VZ Calais 2005 V6 ESP \ TCS

[KrisHolden]

In the last month, I have purchased a second-hand 2005 Holden Calais, V6 (VZ) which to my understanding has Electronic Stability Control. This car was an upgrade to a previous 1999 VTII Calais which featured traction control.

In my older car, whenever I attempted to force the acceleration, any loss of traction would trigger the TCS to stop the engine power so the wheel could regain traction.

My question stems from my VZ calais. On engine startup, the system check does not report any concerns nor are there any warning lights. However, although this car has ESP and not stand-alone TCS, I am not convinced that the ESP is working correctly.

On a dry open road, I decided to test the system. I locked the front wheels to the right and forced the accelerator down. I noticed the back wheels were skidding and had lost traction. Probably due to the dry roads and not ESP I assume the reason why I never lost control.

Is it normal for my VZ Calais V6 which has ESP to let the wheels spin for seconds?

I ask this question to those who either drive a VZ Holden Calais, V6 only as the V8 does not have ESP and to those who are knowledgable in this area.

Thank you.

[crazy2009]

I also have 2005 Calais VZ You will a small amount of spin when the issue is forced in the way you are doing it under normal condition say light wet or rain the ESp will kick in pretty well

[KrisHolden]

Thank you very much for your reply.
If I were to go on grass and force the accelerator, if wheelspin occurs, should ESP kick in?

Do you get any warning messages on the drivers console screen indicating either "ESP" or "Low Traction" when this occurs in your vehicle. How long do they appear for and do they automatically disappear or do you have to hit the mode button?

Not once have i ever received a message

[impulsive]

in the SV6 we get a 'Low Traction' with some squiggly line behind a car come up..

[KrisHolden]

in the SV6 we get a 'Low Traction' with some squiggly line behind a car come up..

Thank you for your reply!
Holden has mentioned to me that the TCS on the SV6 and other models works differently to the ESP as found on the Calais. However, I have had significant wheelspin without losing control and without any ESP\TC warning messages hence my confusion as to whether it is working.

[heyitsEnricoPallazzo]

ESP only works at speed.

"ESP greatly improves vehicle safety performance in situations where the driver takes emergency action to avoid a collision. It does this by electronically correcting vehicle paths through brake application to individual wheels and engine torque management. The system operates so smoothly that in most situations the driver will not be aware it has been activated."

The test you performed should have activated TCS and torque management.

You also have, ABS, CBC, EBD, EBA.

Read this.

[crazy2009]

The above is correct in the manner to which operates

[KrisHolden]

Thank you for your replies.

I certainly did notice TCS working when I tested the vehicle by locking the front wheels and forcing the acceleration.
Are you able to tell me if I am meant to get any visual messages\ warning tones when TCS or ESP has been activated on the Holden Calais VZ V6?
If so, how long is that warning and does the warning require you to press the "mode" button to remove the warning or does it automatically disappear after a few seconds or so?

apprecaited!

[Munz]

Loss of traction comes up on display then dissapears unsure about ESP

[KrisHolden]

Thank you. If I may ask, does it appear for long? I ask how long it appears as I wonder if I am I just missing it
One Holden dealership said its not working, the next holden dealership said ESP is working correctly. I am more than confused and I beleive its not working considering traction control does not kick in as you said when I feel it should.

[heyitsEnricoPallazzo]

There is reference to ESP in your owners manual. Chapter 1-10 & 4-15, 4-16

There is an ESP animation. Which needs to be reset via mode switch once activated. Ditto for TCS.

TCS systems are located in chapter 1-10 & 4-13.

If there is a fault in these systems you should be displaying an error message on the dash.

[KrisHolden]

There is reference to ESP in your owners manual. Chapter 1-10 & 4-15, 4-16

There is an ESP animation. Which needs to be reset via mode switch once activated. Ditto for TCS.

TCS systems are located in chapter 1-10 & 4-13.

If there is a fault in these systems you should be displaying an error message on the dash.

Thank you for your response.
I am well aware of this. Either my car is not detecting the problem therefore showing no warnings or its extremely insensitive.

Really have no clue whether I should pay more money for a third holden to look at it.

Can anyone suggest a safe manouvre I could use to test this VZ Calais V6 ESP system? Would be interesting and will get back to you with the results

[Phyco]

Leave it alone. ESP should only work in situations where it needs to. On rare occasions when driving in the rain and ESP kicks in, a message will display on the console for a second before disappearing. This has only happened to me twice (on the same day) in 2 years of owning the car.

