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_R_J_K_

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If you hit someone, no matter how slow, if in the wrong spot, with or without ABS brakes, they can die....Your school bus scenario....My line of thought is, school bus, chance of kid running out behind it, off the loud pedal, foot hovering over the brake pedal...What your post insinuates is, school bus, stay at a steady speed, because if a kid ducks out from behind it, I have ABS brakes, so less chance of hitting him...

All these safety features breed complaincy and it really shows with this post.....You get the mind set, I have ABS brakes, so I can stop easier so I don't have to concentrate as hard on my surroundings....I have airbags, so if I hit something, it will help stop injuries...Yes, airbags will prevent and/or minimise injuries, but I'd prefer not to hit something to begin with, which seems to be an idiotic idea...

So yes I have an idiotic mindset, where prevention is better than cure....And all these safety features seem to give the mindset it is a cure not the prevention....

You can lock your brakes up and 40 and below. Well, I can say exactly the same thing about my driving history and style, doesn't really count for anything, but I'm not an all seeing robot like you. And I'd really like to know which part of what I said actually insinuates complaisance or that you should try driving into things with the expectation of being saved. Looking at what you've said the last couple of times in response to people, I'm genuinely kinda starting to think you can't read.

You also didn't answer my last question.
 
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vc commodore

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Well, I can say exactly the same thing about my driving history and style, doesn't really count for anything, but I'm not an all seeing robot like you. And I'd really like to know which part of what I said actually insinuates complaisance or that you should try driving into things with the expectation of being saved. Looking at what you've said the last couple of times in response to people, I'm genuinely kinda starting to think you can't read.

You also didn't answer my last question.

What question was that? I edited my post over teaching my driving.

Driving aids breed complancency...Drumming into their heads you have these aids means they rely on them to not have an accident, when in actual fact, what prevents accidents is not relying on them....

So nope I can't read an yup have idiotic ideas of not relying on safety features to prevent an accident....How stupid of me thinking that way
 

_R_J_K_

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Driving aids breed complancency...Drumming into their heads you have these aids means they rely on them to not have an accident, when in actual fact, what prevents accidents is not relying on them....

Sure, that's exactly what I said.
 

hademall

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Yes as I thought, you probably only read your own stuff to check that you have hammered into the reader what you want them to digest. I just gave the OP some differing advice based on all the advice he had already received. And if you had read his post properly, as I and lots of others seemed to have done, you would clearly understand (although I’m not so sure!) that he was researching other makes and models too.
May I suggest that your apparent inability to accept or respect anyone else’s perspective in regards to advice sought by a young driver or anyone for that matter, without first going into an insult followed by a rant about scrubbed out tyres, ball joints letting go, diff bushes flogging out, industrial deafness due to turned up stereos etc, may be as a result of your not appreciating what anybody else has to offer on account that you honestly believe in your wisdom and advice above all else!
I’m sure the OP didn’t turn to this forum to read put downs and insults etc. He reads like a very sensible lad, with an open minded objective. And hopefully he can make a choice that suits him once he’s taken all the differing advice on board. Once again, I say good luck to Josh in his endeavours.
And to you I say, ‘maybe your deafness is due to you having your fingers in your ears and not wanting to listen to anyone else, or maybe it was all that doof doof, when you were Josh’s age.

You see most of us have experienced that kind of stuff as young drivers, we understand the mistakes we made, and therefore we try to be a bit more protective and nurturing towards the younger people who are needing the advice now.

I do accept your view, that all the so called safety devices on cars are not necessarily a benefit and that some of them are downright distracting. However, there are obviously some safety features which I have no doubt, have possibly saved the lives of thousands of people, but you must understand that not everyone has the same reactions, not everyone sees things as you may do, and so therefore you can’t just make a statement as you did and not expect a reaction.
 

_R_J_K_

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Don't try to use reason, he's made it quite clear his skill means that it's impossible he will be in any future accident (at fault or not) and nobody will ever be able hit him.
 
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J_D 2.0

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No, more along the lines of giving advise to buy a car that has all these safety devices fitted being the best option, when actually buying a car without these devices makes you a better driver.....
Everyone is all super safety officer these days. I reckon half the idiots that you see on the road just don’t give a **** these days as they subconsciously know the car will save them from their own stupidity. Although having said that I do see quite a few stupid motorbike riders too (riding slower than traffic, sitting in cars blind spots etc) so my observation on this might be incorrect.

