Gas

[HamaTime™]

what's duel fuel?

Duel Fuel, you've got to be kidding me asking a question like that, car can run on LPG or petrol....

If you talked about CO2 emissions you'd be right, but all other emissions are less, parts wear out quicker? only valves and seats that arent designed for them

Ok well I'm not a mechanic, so I can't tell you the exact parts that wear out quicker and all that. It is common knowledge that gas is not healthy for your car. If it was, tell me this. Why isn't every car manufacturer producing all they're cars on LPG only. If petrol is so expensive and gas is just as clean for your car and more environmentally friendly and more than half the price of petrol. Why hasn't the whole world changed to running all cars off LPG. Why is petrol still being sold. The whole idea of LPG is a cheaper less efficient, fuel. it damages the engine more than petrol and is less efficient. Also, if only valves and seats that aren't designed for gas are the only things that wear out, why aren't they replaced to make them better for gas....?

^ that also answers your question, name one person on this forum that would 100% say that LPG is a better fuel than unleaded or high octane petrol. Why are cars and LPG systems referred to as 'BBQ'? its a crude fuel used for your barbeque...its not an A grade car performance fuel.

Same for me, but then again if that was the case I wouldnt even need to drive a car.

Why wouldn't you need to drive a car? if you had heaps of money, thats not going to automatically teleport you somewhere!!

I have never heard someone say that LPG is a better fuel than petrol. most people including me only have it because it is cheaper...I was never debating that fact, I was merely outlining the pros and cons of LPG systems. of course this guy is going to put LPG on his car as he has already said. But at least he is wiser to the idea of duel fuel and LPG cars and systems

 

[bigfut]

In respect to the first system (the tapped air intake - which is what I have on my VS), you lose about 20% power and 20 - 30% economy, due to the nature of LPG and the system in which it is injected and burnt. I have a 75 litre gas tank in my boot (you can only fill gas tanks to 80% of they're capacity to allow for expansion and other safety factors) so this turns out to be around 60 litres full capacity. I get around 250 k's out of a tank of gas, and I don't give it a bootful, rarely do I ever get above 4000rpm...

I would seriously get your car checked out, that is some really bad economy there, especially never giving it a bootful

 

[HamaTime™]

thats just gas mate...my mates VR Wagon gets the same, my mates VS SS gets a little more....maybe 300k's, mates VT gets around 300..., mates VX Berlina gets around 250

LPG is not efficient around the city man, I spend over 4-5 hours each week in peak hour traffic, bumper to bumper...gas is not economical in these situations...long cruises its fine, I got to Albury and back...had just under 1/4 of a tank left...

 

[bigfut]

Wondered how long it would take for an argument in this thread to start

Ok well I'm not a mechanic, so I can't tell you the exact parts that wear out quicker and all that. It is common knowledge that gas is not healthy for your car. If it was, tell me this. Why isn't every car manufacturer producing all they're cars on LPG only. If petrol is so expensive and gas is just as clean for your car and more environmentally friendly and more than half the price of petrol. Why hasn't the whole world changed to running all cars off LPG. Why is petrol still being sold. The whole idea of LPG is a cheaper less efficient, fuel. it damages the engine more than petrol and is less efficient. Also, if only valves and seats that aren't designed for gas are the only things that wear out, why aren't they replaced to make them better for gas....?

^ that also answers your question, name one person on this forum that would 100% say that LPG is a better fuel than unleaded or high octane petrol. Why are cars and LPG systems referred to as 'BBQ'? its a crude fuel used for your barbeque...its not an A grade car performance fuel.

I have never heard someone say that LPG is a better fuel than petrol. most people including me only have it because it is cheaper...I was never debating that fact, I was merely outlining the pros and cons of LPG systems.

Is it actually common knowledge that gas is bad for your car or just another anti lpg comment made by people who dont like what they dont know about? These "unworthy" cars you speak of such as taxi's, courier vans etc do hundreds of thousands of kms generally being used harder than normal passenger cars, without self destructing or needing parts replaced due to lpg killing them. I have seen courier vans with 500,000kms on them, still going strong, taxis with similar milage, and they dont seem to have issues, so I cannot see an issue with putting a car which does minimal kms in comparison to these on gas.
If its so bad then why do Holden and Ford provide warranties on their lpg vehicles, surely if it was bad for them, they wouldnt dare offer that?

