Just Commodores Forum Community

It takes just a moment to join our fantastic community

Register

Fuel injector failure

Discussion in 'VF Holden Commodore (2013 - 2017)' started by jono67, Nov 20, 2018.

  1. Tumble_roll

    Tumble_roll Member

    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2017
    Location:
    Toowoomba
    Members Ride:
    Vf1 ssv redline
    Thanks. could you confirm for me which holden dealership that you are dealing through if you dont mind me asking ?

    Cheers for the info.
     
  2. Anthony121

    Anthony121 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,296
    Likes Received:
    646
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2014
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Members Ride:
    VF SSV Redline MY17 & VF Director
    I checked all mine today. All within 14 ohms but the redline runs rough. The other car runs smooth and a couple of those injectors were about 15 ohms
     
  3. Daniel Souza

    Daniel Souza Active Member

    Messages:
    186
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2017
    Location:
    Glenwood
    Members Ride:
    VF2 Wagon SSV Redline
    Service manual states injectors should be between 11 and 14 ohms. If outside the spec replace it.


    Remember injectors can have electrical, mechanical and fluidics issue. The resistance can be in spec but the mechanics inside of it might be failing .Furthermore The fuel path inside the injector can be partially blocked.
    I would check for misfires on the scan tool and if any detected , swapp spark plugs and leads between cylinder with misfire and a good one.
     
  4. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,898
    Likes Received:
    1,472
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2018
    Location:
    Downunder
    Members Ride:
    Commodore Motorsport
    ^ yes, but on the electrical side it’s not just resistance.

    With any coil used to create a magnetic force, inductance and reluctance plays a big part in how well the system works. With petrol injectors, since they use a magnetic forces to move the pintle, the same inductance and reluctance issues are important in design. Diesel injectors on the other hand use pizo crystal injectors which use a different principle.

    Thing is, these full electrical characteristics are sometimes not specified well enough, even in manufacture. So if an injector is built to poorly specified electrical charictaristics, where inductance and reluctance is not well specified, the injector may not work reliably though the coil resistance, which is easy to measure, may still be within specs. This can be a big problem.

    Sadly inductance and especially reluctance is difficult to measure and the poor tech only has a simple resistance measurement to go by, which may be ok yet the car doesn’t always run well. For some customers, this may result in a poorly running car and a fight to get things resolved. For others where the injector resistance is outside spec, it a simple replacement.

    End result is that Holden has an issue to resolve and at the end of the day Bosch will have to pay for these dodgy injectors so hopefully they get to the bottom of it and all problem injectors are replaced.
     
    rognvald261 and BJR470 like this.
  5. revster

    revster Active Member

    Messages:
    542
    Likes Received:
    220
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2014
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Members Ride:
    30th Anniversary HSV Senator (Gone) MY19 Golf R
    Am my conclusions correct. The HSVs with the LSA have larger injectors from stock. It seems all the issues are I have read about are not from LSA engines. In any event I now have even larger injectors with the Walky upgrade. I assume the injector issue is nothing for me to be concerned about?
     
  6. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,898
    Likes Received:
    1,472
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2018
    Location:
    Downunder
    Members Ride:
    Commodore Motorsport
    @revster I’ve only read this thread on injector issues and from memory it only impacted LS3’s so likely not a issue for your LFA’s bigger injectors. But if you have idle issues, look at @Daniel Souza’s post 35 & 36 on page 2 as a method for isolating the problem ;)
     
    revster likes this.
  7. Gaz888

    Gaz888 New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2016
    Location:
    Camden - NSW
    Members Ride:
    VF II SS-V Redline Utility
    Hi All
    My story from 2 weeks ago with my 2016 VF II SS Redline Ute.
    Remote started vehicle when I noticed it turned itself off after a couple of mins. Turned it back on while in the car to notice if running rough and then after a few seconds engine light and alert message Service ESP. Got it booked in with my local Holden dealership the next day who replaced injector 7. Car is good since and still on the same take of fuel (Caltex Vortex 98).
     
