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[Alloytec] Designing tuned length alloytec 190 extractors

AirStrike

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Props for giving it a go, but on a N/A V6 is it really worth the time/effort? I say no. If you drove it with your custom setup or a set of off the shelf pipes I doubt you could pick the difference.
 

SJM38S

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Good on ya for having a go! Why not use your skill, time and resources to do something which interests you! Can't wait to see dyno results :)
 

chargedvx6

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Props for giving it a go, but on a N/A V6 is it really worth the time/effort? I say no. If you drove it with your custom setup or a set of off the shelf pipes I doubt you could pick the difference.

Supercharge it and see if the stock manifolds are adequate.
 

0081

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Props for giving it a go, but on a N/A V6 is it really worth the time/effort? I say no. If you drove it with your custom setup or a set of off the shelf pipes I doubt you could pick the difference.

What is worth it???? Supercharged or turbo v6 supercharged or twin turbo v8??? Lambo v12 conversion. If you want to do it it's worth it in my opinion. Everyone has there reasons for what they do and so be it.

I'm keen to see the results and i don't even have that motor in my car..
 

kuzman89

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Loving the effort on this so far, have you got facebook man? Would love to have a bit of a chat. Dont see why its not "worth" it either, its a hobby, worth as much as you want to put in to it.
 

Not_An_Abba_Fan

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I don't know how I missed this thread originally.

Props for giving it a go. Although 'm of the opinion that you won't notice any improvement over an off the shelf set.

Extractors, to be 100% effective, only work to their maximum efficiency at the rev range they are designed for. Even then, on a dyno, changing the length of the primaries makes very little difference on a stock engine.

Building the extractors to suit your rev range is one thing, as soon as you bolt up an exhaust system to them, you negate all that work. Not only do you have to take into account exhaust pulse, but also the effect of heat loss. You will need to keep the extractors as hot as possible to aid flow, and the further the exhaust gets from the engine, the cooler it gets and the less volume it has. Even as little as the length of the primaries will affect flow due to heat loss. The merge collector and reduction at the flange are the best compromise to this as it helps keeping the gas velocity up. What you really need to do though is measure the percentage loss of heat from the outlet of the exhaust port to the merge collector at your specified rev range and match the pipe size accordingly. EG if the exhaust loses 15% heat, the pipe size has to be 15% smaller to maintain velocity.

You also need to take into account intake temps and velocity. A change in intake air temp will affect exhaust velocity as well. As the temp rises, the exhaust velocity will reduce as there will be less bang due to less a dense O2 charge.

Vehicle engineers have very specific software to calculate all this to make the engine run as efficiently as possible on the street, race applications are completely different. What you are doing is more of a race application where the revs will be consistent, on the street this will never happen.

Well done on a good exercise though, they will look impressive.
 

OS-Mike

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Loving the effort on this so far, have you got facebook man? Would love to have a bit of a chat. Dont see why its not "worth" it either, its a hobby, worth as much as you want to put in to it.

Sorry for the late reply yea iv got facebook youll find me under Michael Jarden or mike@drifta. co. nz Im always keen to chat about cars and making parts for them at the moment im trying to design pressure wave termination boxes to get the most out of the extractors but with vortexes in the end so the sound waves hit each other and hopefully it works like a noise cancelling muffler as well.
 

OS-Mike

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I don't know how I missed this thread originally.

Props for giving it a go. Although 'm of the opinion that you won't notice any improvement over an off the shelf set.

Extractors, to be 100% effective, only work to their maximum efficiency at the rev range they are designed for. Even then, on a dyno, changing the length of the primaries makes very little difference on a stock engine.

Building the extractors to suit your rev range is one thing, as soon as you bolt up an exhaust system to them, you negate all that work. Not only do you have to take into account exhaust pulse, but also the effect of heat loss. You will need to keep the extractors as hot as possible to aid flow, and the further the exhaust gets from the engine, the cooler it gets and the less volume it has. Even as little as the length of the primaries will affect flow due to heat loss. The merge collector and reduction at the flange are the best compromise to this as it helps keeping the gas velocity up. What you really need to do though is measure the percentage loss of heat from the outlet of the exhaust port to the merge collector at your specified rev range and match the pipe size accordingly. EG if the exhaust loses 15% heat, the pipe size has to be 15% smaller to maintain velocity.

You also need to take into account intake temps and velocity. A change in intake air temp will affect exhaust velocity as well. As the temp rises, the exhaust velocity will reduce as there will be less bang due to less a dense O2 charge.

Vehicle engineers have very specific software to calculate all this to make the engine run as efficiently as possible on the street, race applications are completely different. What you are doing is more of a race application where the revs will be consistent, on the street this will never happen.

Well done on a good exercise though, they will look impressive.

Cheers for your input iv taken a few notes and yea im making a proper exhaust system to go with them. Im still trying to workout the best position to place the 4 o2 sensors there must be some way of working out where they will work best any ideas?
 

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Quick update

To those asking is it worth the effort HELL YEAH just to learn something new and there's plenty of other reasons like being able to sit back and say yip i designed and built those from scratch. I must say though it is a lot of effort but well worth it.

finally got some welding done L/H side almost done R/H side just started hopefully i get them finished this weekend iv got some good pics but cant find my camera cable at the moment so heres a couple off my phone.

P310113_2030_01_zps296b15f3.jpg


P310113_2030_zpsce5fc126.jpg


P310113_2033_zps5822d7dd.jpg


P310113_2033_01_zpsd2fe104e.jpg


And i might have to start another thread for the exhaust system its starting to get interesting.
 
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