Cars are made to demands, simple as that. Most people want a petrol car, thats economical, and cheap, and lpg adds cost, so not for everyone. Hence thats what we have. Fleet buyers are starting to want large cars that are cheap to run, so we now see lpg falcons and commodores to suit. Lpg is not everyones cup a tea, so they dont make them like that. Also another point is if everyone was on lpg, it would run out quicker much like petrol which would result in price rises, so with the current lpg cars in the market, its good for us who use it, yes?

Emission wise CO2 outputs are important, and LPG cuts it by 10% at the exhaust, but apparently LPG has 90% less NOx than petrol and virtually zero particulate emissions, so that has to be good right?

I am a person that is on this forum, and wouldnt hesitate to recommend lpg. In my experience it is reliable, good for my car, and cheap. My oil was never black like it was at the end of 10,000kms like petrol either.

I have even seen an dedicated lpg dragster in nz, along with competition 4wd's (V6 & V8) using it, so again if it was bad would they use it?

I admit people have different experiences with lpg, some sh*t, some great. Could be to do with a bad installer, or the fuel as some people believe. All I can argue & offer is my experiences with it, all good.

 

[bigfut]

thats just gas mate...my mates VR Wagon gets the same, my mates VS SS gets a little more....maybe 300k's, mates VT gets around 300..., mates VX Berlina gets around 250

LPG is not efficient around the city man, I spend over 4-5 hours each week in peak hour traffic, bumper to bumper...gas is not economical in these situations...long cruises its fine, I got to Albury and back...had just under 1/4 of a tank left...

Thats surprising, our vx could get 4-500 in city driving, but not rush hour. Interesting

 

[HamaTime™]

Wondered how long it would take for an argument in this thread to start



Is it actually common knowledge that gas is bad for your car or just another anti lpg comment made by people who dont like what they dont know about? These "unworthy" cars you speak of such as taxi's, courier vans etc do hundreds of thousands of kms generally being used harder than normal passenger cars, without self destructing or needing parts replaced due to lpg killing them. I have seen courier vans with 500,000kms on them, still going strong, taxis with similar milage, and they dont seem to have issues, so I cannot see an issue with putting a car which does minimal kms in comparison to these on gas.
If its so bad then why do Holden and Ford provide warranties on their lpg vehicles, surely if it was bad for them, they wouldnt dare offer that?

Cars are made to demands, simple as that. Most people want a petrol car, thats economical, and cheap, and lpg adds cost, so not for everyone. Hence thats what we have. Fleet buyers are starting to want large cars that are cheap to run, so we now see lpg falcons and commodores to suit. Lpg is not everyones cup a tea, so they dont make them like that. Also another point is if everyone was on lpg, it would run out quicker much like petrol which would result in price rises, so with the current lpg cars in the market, its good for us who use it, yes?

Emission wise CO2 outputs are important, and LPG cuts it by 10% at the exhaust, but apparently LPG has 90% less NOx than petrol and virtually zero particulate emissions, so that has to be good right?

I am a person that is on this forum, and wouldnt hesitate to recommend lpg. In my experience it is reliable, good for my car, and cheap. My oil was never black like it was at the end of 10,000kms like petrol either.

I have even seen an dedicated lpg dragster in nz, along with competition 4wd's (V6 & V8) using it, so again if it was bad would they use it?

I admit people have different experiences with lpg, some sh*t, some great. Could be to do with a bad installer, or the fuel as some people believe. All I can argue & offer is my experiences with it, all good.

Ok I think everyone has misunderstood me, I too reccommend gas to everyone. I am well aware of the fact that taxi's and vans do have minimal problems with 500,000 on the clock or more. as I said before, I have gas on my car, I love it, at least the cost side of it, costs me $20 a week ,compared to $70 or $80. My only complaint with gas is that it is less efficient, sluggish and less powerful. Other than that it is great. I have never driven a direct injection LPG car so I can't argue for or against it. I know for a fact that HSV are looking into the future about producing a whole range of dedicated LPG cars. great, nice and cost effective.

