Just Commodores Forum Community

It takes just a moment to join our fantastic community

Register

$5000 System in SV6 - Not Performing Well?!

Discussion in 'Car Audio' started by zackvz, Dec 18, 2012.

  1. zackvz

    zackvz New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    2012 SV6 3.6L
    Hopefully someone can shed some light...

    Just as a bit of background info, in my previous vehicle I had Crescendo splits and a Crescendo sub run by a Genesis Profile 5 amp, all connected to a DNX7360BT Kenwood HU ($2000). Sounded nuts!

    I now have a 2012 SV6 VE Series 2 and had an aftermarket system installed. This is what I installed:

    - Morel Elate 602 Splits (Front)
    - Hybrid Integra Ovation Coax 6" (Rear)
    - POLK MM1240 Subs
    - Alpine PDX M12 Mobo (Subs)
    - Alpine PDX F6 (Splits)
    - Dynamatt front/rear doors, boot lid, etc.

    I had a Rux Knob installed in the glove box and everything was done using Stinger cabling. He used the Alpine KCE 431R Converter to get the signal from the HU to the Amps. The work he did was absolutely amazing, installed professionally and I wouldn't hesitate a second before recommending him, there's no engine noise, no rattling, so I'm confident the issue isn't with the installation. Even though the system sounds insane, I was disappointed because of the expectations I had based on my old Crescendo system which wasn't worth nearly as much.

    I'm a DJ by profession so all my files are .wav files burned to a CD.

    I have a few questions regarding what I believe to be the ONLY possible culprit in this situation - the head unit.
    Everything up to ~35% volume, sounds flawless and crystal clear, once you exceed that, it starts sounding really piercing and all the highs are ear piercing, I have turned down the treble on the HU to almost -9 and it sounds better....at all times however, the bass is very clean and punchy.

    1. Should I have Dynamic Distortion on the HU turned OFF? Or on setting 1 or setting 2?
    2. Does Dynamic Distortion guarantee that the HU is providing a 100% clean and undistorted signal to the amps?
    3. Will the HU provide a better/cleaner signal if a .wav file is played off a CD rather than through the USB iPod connectivity in the Centre Console?
    4. Will the HU provide a better/cleaner signal through the 3.5mm AUX jack?!
    5. What does the LOUDNESS setting in the Sound Settings mean? (I would check the manual but I'm at work)

    Any help/ideas would be appreciated.

    Thanks!
     
  2. vongy10

    vongy10 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Location:
    Gunnedah
    Members Ride:
    CV8 Monaro V2
    I'm pretty sure Dynamic Distortion limits the volume when the sound becomes distorted. So it's like when you turn up some music and it starts to sound terrible at high volumes that you have to turn it back down a bit.

    I've found out the best way to play music through the IQ unit is by using the Bluetooth connection to your phone or something.

    Loudness makes the music at low volume sound louder. It ups the db's when at low volume.
     
  3. MAG00

    MAG00 New Member

    Messages:
    810
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Members Ride:
    VY S2 Calais
    What part of the system not meeting your expectations?
     
  4. zackvz

    zackvz New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    2012 SV6 3.6L
    Hmm yeah. I guess I'll make sure the Dynamic Distortion is turned off and that Loudness is turned on, just to bring the bass up a bit at lower volumes.

    BLUETOOTH?! Really?! I would have thought that would possibly be the worst way to get the best quality sound going through the system?! Isn't bluetooth transmitted at terrible qualities?

    The main thing which is dissappointing me is the lack in clarity of the front splits when reaching higher volumes, HU max is 45 and I would expect volume around 35 to still be crystal clear. I spoke with the installer today and he has suggested that perhaps I'm not used to such powerful front splits and the front splits are overpowering the bass by an extraordinary amount and the front splits are actually running extremely loud, is that possible?
     
  5. vongy10

    vongy10 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Location:
    Gunnedah
    Members Ride:
    CV8 Monaro V2
    Playing via Bluetooth with the IQ sounds best to me, a lot better than the AUX and USB. Was really surprised how much better it was than having an ipod connected through the USB.

    The gains on the amp are possibly set up too high. Turn the gains on the amp for the speakers down, leave the one for the subs alone and unplug the RCA's for them so you can just hear the speakers. Turn the head unit all the way up and see if it sounds any different then adjust it the gain setting.
     
  6. MAG00

    MAG00 New Member

    Messages:
    810
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Members Ride:
    VY S2 Calais
    For such an expensive install, I am surprised that there is no processor used. My money would be on a poor quality source (headunit with line out converter). Amp a poor source = loud, poor sound.

    You're comparing a system with an expensive headunit (and thus, presumably decent quality) to a mass produced unit where corners are cut to save money. With such good quality speakers you'd almost be making the poor quality source more obvious than normal.
     