Having spent the first 10-15 odd years of my driving life in sub $1000 manual transmission **** boxes that would break down on a semi regular basis was a character building experience.

First off I had to learn a manual transmission as an automatic car was out of reach of my finances so if I wanted to drive I couldn’t just do it the lazy way.

Having substandard cars taught me to respect the road and have a healthy scepticism in the other idiots on the road and not trust that they will do the right thing. I had a couple of near misses in the first 6-12 months of driving after I got my licence that scared the **** out of me as I knew if those near misses would have turned bad then I’d most likely not be here as I was in a Datsun 1600 that didn’t even have retractable seatbelts much less airbags etc.

It also taught me to man the F up and learn how to fix my own car otherwise I wasn’t going to be going anywhere on a Friday night! Money to pay a mechanic was non existent in my early years so if I didn’t get off my arse and fix the car myself I was staying at home until I did!

As much as everyone wants to be mollycoddled (and like mollycoddling their children) it reduces resourcefulness and makes you highly dependent on others. My son has already said he wants to have my SV6 when he gets his licence and I’ve decided I’m going to convert it to a manual transmission so he can learn to drive properly.

He will be doing the servicing on it too as having a car is a responsibility, not just something you jump in when you want to use it and palm off onto someone else (a mechanic) when something goes wrong with it.
 

vc commodore

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Yes as I thought, you probably only read your own stuff to check that you have hammered into the reader what you want them to digest. I just gave the OP some differing advice based on all the advice he had already received. And if you had read his post properly, as I and lots of others seemed to have done, you would clearly understand (although I’m not so sure!) that he was researching other makes and models too.
May I suggest that your apparent inability to accept or respect anyone else’s perspective in regards to advice sought by a young driver or anyone for that matter, without first going into an insult followed by a rant about scrubbed out tyres, ball joints letting go, diff bushes flogging out, industrial deafness due to turned up stereos etc, may be as a result of your not appreciating what anybody else has to offer on account that you honestly believe in your wisdom and advice above all else!
I’m sure the OP didn’t turn to this forum to read put downs and insults etc. He reads like a very sensible lad, with an open minded objective. And hopefully he can make a choice that suits him once he’s taken all the differing advice on board. Once again, I say good luck to Josh in his endeavours.
And to you I say, ‘maybe your deafness is due to you having your fingers in your ears and not wanting to listen to anyone else, or maybe it was all that doof doof, when you were Josh’s age.

You see most of us have experienced that kind of stuff as young drivers, we understand the mistakes we made, and therefore we try to be a bit more protective and nurturing towards the younger people who are needing the advice now.

I do accept your view, that all the so called safety devices on cars are not necessarily a benefit and that some of them are downright distracting. However, there are obviously some safety features which I have no doubt, have possibly saved the lives of thousands of people, but you must understand that not everyone has the same reactions, not everyone sees things as you may do, and so therefore you can’t just make a statement as you did and not expect a reaction.

My quotations about other brand issues was surposed to help with the choice process...The stereo pricing was there as a guide....So yep, definately had my fingers in my eyes and my glasses in my ears with that...

And my quotation about driving aids is my take on this modern stuff....Those that have been driving for years (which it seems you have) would appreciate the concentration required without these aids....Having these aids is seen as reducing the concentration...But hey that's the way it goes...
 

vc commodore

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Don't try to use reason, he's made it quite clear his skill means that it's impossible he will be in any future accident (at fault or not) and nobody will ever be able hit him.

Far from it....But hey we are entitled to our opinions and it seems obvious my ideas about driving are stupid ideas, so pity the poor bastards that are around me when I drive
 

hademall

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My quotations about other brand issues was surposed to help with the choice process...The stereo pricing was there as a guide....So yep, definately had my fingers in my eyes and my glasses in my ears with that...

And my quotation about driving aids is my take on this modern stuff....Those that have been driving for years (which it seems you have) would appreciate the concentration required without these aids....Having these aids is seen as reducing the concentration...But hey that's the way it goes...
Once again I agree with your take on some of the modern stuff. And your quotations on the other brands was good advice.
It’s just the way you go about it. That’s all!
 

hademall

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Far from it....But hey we are entitled to our opinions and it seems obvious my ideas about driving are stupid ideas, so pity the poor bastards that are around me when I drive
Yes, we are all entitled to our opinions. Well said!
 
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