The purpose of my last few posts is to outline the pro's and con's with gas. The pro's outweighed the con's in my case, hence why I have my car on Duel Fuel, and I can safely say that that is why every single LPG car owner says the same. I'm not a mechanic so I can't give technical descriptions of how bad it is for your car in detail. My mechanic and a host of other places including the highly respected company that did my conversion told me that gas has 80% efficiency and power compared to petrol...bla bla bla as I all stated before, and specifically told me that gas does do more damage to your car compared to petrol, but as long as its serviced on time and kept in good conditions, there will be no complaints...(this may sound like a scam to keep me coming back and buying stuff, but its what a host of other sources have told me)

although, Given the choice i would run my car on high octane fuel all day every day...

 

[bigfut]

Its funny who you speak to and who tells you what. The installer who did ours, said how great it was for your car, how it cleaned the oil almost (explained how if you didnt change your oil, it would go clear rather than gold), etc etc, but then your installer told you the opposite. Will we ever know the truth? lol

 

[HamaTime™]

Its funny who you speak to and who tells you what. The installer who did ours, said how great it was for your car, how it cleaned the oil almost (explained how if you didnt change your oil, it would go clear rather than gold), etc etc, but then your installer told you the opposite. Will we ever know the truth? lol

lol!!!!!

oh well...there will always be two sides to a truth that seems plain...just depends which side of the fence you sit on

 

[commsirac]

Duel Fuel, you've got to be kidding me asking a question like that, car can run on LPG or petrol....

Really, so what is dual fuel?

Ok well I'm not a mechanic,

Shucks, you had me fooled.:whistling

If it was, tell me this. Why isn't every car manufacturer producing all they're cars on LPG only. If petrol is so expensive and gas is just as clean for your car and more environmentally friendly and more than half the price of petrol. Why hasn't the whole world changed to running all cars off LPG. Why is petrol still being sold. The whole idea of LPG is a cheaper less efficient, fuel. it damages the engine more than petrol and is less efficient. Also, if only valves and seats that aren't designed for gas are the only things that wear out, why aren't they replaced to make them better for gas....?

Car manufacturers dont care whether its clean or not, they'd only care if they couldnt meet the current emission regs with petrol. It costs more to make a car run on lpg, the tank cant be put anywhere being one of the major drawbacks. Car manufacturers only want to build what sells, lpg even in this country is not available everywhere and many consumers wouldnt touch it(for good or bad reasons).
LPG supplies the world over arent as plentiful as Australia.
LPG burns just as efficiently in current combustion engines as does petrol, it burns even more efficiently if the engine is designed for lpg with higher compression ratio.
You are confusing the efficiency of combustion with the fact that per unit volume lpg has 24% less energy than petrol. So if you are measuring the volume of fuel, the lpg usage will be higher, however, if you are measuring the weight of the fuel, petrol use will be higher.
Typically motors that are built for unleaded petrol are fine for lpg and the head components last just as long, in older leaded petrol motors motors rebuilt for gas have this mod done.

.although, Given the choice i would run my car on high octane fuel all day every day... ...

You have got a lot to learn, have you looked up the octane rating of lpg?

 

[HamaTime™]

Shucks, you had me fooled.:whistling


Car manufacturers dont care whether its clean or not, they'd only care if they couldnt meet the current emission regs with petrol. It costs more to make a car run on lpg, the tank cant be put anywhere being one of the major drawbacks. Car manufacturers only want to build what sells, lpg even in this country is not available everywhere and many consumers wouldnt touch it(for good or bad reasons).
LPG supplies the world over arent as plentiful as Australia.
LPG burns just as efficiently in current combustion engines as does petrol, it burns even more efficiently if the engine is designed for lpg with higher compression ratio.
You are confusing the efficiency of combustion with the fact that per unit volume lpg has 24% less energy than petrol. So if you are measuring the volume of fuel, the lpg usage will be higher, however, if you are measuring the weight of the fuel, petrol use will be higher.
Typically motors that are built for unleaded petrol are fine for lpg and the head components last just as long, in older leaded petrol motors motors rebuilt for gas have this mod done.

You have got a lot to learn, have you looked up the octane rating of lpg?

ok well there is no need to be rude about it

and i'm not going to try and persuade you or prove to you anything, so if you want to believe that LPG is the perfect fuel and solution then thats fine...it's not the perfect solution though

I know LPG has a high octane rating, still doesn't prove anything...

Really, so what is dual fuel?

wtf?