  8. Daniel Souza

    Daniel Souza Active Member

    Messages:
    186
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2017
    Location:
    Glenwood
    Members Ride:
    VF2 Wagon SSV Redline
    @Gaz888 , keep and eye on the other injectors in my opinion they should have replaced all. They know it was not just an outlier it is a trend which is happening way to often.
     
    Skylarking likes this.
  9. BJR470

    BJR470 New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2019
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Members Ride:
    VF series ii SSV Redline
    Hey, I’m up the same creek without a paddle with my 2015 SSV Redline as well.
    2nd injector died whilst on holidays and is at dealers now, trying for good will to get them all replaced. Was told that holden have now mentioned that after a January conference, if an injector fails, they all need to be replaced.
    Waiting on that phone call, no replacement car either
     
  10. BJR470

    BJR470 New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2019
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Members Ride:
    VF series ii SSV Redline
     
  11. BJR470

    BJR470 New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2019
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Members Ride:
    VF series ii SSV Redline
    Mate, same problem as you, did you get an answer yet? Mine was so bad it’s also blowing white smoke ( unburnt fuel ).
     
  12. Daniel Souza

    Daniel Souza Active Member

    Messages:
    186
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2017
    Location:
    Glenwood
    Members Ride:
    VF2 Wagon SSV Redline
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2019
    Skylarking and panhead like this.
  13. rognvald261

    rognvald261 Active Member

    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2019
    Location:
    Perth
    Members Ride:
    VE SS A6
    I skimmed through, but did not see the part number of the injectors by Siemens?
    All L76, L98, LS3, L77 and LS7 are made by Bosch, GM part number 12576341, never heard any complaints with several hundreds of thousands of km heavy duty. Bosch ID# 0280158051 42#
     
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2019
  14. Wayne001

    Wayne001 Active Member

    Messages:
    208
    Likes Received:
    28
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2017
    Location:
    Meadow springs
    Members Ride:
    Vf calais
    My l77 does not have bosch , it has ac delco injectors .
     
  15. BJR470

    BJR470 New Member

    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    Joined:
    Jan 29, 2019
    Location:
    Brisbane
    Members Ride:
    VF series ii SSV Redline
    Got call back today, Holden are replacing all 8 injectors under good will. Also got told I have a bent pushrod in cyl 1.
    I know for a fact that was not done by me, car has always sounded a little rough, now I know why.
    Car should be back on the road by friday
     
  16. rognvald261

    rognvald261 Active Member

    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2019
    Location:
    Perth
    Members Ride:
    VE SS A6
    OK, I think Bosch make the injectors just like the spark leads and O2 sensors, NGK make the plugs, Cloyes make the timing gear, Delphi makes the lifters, etc.
    I think they are all available though AC Delco, which used to be a division of GM like Mopar or Motorcraft.
    Can you tell me the date mm/yy of your car manufacture, as it seems the injectors you ordered supersede the Series II VE and perhaps it is those which are now causing problems through failure.
     
  17. Wayne001

    Wayne001 Active Member

    Messages:
    208
    Likes Received:
    28
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2017
    Location:
    Meadow springs
    Members Ride:
    Vf calais
    Mine is 2013 calais not sure of the month . These are the ones i get from america .
     

    Attached Files:

  18. rognvald261

    rognvald261 Active Member

    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2019
    Location:
    Perth
    Members Ride:
    VE SS A6
    Thanks for that, just trying to nail down the break when the (non-failing) injectors were revised from 12576341 to (failing) 12639221.
    Seems it was 2013 model year, assuming your old injectors are same?
     
  19. Daniel Souza

    Daniel Souza Active Member

    Messages:
    186
    Likes Received:
    108
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2017
    Location:
    Glenwood
    Members Ride:
    VF2 Wagon SSV Redline
  20. rognvald261

    rognvald261 Active Member

    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    63
    Trophy Points:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2019
    Location:
    Perth
    Members Ride:
    VE SS A6
    Just read “bent pushrod” on a factory motor with hydraulic lifters and low ramp cam... nup. Did you have the rockers replaced per chance?
     

Share This Page