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28 days until TUNE (advice on E85 and supporting mods please)

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dsuth77

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Hello All

Before my Ramjet otr and tune (GM Motorsports $990 special) on a VF SS ute auto.

I am looking for lowdown throttle response & torque primarily (peak kw is a bonus) but can't justify $4k on quality full S/S exhaust

As this is a new car and I may need to claim warranty I want to be able to change back to standard (hopefully they won't find its been tuned)

AFAIK my options are:

1. Hi flow cats($500 -600 fitted) looking at ballistic i'm not sure of body size SUGGESTIONS? and j pipes ($450 for note/no drone)

2. Hi flow cats and bi modals + controller : with an otherwise standard exhaust will the bi-modals have a good note?

3. 2.5 inch S/S catback $900 (chinese) - $1650 (di fillipo fitted)


Tune wise

Only 1 out of the 10 tuners I have spoken to seems to think there is any benefit in tuning for E85 over 98 in bolt on only non forced induction setup.
I will be using 98 mostly as a tank lasts me a month plus (weekend car) but when I line up against a stock xr6t i need every extra kilowatt
After my 98 Tune can I go back on a tank of E85 and have them tune the ethanol tables (its a mafless tune with maf in place) suggestions?

does anyone have back to back dyno sheets etc?

Thanks in advance for your advice guys
 
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ya mum!
First of all. Get it out of your head that bolt on mods affect your warranty for anything other than the bolt on mods. The tune will likely cause you more grief warranty wise and as soon as they plug it in, they'll know it's been done.
 

dsuth77

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even if its flashed back to standard? will they know straight away?
 

PIR4TE

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Lots to think about, all covered in enormous detail on this site through Google already, take a look at My Garage.

Without a reason to do so, an authorised service centre won't randomly plug your car in so they won't know your car is running a different OS but you need to be careful, and it is more important than a different air filter.

I have posted dynos of before and after e85 tune on this site (250-270rwkw) bottom line is that simply swapping fuel type without understanding the thermodynamic characteristics of alcohol will fail. You can expect +6-11% rwkw but HP is not as important as early reliable availability of torque at any IAT under 130°.

Strike out all those tuners who know FA about ethanol. Alcohol allows higher cylinder pressures without knock, hence good for torque tune supported by a set of Tri-y extractors.

Extractors, cats, 3.5" expansion chamber, x-pipe, full 2.5" custom stainless exhaust with HSV bi-modals and controller cost less than $2500.
 

dsuth77

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Thanks PIR4TE

I was hoping you would reply, I have trawled many forums/Google daily for months and Indeed your posts as well as your garage was most helpful.
Hence my insistence on E85, but as you say from what I have read most tuners treat E85 like 98 and generally speaking run the afr's too lean,
I was hoping for some first hand experience aside from your own.

Any recommendations for E85 tuners in Melbourne?

If I have my standard tune flashed back will a dealer on a regular service or on search for fault codes immediately discover my ecu has been flashed?

Maybe NAAF can chime in here: my understanding is that with a tune hi flow cats with smooth bends will out perform just a catback? (bang for buck)

Any Recommendations for a custom exhaust shop in melbourne?
 

PIR4TE

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Any recommendations for E85 tuners in Melbourne?
Never been to one in Melb but if I were to I'd at least check in with Luis from APS in Frankston, he's definitely on the same page with e85 and has good results.

If I have my standard tune flashed back will a dealer on a regular service or on search for fault codes immediately discover my ecu has been flashed?
Negative, at least not in my experience.

my understanding is that with a tune hi flow cats with smooth bends will out perform just a catback? (bang for buck)
Do you mean modded cats vs catback in terms of performance benefit? Goes in this order - headers first then collector / termination box, then cats then catback then axle back (mufflers).

Mate you haven't mentioned headers, that's where the performance increase will come from. Pacemaker PH5387 extractors would suit the bill:


Then there is a calculated length (from bung at merge) to mate the 3" header outlet to the 4" barrel cat (no matter which brand, I went Magnaflow), which then resumes a fairly standard bend path for both 2.5" from the back of the cats:


I would replace the mid muffler section by continuing the pipes straight down the middle past the tunnel brace and install an x-pipe at a calculated length (from end of primaries).

Axle back you can either leave it stock (not half as bad as you think with this system) or utilise existing axle-back pipe and replace rear cans with HSV bi-modals + NPP in a box.

* Calculated Lengths - can provide that for you if you choose.
 

dsuth77

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Cheers PIR4TE

I will speak to Luis

Thanks for your help
 

Trewman

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Luis just tuned my vf at APS and also fitted otr cats extractors and exhaust. Cannot recommend them enough. Id let them sort you out
 

dsuth77

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An update for anyone who is interested:

Getting an E85 tune (+ 98 later on) @ APS with their carbon fibre otr ($1250) and HM Headers 1 3/4" 4 into 1's with integrated 100 cell cats ($1650 fitted not sure if its a 3 or 2.5 in collector)

HM Headers - Performance headers, extractors, mufflers, exhaust systems, hi flow catalytic converters, complete exhaust or cat back systems - HOLDEN VE 6L and 6.2L Stainless Steel HI-FLOW Header 1¾ primaries, 2½" outlet."

1. As these headers bolt up to the standard cat back, do you think I will still get good Torque / rwkw (I'm told the headers are just as good as any out there)

2.What do you guys think it will sound / flow like with standard catback (AFM)?

3. will I need bi modal mufflers with the standard catback for flow and db's

4. As I have the ute a Vf gts catback will need to be lengthened to fit, is it worth it (will cost up to $850 est.)
 
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