ALTERNATOR or STARTER MOTOR?

[ed12371]

Hi Guys,
I'm not a machanic but I have serviced all my cars and change things when they brake. I have a problem which has me stumped. I'm not sure wheither I need to change to alternator, starter motor or both.

We just brought a 2003 vy commodore wagon (needed more boot space). I put the old VN Acclaim series 2, 2001 model up for sale, sitting in the garage for 3 weeks and the battery is flat. Fully charge the battery and the car suddenly has trouble starting (kicks over a few times) before actual ignition.

Never did that before (must know I'm getting rid of it, LOL). So I drive it around an hour continous driving then sits for 8hrs and another hour home. Drive it the next day, same time frames and one more after that. Turn it off and wash it, before I'm going to put it back in the garage and it wont start? Just a rapid clicking noise.

The first time it didn't start I charged the battery and everything was cool, Problem? Flat battery, right?
Charged it, but it kept on kicking over a few times before starting or nothing then suddenly kicks in, Starter motor right?
After using it for a few times (one hour night and one hour day time driving) for approx 3 days. No ignition just clicking. Flat battery?

Is it usual for the starter motor and the alternator to go at the same time?
Before I go forking out for both, any way of testing them individually?
Many thanx in advance.
regards Ed.

[TMM]

I'll bet it's the alternator. When i ran the battery almost flat in my car, i had the rapid clicking noise when trying to start. The difficulty starting even when the battery is charged could just be because it hasn't been run frequently?

[daniel555]

I'd say alt too.

[falcomwreck]

if your battery has gone flat it's a good chance it's dropped a cell, to check that your alternator is charging, disconnect the battery while it is running, if the alt is good the engine will continue to run, if stuffed engine will die... a cheap alt fix is to just replace the alt regulator (the little black box the alt wireing connects to. regs are usually about $30, alot cheaper than replacing the whole alt.. good luck.

[dannyn12]

first thing you need to do is a load test the battery the check your charge rate at the battery terimals and also check the output at the back of the alt

[andyman]

if your battery has gone flat it's a good chance it's dropped a cell, to check that your alternator is charging, disconnect the battery while it is running, if the alt is good the engine will continue to run, if stuffed engine will die... a cheap alt fix is to just replace the alt regulator (the little black box the alt wireing connects to. regs are usually about $30, alot cheaper than replacing the whole alt.. good luck.

thats the one thing you do not do, ill repeat DO NOT DO, when you discconect the battery when running the alternator will have nothing the sense how much load to be under and will just shoot straight to max output, this will generally fry the regulator.. or in newer cars blow electronics from a power surge.


ill place my bet on the battery has a dead cell. you can charger it but it will slowly discharge itself, also a low battery will make a car take longer to start, as it hasnt got enough amps to output to fully run all systems, i.e fuel, spark and starter + others

[maginoodle]

im with andyman, dont disconnect the batt while you have it running. in my experience anything with a comp in it wont run without the batt being hooked up but i havent tried it with later model cars.

[Zeussy]

thats the one thing you do not do, ill repeat DO NOT DO, when you discconect the battery when running the alternator will have nothing the sense how much load to be under and will just shoot straight to max output, this will generally fry the regulator.. or in newer cars blow electronics from a power surge.


ill place my bet on the battery has a dead cell. you can charger it but it will slowly discharge itself, also a low battery will make a car take longer to start, as it hasnt got enough amps to output to fully run all systems, i.e fuel, spark and starter + others

Im glad somebody said that!!

I read the other post and was like WTF???!!!


Maybe on the old school cars yeh, but no way i'd do it on a newer car..

On my VY I had an alternator charging problem, tested with a multimeter, at the battery, and the alternator output.. nothing.. took the alternator off down to the auto elecs.

He pulled it apart and found that one of the wires for the 'windings' had snapped, (theres three 'windings' in the stator on the alternators) its supposed to be a common fault with them, he used to fix the holden warranty claims, - fit a new stator, but told me it wasn't neccessary, that soldering it would be good enough for a while... so he just soldered the wire back together

$20, and four years later its still going!


EDIT: If you dont have a multimeter, just take it in to an auto electrician, and ask them to check the charge rate of your alternator, it should be up around 13 volts, or more.. if its only 12 - 12.5 volts, its probly on the way out.. if its good, get him to load test your battery, it can be done in car, just disconnect the battery leads..

If neither of them yeild any results, get him to pull the starter and check that out, but im guessing it'd be the battery, if its the original one.. if not most likely the alt.

[Zeussy]

Hi Guys,
I put the old VN Acclaim series 2, 2001 model up for sale.

ok.. did VN's have Acclaims? lol... 1991? or VT?

[ed12371]

ok.. did VN's have Acclaims? lol... 1991? or VT?

To True,
Gold star for picking up my mispelt letter. Should be VX Acclaim Series 2 2001.

regards Ed.

[ed12371]

thats the one thing you do not do, ill repeat DO NOT DO, when you discconect the battery when running the alternator will have nothing the sense how much load to be under and will just shoot straight to max output, this will generally fry the regulator.. or in newer cars blow electronics from a power surge.


ill place my bet on the battery has a dead cell. you can charger it but it will slowly discharge itself, also a low battery will make a car take longer to start, as it hasnt got enough amps to output to fully run all systems, i.e fuel, spark and starter + others

Well I'm glad someone is moderating advice in this forum. I remember this trick used in older cars. Disconnect the battery and if the alternator is shot the car will die.

Ok, I don't have a multi meter, but I think I can get the battery tested for free at various places.
I'll do that first and go from there.
Thanx very much for everyone's advice, much appreciated.

regards Ed.

[Zeussy]

Haha! Score, Gold Star, lol,

Yeah any Auto electrician, or mechanic will most likely do it for free, if they're in a good mood, as there's a possibility that they will get some work out of it...

Good luck with it..

[ed12371]

Okay blokes,
problem Solved. It is the battery. I had it tested and it was shot.
Thanx to the advice on the forum I have saved $120.00 on an alternator and how ever long it would have taken me to take it out and put the new one in.
Plus finding out after all that (replacing alternator), the problem was still there and then replace the battery.

So, can I just say the internet and the helpful people on it are bloody ace.

No longer are we left to the mercy of unscrupulous mechanics and holden service departments.

regards Ed.

[Zeussy]

Good effort mate.. Glad you got it sorted..!