normal air intake vs pod filter vs cold air intake: fuel economy

[existentialist]

Is there make any difference?

The pod filter sucks in hot air from the engine bay, which would lead to an increase in the air:fuel ratio (less fuel). However this would also lead to a performance compromise, right?

Am i on the right track? Or is the point of a pod filter nothing more than allowing easier airflow?

Cheers

[immortality]

do a search on pod filter Vs CIA etc. there have been loads of threads on the subject and many arguments both ways

POD filter vs air filter?

but to cut out all the bull, no matter what you have, unless it has a good source of cold air it ain't gonna do jack

if your gonna fit a POD filter, have a look at my ride (link at bottom) to see how it should be done

[Emackulation]

Boyakasha, wikidy wikidy whaa, east side is the best!

[jet_pilot]

ive used the original airbox gutted it and put a k&n pod in it cut the front wall of the box out and used downpipe for a duct that sit's behind the bumper and come's up through
bottom of the airbox
pod's flow better then a panel filter but without cai or a heat shield the just breath hot air and are useless my setup cost $70 including the pod

[Not_An_Abba_Fan]

Still yet to see proven results of a pod over a panel on an NA car.

[Cheap6]

Is there make any difference?

The pod filter sucks in hot air from the engine bay, which would lead to an increase in the air:fuel ratio (less fuel). However this would also lead to a performance compromise, right?

Am i on the right track? Or is the point of a pod filter nothing more than allowing easier airflow?

Cheers

The issue gets confused because more than one factor is at work:

Low restriction = better economy and more WOT power.

Cold air = worse economy (yep but not because there is "more" fuel) and more WOT power.

Hot air = better economy (at part load - provided detonation is avoided) and less WOT power.

In terms of economy, the PCM will always chase stoichiometry at part load so any effects will be due to factors other than fuel mixture changes. The high load mixtures are extrapolated from the part load (closed loop) mixture requirements..

[dufus]

Heres a how to on how to put a pod into the standard air box, but to be honest it is no different than a panel filter in he standard air box:

http://forums.justcommodores.com.au/...cai-vr-vs.html

[commsirac]

The issue gets confused because more than one factor is at work:

Low restriction = better economy and more WOT power.

Cold air = worse economy (yep but not because there is "more" fuel) and more WOT power.

Hot air = better economy (at part load - provided detonation is avoided) and less WOT power.

In terms of economy, the PCM will always chase stoichiometry at part load so any effects will be due to factors other than fuel mixture changes. The high load mixtures are extrapolated from the part load (closed loop) mixture requirements..

Cheap 6, can you explain the basis for which you have made your cold air and hot air predictions?

[r_i_d_a_h]

Boyakasha, wikidy wikidy whaa, east side is the best!

...your mama, so fat, that when she volunteered to clean the cages at the zoo, people would walk by and say look at that hippopotamus.

[DannyboyDS]

Heres a how to on how to put a pod into the standard air box, but to be honest it is no different than a panel filter in he standard air box:

http://forums.justcommodores.com.au/...cai-vr-vs.html

Is that the one I wrote? (didnt click the link)

You are right, either way the engine itself will only suck in so much air ( I think Abba fan said that once in another thread too) although the pod has potential to allow for more airflow without some sort of force like a charger or a turbo, you will only reach the air intake that the engine can really,a nd a panel filter meets and exceeds this, as does a pod.

Get some other mods on the car before going into advanced air intakes and such is my advice.

[jet_pilot]

i got an extreme top k&n pod that huge for offroad racing only
the box has a flow chart on it but doesnt come up any good in a pic
it show's that the pod i got flow's 881cfm the k&n panel flow's 440cfm
most standard panel filter's flow around 320cfm and cheapo pod's flow around 430cfm hope this help's

[azzfox]

Boyakasha, wikidy wikidy whaa, east side is the best!

LMAO, now theres something I havnt heard/watched in a while!

[jet_pilot]

lol restepa me julie havnt seen for ages laugh every time i see those......um car thing's

[Kaindya]

Am i right?..

the vs unlike the vr has an air flow sensor which effects fuel to air mixture ratios controlled by the ECU..?

therefore adding a CAI in a vr would increase comsumption but in a vs the ECU would change parameters for the better economy?

