Are chassis repairs legal? (RUST)

[Ghetto]

Hi Guys,

Just bought a 1998 VT Series 1 Executive Sedan from an auto-wholesaler with 100,500kms on the clock. Looked very clean from first inspections, one owner - an old lady rar rar rar.

Anyway a day later I get the chance to go over the car and discover it has a rusted out right hand side front chassis rail (the bit that curves up), and the left chassis rail is on its way to rusting out as well.

I took it back yesterday to the auto-wholesaler and hes organised to get it fixed. It sounded like they were going to cut the rusted front pieces out of both rails and weld in new pieces.

Is this legal being? I'd assume at least it would require inspection from the RTA etc after a structural fix like this?

Cheers,
Rob

[VT-565]

I've repaired EH crossmembers before, adding a significant amount of reinforcing and they passed QLD rego no problems at all, was actually commended by the inspector. I also have an intimate knowledge of the VT floorpan and I cannot see why repairs carried out properly shouldn't be passed as roadworthy. Replacing it with another section and butt welding it would be a start, then some 3mm fish plated on each of the 3 sides. Would be good if you could show us some pics and I could give you a bit more of an idea on how to repair it incase someone tries to stooge you.

[Tom_1569]

Not sure on the legalities, so cant help you there.

But repairing the chassis CAN alter the over-all strength of the car, and geometry. Theres lots of reasons why it shouldnt be done, but at the same time it CAN be perfectly safe.

If it was me, I would be taking the car back and demanding a full refund, its compromising the car that you just paid for. Also it would have been sold in "roadworthy" condition, which clearly was not the case.

Demand (Jump up and down, bitch, scream, kick, punch, bite, pull hair) until you get your money back, plenty more VT's out there mate. If they are hiding Rust in the chassis from you, what else are they hiding, or did they not even look at the car (most likely), alot of car plaves normally have a dude that will do a "Ring a roadworthy" and will enver see the car nor be inspected.

[Reaper]

Hi Guys,

Just bought a 1998 VT Series 1 Executive Sedan from an auto-wholesaler with 100,500kms on the clock. Looked very clean from first inspections, one owner - an old lady rar rar rar.

Anyway a day later I get the chance to go over the car and discover it has a rusted out right hand side front chassis rail (the bit that curves up), and the left chassis rail is on its way to rusting out as well.

I took it back yesterday to the auto-wholesaler and hes organised to get it fixed. It sounded like they were going to cut the rusted front pieces out of both rails and weld in new pieces.

Is this legal being? I'd assume at least it would require inspection from the RTA etc after a structural fix like this?

Cheers,
Rob

Perfectly legal just as long as the repairer does it in accordance with the recommended proceedures. It is reasonably common to remove and replace entire rails from cars although becomming less so due to economic reasons.

Reaper

[Ghetto]

I've repaired EH crossmembers before, adding a significant amount of reinforcing and they passed QLD rego no problems at all, was actually commended by the inspector. I also have an intimate knowledge of the VT floorpan and I cannot see why repairs carried out properly shouldn't be passed as roadworthy. Replacing it with another section and butt welding it would be a start, then some 3mm fish plated on each of the 3 sides. Would be good if you could show us some pics and I could give you a bit more of an idea on how to repair it incase someone tries to stooge you.

Hi All, thanks for all the quick replies. Some good comments. Its with their repairer, I should of taken a 'before' photo but I won't get a chance seeing they start work on it today. They rechon they didn't know about it cause they don't have a hoist.......

Funny thing is they never have offered an exchange vehicle. Once you bought it they seem to want to fix it rather then re-tract the sale...I'm assuming its in their financial interests rather than customer service to follow this train of thought.....I don't know why -- I thought it would of been expensive to fix two chassis rails....

Rob

[VT-565]

I'd be very wary of 'their repairer' too. Have seen some very dodgy stuff, for example, a car yard operator who also ran a smash repair, I used to see some very suspect work coming out of there, just to get gear onto the yard.

[coasty]

we had a car yard who ran a wreckers as well. should have seen the crap there. i saw one that looked like a half cut.

