy. We have changed the pump and still hasn't solved the issue of no pressure, and the old pump looked fine to me anyways (im no expert though). So we continued to search for other causes, such as the relief spring, seems fine.. the drive shaft for the oil pump in the engine is still in tact. Even after running the engine for a minute or so, and then removing the oil cap, i can see no oil is reaching the top of the engine...

So we have come to the conclusion that there must be a problem with the oil pickup or sludge build up. Now with limited automotive knowledge, I don't know the steps in taking a sump of one of these engines. After Reading some threads im led to believe that ill have to atleast lift the engine to get it off.
Can anyone give me a list of steps and out of the ordinary tools ill require?
or is there something else i should be checking first before goign down the path of the oil pickup.

Also I should add that this loss of oil pressure came about a week after doing an oil and filter change. The oil is Castrol GTX 20W-50 and the filter is a ryco
Another thing to note is that we dont seem to be losing any oil, so I don't think the oil is escaping somewhere in the engine.

If any one could shed some light in the situation, it'd really be appreciated

I had this issue when I first picked up my 5.0L VN. Changed oil and no better so I used engine flush and changed the oil. The noisy start and oil light seemed to be fixed only to return in no time at all. People said no to engine flush - but I repeated this 4 times in 6 months and slowly removed all the sludge from the pickup. This avoided removing the sump and now 60,000kms later still going strong. I was told by 1 mechanic that the bearings were gone and it was short motor time.... true!!. 5 oil changes larter and the motor is just fine.

The V8 has a very small pickup for the oil and gets blocked easily.

[drewVHSS]

no worries

[joely1991]

so its pretty certain the the issue is the pickup, im glad that worked for you, but id rather replace it and have some confidence in the car. cheers for ya help

I had this issue when I first picked up my 5.0L VN. Changed oil and no better so I used engine flush and changed the oil. The noisy start and oil light seemed to be fixed only to return in no time at all. People said no to engine flush - but I repeated this 4 times in 6 months and slowly removed all the sludge from the pickup. This avoided removing the sump and now 60,000kms later still going strong. I was told by 1 mechanic that the bearings were gone and it was short motor time.... true!!. 5 oil changes larter and the motor is just fine.

The V8 has a very small pickup for the oil and gets blocked easily.

[phear11]

i would personally try a bottle of oil flush, i had alot of sludge in my motor too when i bought the car which caused some issues and ive done a few flushes now and no issues since! its an easy and cheap fix to try rather than ripping the sump off which you should be able to get off without taking the motor out!

[304runner]

Yeah I did one the other week.

But first off, as mentioned above, did you pack the oil pump gears with grease or vasoline? You NEED to do this to prime the pump in order for it to create a vacuum so it starts to pick the oil up....

Now if you have done that then your pick up is blocked like you said..... This is what you need to do....

You can drop the K frame but I chose to unbolt the box from the engine and pull it out and place it on a stand so I could flip it over and clean the engine really well.

Id recommend removing the engine if you have the gear to do it and dont think the K frame is an easier option coz it aint... Shit just doesnt line back up as easy when you go to place it back together...Anywhoooooo.....

Once you have taken the sump off, ditch the gasket (as good a sit may look) and go out and buy a GENUINE holden 1 piece sump gasket.... Remove the main cap bolt holding the pick up brace and pick up (2x 10mm bolts) and blow compressed air through the top (where it bolts onto the block) and also give it a few heavy hits on a timber block to remove the stubborn bits.

Drop the pick up in petrol for a while and let it soak, remove it and the blow it out with air again....

Clean the pick up contact area on the unit and the block then bolt up the pick up using the gasket or a small amount of gasket maker.. Not too much because it will just dry up and break off then block up your pick up again...


Replace the gasket on the sump and use a small amount of gasket glue on both sides of the gasket and then bolt down the sump, but take car here as you might tighten it too much and squeeze out the rubber gasket, deform it and it will leak.

Clean the engine while its out (if u have gone this way) and throw it back in... Dont panic if your oil light comes on but the lifter noise has gone away, just drain the oil, replace it and replace the oil pressure switch, or use compressed air to clean the old one.

Good luck

[GRPABT1]

^ what he said.

[joely1991]

Thanks for your in depth response.. when priming the pump, do i fill it completely with vaso or grease? like every spare space inside the pump. I think im gonna try use an oil flush first.

Yeah I did one the other week.

But first off, as mentioned above, did you pack the oil pump gears with grease or vasoline? You NEED to do this to prime the pump in order for it to create a vacuum so it starts to pick the oil up....

Now if you have done that then your pick up is blocked like you said..... This is what you need to do....

You can drop the K frame but I chose to unbolt the box from the engine and pull it out and place it on a stand so I could flip it over and clean the engine really well.

Id recommend removing the engine if you have the gear to do it and dont think the K frame is an easier option coz it aint... Shit just doesnt line back up as easy when you go to place it back together...Anywhoooooo.....