[immortality]

adding a CAI in any car should reduce consumption. ****ing with the sensors on the engine is going to increase consumption. doesn't matter if it's a VS with a MAF sensor of a VR with a MAP sensor

[sircruisealotVS]

Am i right?..

the vs unlike the vr has an air flow sensor which effects fuel to air mixture ratios controlled by the ECU..?

therefore adding a CAI in a vr would increase comsumption but in a vs the ECU would change parameters for the better economy?

the VR has a different method of guaging the volume of air entering the engine bay, using map instead of maf.
both these sensor types measure air volume and not temperature, so there is no way that they can increase or decrease fuel economy due to an addition of a CAI.

[existentialist]

the VR has a different method of guaging the volume of air entering the engine bay, using map instead of maf.
both these sensor types measure air volume and not temperature, so there is no way that they can increase or decrease fuel economy due to an addition of a CAI.

But how does it measure the volume of air?

If you look inside the air flow meter of a VS, you will see thin little wire-like things going across it.

They measure the volume according to the resistance of those wires. When more air passes through them, it will cool them down, affecting their resistance.

So the temp of the air matters, eg. if the air is colder, the engine will think there is more air.... I'm just not sure about how much the air temp sensor compensates for this.

In my car I haven't connected the temp sensor so I guess it eliminates that variable.

[sircruisealotVS]

But how does it measure the volume of air?

If you look inside the air flow meter of a VS, you will see thin little wire-like things going across it.

They measure the volume according to the resistance of those wires. When more air passes through them, it will cool them down, affecting their resistance.

So the temp of the air matters, eg. if the air is colder, the engine will think there is more air.... I'm just not sure about how much the air temp sensor compensates for this.

In my car I haven't connected the temp sensor so I guess it eliminates that variable.

you've missed my point. i was replying to what kaindya said, in relation to the maf and map sensors. so read it again if you must. the conclusion he came to was incorrect and i was explaining this.

if the air is cooler then its going to contain more oxygen, but its still the same volume of air, so cooler air isnt going to "trick" the maf sensor. although i do understand how you might have come about your conclusion with this, unfortunately it is not the case.
a/f ratios are controlled by the pcm's readings of the o2 sensors in closed loop, whilst in open loop the volumetic efficiency tables in the tune on the memcal are utilised.
the maf and map sensors only play a small part in governing air/fuel ratios - so in theory even if your idea of cooler air tricking the maf into thinking there was a larger volume of air passing it than there actually is, then the o2 sensors would be trimming accordingly anyway.

in any case adding a CAI will help with ecomomy, due to the increased oxygen present in cooler air - regardless whether they are map of maf equiped engines.

also in regards to your air temp sensor - i wouldnt be doing any high rpm with it not plugged in, its responsible for altering the timing - which is very important to keep the engine from pinging/detonation.

[whitevrboi]

ok well i dunno much bout sensors and the finer details and specs but i replaced my standard box and panel filter with a holden cold air intake and cheap pod, boxed with the front of the box cut out (so the pod would fit) and i have noticed and decrease in fuel use and better, smoother acceleration and also an improved engine and exhaust note. just my 2 cents.

[Kaindya]

cool i was just clearing that up... i have always known that adding a CAI would increase economy but earlier in this thread got me confused...so in a vr i guess the MAT (manifold air temp sensor) would be the sensor responsible for this..

yes immortality i agree with you, i dont understand why people put pods in and remove the sensors on the vs..

whitevrboy i have recently added the cai only and have also noticed a smoother acceleration, but yet to see how fuel consumption goes.

[whitevrboi]

yea fuel consumption isnt much, an extra 30km or so to the tank but i guess it makes a difference in the long run. are you just running the standard panel filter or have you a high flow like a K and N?

[emazingli]

Cold air intakes are best thing for me and they really give me a happiness.

[patskies]

On a standard motor there is no point wasting time and money mucking around with airfilters. stick to the standard system.

Also with the "high flow" panel filters. If they are higher flowing then a standard filter, this means there is less resistance, less filtration.

[VrWagz1]

Cold air intakes are best thing for me and they really give me a happiness.

Nice dig, nearly 3 years. Longest one iv seen recently

[WogBoyz]

Cold air intakes are best thing for me and they really give me a happiness.

U did a thread dig of 3 years to say that? lol what is this world comming too