[cxcxcxvcvcvc]

Yeah as reaper has said it is legal no worries there, I also know because alot of old valiant chargers (including mine) have a common rust issue where the drivers side chassis rail rusts and cracks due to the stress of the steering box being mounted to the right hand side of the car, and its a common repair for the old rail to be cut out and replaced ect (mine was repaired before i bought it) as long as the job is done right mate you shouldnt have any dramas

[VTS5]

Hi Guys,

Just bought a 1998 VT Series 1 Executive Sedan from an auto-wholesaler with 100,500kms on the clock. Looked very clean from first inspections, one owner - an old lady rar rar rar.

Anyway a day later I get the chance to go over the car and discover it has a rusted out right hand side front chassis rail (the bit that curves up), and the left chassis rail is on its way to rusting out as well.

I took it back yesterday to the auto-wholesaler and hes organised to get it fixed. It sounded like they were going to cut the rusted front pieces out of both rails and weld in new pieces.

Is this legal being? I'd assume at least it would require inspection from the RTA etc after a structural fix like this?

Cheers,
Rob

Rail's can not be partially / section repaired.IT'S ILLEGAL.They need to be replaced.And also you need to get a VIV cert. for insurance purposes.I wouldnt take the car without it.Please becareful.

[Full Spectrum]

If the car was a repairable right off or unregistered he will need the viv. And from personal experience don't **** with the rails. Cut them you fail. Replace them your fine. This is to stop cut and shut actions which was in the past.

[VT-565]

It's clear not all people know which rails he is talking about. Get under your VT/VU/VX and have a look. There is a hell of a lot of work to replace the whole rail. Also it mentions in that blurb from VicRoads that the repair can be approved by the manufacturer. I have completed rail/chassis/pan repairs in the past and can put you in touch with people that still have those vehicles now and couldn't be happier with them. I only see failure as an option for people that don't know what they are doing or looking at. (feel free to use that line lol)

[cxcxcxvcvcvc]

Rail's can not be partially / section repaired.IT'S ILLEGAL.They need to be replaced.And also you need to get a VIV cert. for insurance purposes.I wouldnt take the car without it.Please becareful.

It says "preferred" method in that read so maybe that is open to interpretation? however im not sure about all roads in OZ of what is and is not legal but i know for a fact that it is a common repair for the charger to have only a section of the rail removed and fitted with a repair sleeve wich is supposed to be legal, so i am going to get in contact today with QLD Transport and ask them what the go is!!

[VT-565]

It says "preferred" method in that read so maybe that is open to interpretation? however im not sure about all roads in OZ of what is and is not legal but i know for a fact that it is a common repair for the charger to have only a section of the rail removed and fitted with a repair sleeve wich is supposed to be legal, so i am going to get in contact today with QLD Transport and ask them what the go is!!

Good luck if it turns out you have to replace the whole rail! lol

I've got a 71 chrylser coupe in good nick if you want it he he he h

[cxcxcxvcvcvc]

Good luck if it turns out you have to replace the whole rail! lol

I've got a 71 chrylser coupe in good nick if you want it he he he h

I know PP&R actually do repairs on chassis rails so it must be legal(hopes) anyway have you got any pics mate of said charger and is it a complete car or just a shell? Whereabouts are you located mate??
Here is a link to thier site!
http://www.pentastarparts.com.au/cla...s-repairs.html

[cxcxcxvcvcvc]

Got onto Qld Transports modifications department today and they have confirmed that it is fine for a professional to do repairs to a chassis rail, the whole rail does not need to be replaced, well @ least not in qld anyway

[fitz_vt]

depending on what state your in, most of the time you'll find that the bars need to be tested by the your states road traffic authority and engineering certificates is a MUST, the car will be un-roadworthy without such certificates for the work that has been done

[VT-565]

you'll find that the bars need to be tested

I find it hard to call the rail in question a 'bar'.
What kind of testing could you do on the VT's monocoque chassis?