[heyitsEnricoPallazzo]

Sounds like you need to do track days or advanced driving course.

[KrisHolden]

haha ok guys, thanks.
Would I be repeating myself if I were to ask that since ESP incorporated Traction Control, is there a way I could then test traction control on this VZ Calais V6?
I just dont get why one holden said my traction is not working and the other holden said my ESP is working

[SLIVZ]

My Vz calais doesnt come up with anything on the dash, but you can feel the TCS working, also with it on coming around a round about (wet or dry) and sink the boot into it, as soon as it steps you can feel the power drop and it straightens the car up. but again nothing shows on the dash

[KrisHolden]

My Vz calais doesnt come up with anything on the dash, but you can feel the TCS working, also with it on coming around a round about (wet or dry) and sink the boot into it, as soon as it steps you can feel the power drop and it straightens the car up. but again nothing shows on the dash

Yeah, I think my car is like yours. Nothing come up on the dash contrary to what is stated in the manual.
I still have to do more testing, but after trying to do it on one roundabout fairly fast this arvo the car leaned quit a bit but I dont think I lost traction cause of these sticky tires iv got on the car.
Will do some more testing

[Eath4306]

My MY06 Calais does the exact same thing, kind of unnerving sometimes... sometimes I get ABS and ESP Failure warnings so I'm going to get a full diagnostics check done.

[HoldenOnn]

Check the links below. First 2 links provide direct ESP reference about halfway down the page. Third link below is the main archive page. Lots of good info

Holden VZ Commodore / Calais - Media Release

Holden VZ Commodore / Calais - Media Release

Unofficial Holden Commodore Archive

[KrisHolden]

Thank you guys for your responses.

I have viewed those links previously. Holden HQ seems pretty weird on the topic in that they cant even confirm if the factory default car has TC incorporated in ESP and they asked me to contact my local dealer (Col Crawford) as I did and they asked me to book my car in and pay them around $100 just for them to call their technical team and confirm that my Holden VZ calais V6's factory car has TC incorporated in ESP. Is it just me or is there way of thinking weird?

Currently in negotiation with another dealership though no confirmation as yet.

I just want me car to just once show me the low traction animation to convince me it is working. Neither of the three places I have taken my car could get it to show, or show as per the manual where you have to hit the mode button to reset the ESP warning light. Two places told me ESP is working, the other, a Holden dealership, tested and said TC is not working.

These guys really dont know whats happening half the time and now they have my money!

[heyitsEnricoPallazzo]

There is the possibility with software upgrades the animations where deleted.

I for one would not like an animation appearing and beep sounding when you are in the middle of emergency manouver.

Please press 'mode' before you crash....

[KrisHolden]

There is the possibility with software upgrades the animations where deleted.

I for one would not like an animation appearing and beep sounding when you are in the middle of emergency manouver.

Please press 'mode' before you crash....

Thanks for your reply. I will question Holden and ask if this is the case.

[Eath4306]

Kris, have you had a diagnostic check done in any of your services? That was the fix my mechanic suggested. I dunno if it's an update or reset...

[KrisHolden]

Kris, have you had a diagnostic check done in any of your services? That was the fix my mechanic suggested. I dunno if it's an update or reset...

I have had two Holden Dealerships do a diagnostics check on it. The driver console gives no warnings\ errors. However, the dealership that said my TC is not working found and reset an error that probably came up once stating the airgap between rear sensors was not right. However, they reset the error and no errors have been reported in the last 2.5 weeks. The second dealership rescanned and had no errors, test drove the car and said ESP is working. I drive the car, tested on dry roads and grass and get significant wheelspin ie the wheels just keep spinning until I take the foot off the pedal.

All so confusing and annoying

[Eath4306]

Kris. I had my car out in the pouring rain at 2am, so I did a couple of tests to see if the TC was actually working.
With the 'ESP on' according to the screen, I floored it and the car kept it's revs <2k, cutting in with a moderate amount of slip. Nothing came up on the screen.
With the 'ESP off' according to the screen, same deal- but the revs went right up and just started sliding everywhere. No warnings- didn't expect any though.
I'm thinking that it's working a bit? - but same problem about no warnings.