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90kms steering shakes

Skylarking

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I have never come across a balancer that measures RFV....These days, alot of youngins don't look at the tyre when it's being spun looking for the up and down....They just bang the weights on and bobs your uncle
Plenty of companies make balancing machines that measure RVF... Hunter's Road Force Elite is just one..

The fact that many tyre shops may have not updated their equipment to new (probably more idiot proof) machines that measure everything is a little sad. It's even sadder considering you've said a few times that many of the young staff that operate these machines just don't care to do their job to a high standard. Such machines could take the "don't give a shite" attitude out of the equation and result in a better outcome for the customer :rolleyes: Guess the newer better wheel balancing machines are rather cost :eek:

Me, I've always perfer knowledge and skill over automation and dumbing thing down but the world has moved past such old fassioned notions... It's all automationand AI these days...
 

vc commodore

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Plenty of companies make balancing machines that measure RVF... Hunter's Road Force Elite is just one..

The fact that many tyre shops may have not updated their equipment to new (probably more idiot proof) machines that measure everything is a little sad. It's even sadder considering you've said a few times that many of the young staff that operate these machines just don't care to do their job to a high standard. Such machines could take the "don't give a shite" attitude out of the equation and result in a better outcome for the customer :rolleyes: Guess the newer better wheel balancing machines are rather cost :eek:

Me, I've always perfer knowledge and skill over automation and dumbing thing down but the world has moved past such old fassioned notions... It's all automationand AI these days...
Even having a new balancer still requires the youngins to actually give a but unfortunately it's not to be, which is a damn shame....

As for updating....It's all about price....I vaguely remember one of my bosses about 10 years ago bought a new one at a cost of $15K...I can only imagine the price is well about that now.....And yes skill wins out everytime when it comes to problem solving:)
 

87VLCALAIS

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If you read the Holden workshop manual it tells you to check for runout using a dial caliper when you replace the rotors. If the runout is above a certain figure you need to take the rotor off and keep rotating it relative to the hub, until you get the least amount of runout.

I suspect very few people do this.

Is it possible that there is excess runout and this wobble is causing the vibration due to the pads being bumped about by the rotor? I suspect the pads will be moved away from the rotor and stay clear and any vibration would only occur with the brake pedal depressed. But worth a thought anyway.
 

mirrabucca

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Got any mates you can borrow 2 wheels off?
Have you tried swapping rear to front?
I had a similar problem many years ago. Got mags for my car, got a set of tyres fitted. Vibration at about 100 k's.
Took it back, rebalanced, but we found the tyres were either spot on, or out by the same amount.
Rebalanced, drove it, still the same. Took it back, again, some were out, some ok.
So I got the bloke to balance a wheel, then take the wheel off the balancer, turn it 180 degrees (4 stud). Yep! What was spot on, was now out.
The bloke was using a 4 stud adapter. The 4 studs were not concentric to the centre of the balancer. "First time I've ever seen that!" says the guy.
He got another adapter, rebalanced all the wheels (yes, all out by the same amount). Once balanced they were great. No vibrations.
 

vc commodore

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Got any mates you can borrow 2 wheels off?
Have you tried swapping rear to front?
I had a similar problem many years ago. Got mags for my car, got a set of tyres fitted. Vibration at about 100 k's.
Took it back, rebalanced, but we found the tyres were either spot on, or out by the same amount.
Rebalanced, drove it, still the same. Took it back, again, some were out, some ok.
So I got the bloke to balance a wheel, then take the wheel off the balancer, turn it 180 degrees (4 stud). Yep! What was spot on, was now out.
The bloke was using a 4 stud adapter. The 4 studs were not concentric to the centre of the balancer. "First time I've ever seen that!" says the guy.
He got another adapter, rebalanced all the wheels (yes, all out by the same amount). Once balanced they were great. No vibrations.

So if the adaptor wasn't concentric to the balancer, that means the wheel wasn't concentric either....The adaptor has holes drilled in them for the fingers to fit into....So if you turn the adaptor 180 degrees and it being not concentric, that would mean the fingers would no longer line up with the wheel stud holes...
 

mirrabucca

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So if the adaptor wasn't concentric to the balancer, that means the wheel wasn't concentric either....The adaptor has holes drilled in them for the fingers to fit into....So if you turn the adaptor 180 degrees and it being not concentric, that would mean the fingers would no longer line up with the wheel stud holes...
Correct, up to the point about not lining up with the stud holes in the wheel. There's no centering spigot on the adapter, just the 4 studs. The wheel was bolted onto the adapter with 4 nuts, similar to the original wheel nuts from the car. The adapter (as I recal - it was the 70's...) mounted on the spindle of the balancer. So, the PCD of the 4 studs of the adapter wasn't concentric to the balancer spindle. So when the wheel was balanced, it was actually out of balance on the car. If you balance the wheel on the balancer with the adapter, get it balanced, then take the wheel off the dapater and turn it 180 degrees, the balance will be out.
 

vc commodore

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Correct, up to the point about not lining up with the stud holes in the wheel. There's no centering spigot on the adapter, just the 4 studs. The wheel was bolted onto the adapter with 4 nuts, similar to the original wheel nuts from the car. The adapter (as I recal - it was the 70's...) mounted on the spindle of the balancer. So, the PCD of the 4 studs of the adapter wasn't concentric to the balancer spindle. So when the wheel was balanced, it was actually out of balance on the car. If you balance the wheel on the balancer with the adapter, get it balanced, then take the wheel off the dapater and turn it 180 degrees, the balance will be out.
This still doesn't make sense.....You bolt a wheel upto an adaptor, it can't not be concentric .....A rim has evenly spaced holes, be it 4 5 or 10.....The only way it can be not concentric is if the rim is not concentric....You have already said, the adaptor is similar to bolting it upto a car....So do you see where the contradiction comes into play?

As for the centreing spigot....hummm...Seeing you're referring to the 70's, have a sticky at rims from the 70's and 80's on the cars from that era....You will see the rims are actually held only by the wheel nuts, not by the drum boss....It is accentuated by mag wheels more so that factory wheels....So that doesn't really come into play

Anyways, these days, 99% of tyre shops have adaptors which use fingers.....These fingers actually locate the rim on the adaptor plate, so the rim can't move providing the adaptor is on tight....



.
 

mirrabucca

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This still doesn't make sense.....You bolt a wheel upto an adaptor, it can't not be concentric .....A rim has evenly spaced holes, be it 4 5 or 10.....The only way it can be not concentric is if the rim is not concentric....You have already said, the adaptor is similar to bolting it upto a car....So do you see where the contradiction comes into play?

As for the centreing spigot....hummm...Seeing you're referring to the 70's, have a sticky at rims from the 70's and 80's on the cars from that era....You will see the rims are actually held only by the wheel nuts, not by the drum boss....It is accentuated by mag wheels more so that factory wheels....So that doesn't really come into play

Anyways, these days, 99% of tyre shops have adaptors which use fingers.....These fingers actually locate the rim on the adaptor plate, so the rim can't move providing the adaptor is on tight....



.
As I said, it was in the 70's. But the circle made by the 4 studs wasn't centered with the centre line of the shaft of the balancing machine.
So if you measure from the centre of the shaft to one stud, the distance to the opposite stud was different.
But that doesn't help the OP.
 

Pollushon

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This is why you have finger or hub balancing and never the twain shall meet. Finger balance a hubcentric wheel and it will vibrate. Hub balance a lugcentric wheel and it will vibrate. On the balancer it will look million bucks every time.

I went through hell getting the rims in my profile pic balanced
 
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