[Tom_1569]

Illegal or not, he still bought the car in roadworthy condition, and was never informed about the rust, which should have been picked up on the roadworthy at the very least. I would not be settling for a repair, as said it can be ok, or it can completly **** the car. If he never looked at the car himself he would have never known to something wen horribly wrong. Think about how many young or old female drivers would NEVER check the the Chassis for rust and could get seriously ripped off, injured or killed, all because its another dealer doing a shoty roadworthy.

If anyone cant tell I have a problem with dealers who do shonky roadworthys after a dealing selling my sister a far from roadworthy vehicle and let her drive away in it with her 2yr old son in the car. Same dealer did a big dirty on my mum to.

[VT-565]

have you got any pics mate of said charger

Ah Ha! It's not a charger, it's a coupe...... sound confusing? Well, it is a lot less prolific than the charger, I can't understand why, i know the charger stole spotlight when it took it to the monaros and falcons, but the chrysler was aimed more at the conservative crowd.

is it a complete car or just a shell? Whereabouts are you located mate??

It's 'just' a shell at the moment, but i've bought a donor VJ regal 4 door with Chrysler by Chrysler front end to swap the suspension and panels over. I can steal charger doors as they'll go on the coupe, but the glass is a special one, i can source them from Bris.

I'm in western QLD too, by the way.

[cxcxcxvcvcvc]

Ah Ha! It's not a charger, it's a coupe...... sound confusing? Well, it is a lot less prolific than the charger, I can't understand why, i know the charger stole spotlight when it took it to the monaros and falcons, but the chrysler was aimed more at the conservative crowd.



It's 'just' a shell at the moment, but i've bought a donor VJ regal 4 door with Chrysler by Chrysler front end to swap the suspension and panels over. I can steal charger doors as they'll go on the coupe, but the glass is a special one, i can source them from Bris.

I'm in western QLD too, by the way.

My bad lol!
Well now that i can rest in ease over the chassis repair stuff i wont be needing another shell ect, but i would like to hear more about this car Possibly another project car for the projects section

[Ghetto]

Illegal or not, he still bought the car in roadworthy condition, and was never informed about the rust, which should have been picked up on the roadworthy at the very least. I would not be settling for a repair, as said it can be ok, or it can completly **** the car. If he never looked at the car himself he would have never known to something wen horribly wrong. Think about how many young or old female drivers would NEVER check the the Chassis for rust and could get seriously ripped off, injured or killed, all because its another dealer doing a shoty roadworthy.

If anyone cant tell I have a problem with dealers who do shonky roadworthys after a dealing selling my sister a far from roadworthy vehicle and let her drive away in it with her 2yr old son in the car. Same dealer did a big dirty on my mum to.

Dude I completely agree, I'm so sick of lame sh#t happening like this and the examples you given. Part of me wants to go crack some heads but I'm trying a friendlier approach (at least initially). Its a f**king joke that there day job is buying/selling cars without doing a 1 minute check underneath them.

Thanks for all the posts guys, appreciate the variety of comments and to be honest I agree with everyones varied points of views.

hmm ok so its legal to partially replace the chassis in QLD, I'm in NSW, I'll find out if its the same here. Had a look at the URL you had the the valiant, them dudes did a decent job!, extra ribbing inside etc.

Tomorrow its dude to come back, I'll update the thread with some after pics to see what people think of the repair.

Thanks fellas,
Rob

[fitz_vt]

well ok then a rail, they are similar but the testing that needs to be done is by an engineer, its similar with my car it was taken over regency (sa transport) and they didnt pick up sagging engine mounts

[Full Spectrum]

It's legal anywhere to replace a cars rail. But if you need a VIV it doesn't matter if holden does the work, All the work will only be OKed by the inspector. IF it needs this inspection. And they don't except welded bits on important chassis safety parts.

[fitz_vt]

It's legal anywhere to replace a cars rail.

yes the vehicle becomes a "stat write off" doesnt it?

[Full Spectrum]

yes the vehicle becomes a "stat write off" doesnt it?

If shoddy enough yes.. Here in vic they are on the look out for rebirth cars. And they also claim some cars are not probely repaired. Some that look factory new are rejected they tell me. Made me nerves.