  7. zackvz

    zackvz New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    2012 SV6 3.6L
    Hmm Ok I'll give this a go when I get home and have a look, apparently he tuned all the gains on the amps to perfection so I'm reluctant to fiddle with them but we'll see how I go. I'm going to try dimming the treble a bit and see if that helps.

    I was just reading about processors today and I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems to think the headunit is the issue. Everything starts from the headunit so no matter how good the rest of the system is, the headunit has to provide a clean signal, am I right? OR would a processor be able to clean up the signal and make it sound like a 2000 headunit?

    My kenwood headunit was very expensive so I'm guessing it did it's job really well, would a processor be able to replicate that sort of output? If so, can you suggest a brand/model for me to start looking at?

    EDIT: Does anyone know if the 2012 VE Series 2 Holden IQ Headunit puts out a good signal?!

    Thanks guys.
     
  8. vongy10

    vongy10 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Location:
    Gunnedah
    Members Ride:
    CV8 Monaro V2
    Oh if that's the case then don't change the gains and look into getting a digital processor like MAG00 has said. Audison Bit Ten would be good.
     
  9. zackvz

    zackvz New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    2012 SV6 3.6L
    Okay so I'm trying to understand how exactly a digital processor would be beneficial in my situation. So in my situation let's assume the headunit is providing a dirty/clipped signal, which is then getting amplified and then obviously sounds terrible. So are you saying that:

    - The Bit One will receive the clipped/dirty signal from the headunit and optimize it and clean the signal according to my settings on the processor, which will then provide that signal to the Amps, thus mimicking the signal quality of a $2000 head unit?
     
  10. vongy10

    vongy10 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Location:
    Gunnedah
    Members Ride:
    CV8 Monaro V2
    A processor will filter the signals and give out clean and clear signals to the amp. If you're looking at getting a Bit One it will surpass a $2000 HU.
     
  11. zackvz

    zackvz New Member

    Messages:
    5
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    2012 SV6 3.6L
    Regardless of which head unit I use?!

    Where can I source one, I'm struggling to find somewhere trustworthy.
     
  12. vongy10

    vongy10 Active Member

    Messages:
    1,190
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2011
    Location:
    Gunnedah
    Members Ride:
    CV8 Monaro V2
  13. Nut Kracker

    Nut Kracker Donating Member

    Messages:
    4,760
    Likes Received:
    129
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2012
    Location:
    Echuca Vic.
    Members Ride:
    VT SS 304ci (195i)
    I was interested to see what exactly are wav files and I found this. Not knowing anything about them, I thought maybe it could be effecting the sound.
    Just a thought....probably wrong.

    Got this from Wikipedia. Maybe you could shed some light.

    "Audio CDs do not use WAV as their sound format, using instead Red Book audio. The commonality is that both audio CDs and WAV files have the audio data encoded in PCM. WAV is a data file format for a computer to use that cannot be understood by CD players directly. To record WAV files to an Audio CD the file headers must be stripped and the remaining PCM data written directly to the disc as individual tracks with zero-padding added to match the CD's sector size. In order for a WAV file to be able to be burned to a CD with most burners it should be in the 44100 Hz, 16-bit stereo format."
     
  14. sweefu

    sweefu New Member

    Messages:
    2,742
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2008
    Location:
    Canberra
    Members Ride:
    VY Berlina V6 / R31 Skyline
    Try a good quality CD and see if that sounds any different, as MAG00 suggested It could be due to a lack of tuning / processing available, all of those components are highly regarded as 'nice sounding'.
     
  15. MAG00

    MAG00 New Member

    Messages:
    810
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2011
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Members Ride:
    VY S2 Calais
    If it's still poor quality after using a good quality CD, take it back to the installer and ask him nicely to do a quick job for you to work out what's the issue.

    He just needs any random headunit (that you don't need to buy), take it to the boot of the car, give it some +12V to the constant and accessories wire, run a remote wire from the headunit to the amps, and run a ground wire to the headunits ground wire. Should be easy seeing as the battery is in the VE boot.

    You should now have a functioning, temporary headunit in the boot. Hook some RCAs up between the amps and the headunit.

    Use the same good quality CD that you used earlier. If this sounds any better, you've isolated your issue to the headunit/line-out converter.

    Edit: If it's any easier, the installer might just be able to feed the headunits constant/accessories wire into an amps positive terminals and the headunits ground wire into the negative terminal, as well as the remote wire into the remote terminal. Then it's just as simple as running a remote wire between the 2 amps (if there isn't one already) and plugging in the RCAs. Certainly dodgy, but good for a temporary troubleshooting session.
     

Share This Page