Once you have taken the sump off, ditch the gasket (as good a sit may look) and go out and buy a GENUINE holden 1 piece sump gasket.... Remove the main cap bolt holding the pick up brace and pick up (2x 10mm bolts) and blow compressed air through the top (where it bolts onto the block) and also give it a few heavy hits on a timber block to remove the stubborn bits.

Drop the pick up in petrol for a while and let it soak, remove it and the blow it out with air again....

Clean the pick up contact area on the unit and the block then bolt up the pick up using the gasket or a small amount of gasket maker.. Not too much because it will just dry up and break off then block up your pick up again...


Replace the gasket on the sump and use a small amount of gasket glue on both sides of the gasket and then bolt down the sump, but take car here as you might tighten it too much and squeeze out the rubber gasket, deform it and it will leak.

Clean the engine while its out (if u have gone this way) and throw it back in... Dont panic if your oil light comes on but the lifter noise has gone away, just drain the oil, replace it and replace the oil pressure switch, or use compressed air to clean the old one.

Good luck

[simmons001]

Just did this on my VS 5.0 Caprice. It is a big painful job, but it can be done at home.

I used an engine lift, and left the motor in situ. The K frame does need to come off in that case. Agreed, use a GENUINE Holden gasket.
PM if you want details.

[304runner]

Yeah you will need to remove the 2x10mm bolts that hold the gear cover on.. just keep packing and packing and packing... When you go to place the pump back on the drive gear will pop out a bit until you turn it by hand and line it up with its key-way. and also, fill the oil filter with oil too, this will also help with the priming..

If you didn't do the above, then there is no way in hell that pump was sending oil through the block, hence the reason why the oil light still came on after changing the pump. It will take about 2 seconds after turning the car on to get pressure...

Trust me, if your pick up is blocked, the engine flush wont to shit... Get into it today so you can have a car to drive on the long weekend....

But id be priming the pump first before spending 8 hours on a pick up clean...

[simmons001]

I primed the pump with a vacuum cleaner... worked a treat

[Pub247]

if your going to pull engine out to do the pick up i suggest doing your rear main while its out. bit more work but less hassle in the long run

[simmons001]

Good idea... i have to do mine now

[304runner]

if your going to pull engine out to do the pick up i suggest doing your rear main while its out. bit more work but less hassle in the long run

Can you do the rear main without removing the entire crank? I think I have seen one post one here where someone managed to do it somehow....Not sure.....I always thought you had to remove the crank?

[joely1991]

just a quick update on the situation, its looking like the engine will probably have to come out.. Few days ago i ran a oil flush through it, while the pump was off i sprayed wd40 down the pickuphole on the block (the part the oil pump bolts to) i then blew compressed air down that in hope to loosen some shit on the pickup.. i then heavily primed the pump with grease. put it all back together. started up and it made pressure and was pumpng oil.. highes it got on idle was arond 25psi then dropped to around 13 once it was warm.. So i ran it for around 10 mins.. then dumped the oil with oil flush in it. replaced oil and filter. started again and once again it made pressure.. so i let it run for a little while, all good. i then decided to take it for a drive, got about 500m down the road shifted from 2nd to 3rd and then the oil pressure completely dropped off. so I'm back to where i started.

Also when filling the engine with new oil i filled then quickly looked in the oil cap hole to see a pool of oil with what was quite obviusly coolant seperated in the oil. So it's looking like there are bigger problems.. although im nearly losing no coolant?

[304runner]

Sounds like a vally gasket has let go too... Yeah there isn't really any easy way out of this mate. It will be a good learning curve for you if you havn't had and engine apart before. Its fairly easy to do both the valley, and sump/engine removal.

Take the engine out, then start with the valley cover, once unbolted you will find it hard to remove, just ease a thin screw driver around the edges, clean it up, replace it all, bolt it up then flush some old but clean oil back into the engine after you have resealed the valley cover to help push through any bits of gaskets or gasket maker that would have fallen in weird places.

Flip the engine over and remove the sump..... my other posts explains what to do from there....

[joely1991]

Thers probably a good chance the head gaskets' are buggered too hey? . . yeah wish i had the time.. and yeh i've only got limited knowledge but have a few tools- im a plumber. But hopefully get something sorted within the next couple weeks

Sounds like a vally gasket has let go too... Yeah there isn't really any easy way out of this mate. It will be a good learning curve for you if you havn't had and engine apart before. Its fairly easy to do both the valley, and sump/engine removal.

Take the engine out, then start with the valley cover, once unbolted you will find it hard to remove, just ease a thin screw driver around the edges, clean it up, replace it all, bolt it up then flush some old but clean oil back into the engine after you have resealed the valley cover to help push through any bits of gaskets or gasket maker that would have fallen in weird places.

Flip the engine over and remove the sump..... my other posts explains what to do from there....