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Change FE2 to FE3 in SSV

Pablito

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Depends how you do it.
Poorer handling is a given, but the other stuff (harsher or smoother ride, more or less body roll, etc) depends on what you’re doing to raise it.
I just thought I'd ask as i don't know whether it's as simple as a spring change or if all new everything is required.
Sunday cruises and the occasional longer trip with the family is all i do.
Realistically, a Calais would have been the more appropriate purchase for the type of driving i do. But the look of the Redline was so much better to me than the Calais and they had one there i could have straight away so i took it.
I find that it's just that little bit low and that some car parks have been an issue over the years.
So i guess what I'm saying is I'd be happy with Calais ride height and handling......even 10 or 15mm higher like the standard SS would probably do it.
The series 2 VF Redline's look to sit quite high compared to series 1.
 

Tryg

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I just thought I'd ask as i don't know whether it's as simple as a spring change or if all new everything is required.
Sunday cruises and the occasional longer trip with the family is all i do.
Realistically, a Calais would have been the more appropriate purchase for the type of driving i do. But the look of the Redline was so much better to me than the Calais and they had one there i could have straight away so i took it.
I find that it's just that little bit low and that some car parks have been an issue over the years.
So i guess what I'm saying is I'd be happy with Calais ride height and handling......
The series 2 VF Redline's look to sit quite high compared to series 1.
I agree, even stock my Redline seems to touch down over higher lay-backs in Toowoomba. I enjoy the looks, but I too wanted a fairly plush ride...coming from a 2015 Chrysler 300C Luxury. The fact that they had a white Redline with the W375 package on the floor, with optional black roof, was an easy sell to someone like me!
 

Pablito

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I agree, even stock my Redline seems to touch down over higher lay-backs in Toowoomba. I enjoy the looks, but I too wanted a fairly plush ride...coming from a 2015 Chrysler 300C Luxury. The fact that they had a white Redline with the W375 package on the floor, with optional black roof, was an easy sell to someone like me!
Yes, how could you say no?!
Similar story here. I went in with intentions of a black Calais and left in a white Redline.
 

monstar

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......what about doing the opposite to the OP?
What would be involved in raising the height of VF1 FE3 a little bit?
I think swapping springs to give you 40mm more height makes FA difference in handling, you won’t notice the change before body roll, no. Kings catalogue has of options to do just that.
Zeta was designed to accomodate much higher ride height with AWD, so the roll centre range (SAE method) of our zeta doesn’t alter significantly with height to guard range from 410 mm down to 330 mm. I run this height variance regularly.
So FE3 370 rear to 390 (20mm) definitely won’t notice a change to handling (as in altering roll centre) as much as say increasing track with typical 35mm offset aftermarket alloys.
 

Pablito

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I think swapping springs to give you 40mm more height makes FA difference in handling, you won’t notice the change before body roll, no. Kings catalogue has of options to do just that.
Zeta was designed to accomodate much higher ride height with AWD, so the roll centre range (SAE method) of our zeta doesn’t alter significantly with height to guard range from 410 mm down to 330 mm. I run this height variance regularly.
So FE3 370 rear to 390 (20mm) definitely won’t notice a change to handling (as in altering roll centre) as much as say increasing track with typical 35mm offset aftermarket alloys.
Thanks for that. I had a look at the King site. I take it these measurements people are giving are from centre of rim up to peak of guard?
I took the opportunity while at a relos place and grabbed the tape out and took some measurements. The vf redline was 380mm front and rear. Their VE calais was 400 front and rear and VE omega 410 front, 420 rear.
I'm assuming the King springs standard height spring would be for Omega? I'll just have to suss out which King springs are going to get that 400 height of the Calais.
 

DanielSS-V

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Yeah I've seen the same about the rear passegers ride being easier to live with. I don't recall reading or hearing it wouldn't be as quick around a track, but that's journo nonsense.
For what it's worth, I own a VF Redline and an MSE. My Son has a VE Redline Sportwagon. I have also driven a few VF2 Redline sedans. In my experience:
My VF Redline has a more compliant ride an handles better than the VE Redline Sportwagon. My VF Redline springs have settled a lot since new. It looks lowered and has more bodyroll, yet still handles great. It is softer than VF2 now, but may have been similar when new. The VF2 Redline handles better than the VF Redline. Ride is perhaps a little firm. The Motorsport with MRC trumps them all in handling and ride comfort, depending on mode. Except the VF Redline. It has the most comfortable ride of them all.
@wetwork65 I think you answered your own question mate. Upgading shocks and springs, but leaving standard sway bars, would give an improvement. But it would be less of an improvemet than If you changed out the bars too.

Thanks for that. :) Great to read your perspective, given your access to the different cars. Off topic, but always been curious about this from someone who has the cars to compare. How would you compare the characteristics of the L77 vs LS3? We always read about 0-100 speeds, but I am more interested in difference in how they drive in daily driving, city and on the open road? Big differences or more subtle?
 

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^ Comparing factory cars, I don’t know how easily you can do that; stock LS3 cars have almost all had taller diff gearing than any of the 6L cars, which would give more immediate acceleration if you fitted the same gearing to one of the 6L cars.

Everyone who’s compared the two has said that in normal driving-around the LS3 cars feel/sound easily like they’ve got that extra 10% (or more) power ... but how much of that feeling is gearing?
 

426Cuda

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Thanks for that. :) Great to read your perspective, given your access to the different cars. Off topic, but always been curious about this from someone who has the cars to compare. How would you compare the characteristics of the L77 vs LS3? We always read about 0-100 speeds, but I am more interested in difference in how they drive in daily driving, city and on the open road? Big differences or more subtle?
Yes it's an interesting comparison alright.
To add to the mix, my Son had a stock L98 SSV ute in manual. They had what, 3.45:1 diff ratio?
The LS3 has 4000K's on the clock now and has really livened up. It has a lot more poke down low, and mid range. Tromp it from standsill and it lays rubber. None of our stock L77' s did that. They were sluggish and doughy down low in stock trim. The VF2 is a tighter package all round. Of course I'm comparing a stock Motorsport to a modified VF Redline.
There's been quite a bit of heated debate on here in the recent past about the LS3 vs L77. I am not keen to rekindle that. It really doesn't interest me what the numbers say the engines should or shouldn't do. I am interested in how the cars drive. To answer your question. From a seat of the pants perspective, yes its a significant difference. The VF2 in my experience drives better and the LS3 with its extra 43kw and torque over the factory claimed figures for an auto VF Redline, combined with the 3.27:1 diff, are a big part of why. Although at times the 2.92:1 in the VF allows it to drop back another gear around certain corners where the VF2 won't. The steering is also significantly better in the VF2.
 

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^ Comparing factory cars, I don’t know how easily you can do that; stock LS3 cars have almost all had taller diff gearing than any of the 6L cars, which would give more immediate acceleration if you fitted the same gearing to one of the 6L cars.

Everyone who’s compared the two has said that in normal driving-around the LS3 cars feel/sound easily like they’ve got that extra 10% (or more) power ... but how much of that feeling is gearing?
Also given same engine output in the real world, the impact and importance of tuning the power transmission / modifying torque control?
The trans tunes are wildly different, highly modifiable. Stock trans tune different models different focus over the years.
 
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