HelpTrying to decide whats up with cooling system

[Moosejaw]

Points to know:
A) this alloytec is a learning curve for me
B) inlet housing seals went and successfully replaced
C) new fluid and all new hoses and learnt how to bleed properly
D)system was good but leaked at water pump
E)gates water pump installed with paper gasket and red goo left for 24 hours prior to refill
F)go for bleed but things seem off..top hose got hot and clearly some fluid inside bit still very squeezable..did not feel as though bleed was successful
G) all the usual temps reached nothing blowing up.. go for a drive..now the top hose is solid with coolant
I have a nagging feeling that its not properly full or bled and i am trying to come to a conclusion.
H) a second bleed was the same but this time a slight scum came out of the system..not oil.
Heres where the brains trust comes in
Could i have misfitted the pump?
Could the pump be faulty.
Or perhaps is the thermostat not fully opening?
Am i correct in thinking the top hose should firm up good and proper normally and if so what could prevent that?
Btw when i bought the pump the supersheep person said if you had any troubles with it just bring it back..right then i was thinking something might be up with those pumps...anyway thoughts please..

 

[greenacc]

How did you bleed it? Sounds like you blead it cold. I always bleed my VE when it's warmed up and has pressure in the hose. That works a treat provided you don't get sprayed with hot coolant.

 

[Moosejaw]

How did you bleed it? Sounds like you blead it cold. I always bleed my VE when it's warmed up and has pressure in the hose. That works a treat provided you don't get sprayed with hot coolant.

Bleeding as per fu Manchu.. Have done it successfully over last few days doing inlet seals then new hoses and heater tap.. All went well.. Did after pump.. This time seems different..half hour later top hose still squeezy.
Would be helpful to confirm this:
top pipe should fill firm and full when thermostat fully opening which would indicate flow through from engine to radiator.
Because I cannot recall exactly.. From previous bleeds, that would be helpful.
.But to your point of cold bleed yes.. But the ghetto bleed container was still mounted for the full 30min... All the while top hose remained hot like there was some flow but not full as in full circulation.

 

[Moosejaw]

The mention of low pressure sort of feels right..especially noticing that full flow seems evident after a drive as opposed to roving or idling. Which leads me to question my installation.. Maybe too much goo or bad pump.. The one that came off had a metal shim which was not reinstalled.. Does that seem like a potential cause? Should that shim go back in?

 

[Fu Manchu]

When you bleed the system it’s not under pressure, so you should be able to squeeze the top hose. That’s normal.

You can’t install the water pump incorrectly.

You will have evidence of thermostat opening while bleeding it.

When it opens, the level (at first) drops suddenly. There will be a burst of fine bubbles. It suddenly gets warmer.

It may take 20-30 minutes.

Best to have someone sit it on 1500revs for a bit at times.

 

[greenacc]

Yep, as above its the pressure build up caused by heat when the cap is on that makes the hose firm.
I doubt the water pump would be faulty. If the pulley is spinning the impeller should be spinning so you have flow.
Now you've tried the low pressure bleed give the high pressure bleed a go. Works perfectly on the VS and VE so should work on VZ too. After I have filled it as much as possible using the usual methods I just drive around the block with the cap on to build up pressure then open the bleeder and the air is forced out. Simple as that. Then repeat a few days later to double check.

 

[Moosejaw]

Thanks. I am on it first thing in the morn. Appreciate you both responding.

 

[gungazza]

make sure heater is on

 

[Fu Manchu]

The VZ bleeds air different to the 3.8ltr.

It also bleeds air differently to the VE V6.

 

[Moosejaw]

Job done boys.4 takeaways:
1: old parts aint what they used to be, if its pitted or been scraped some goo is the go.
2: dont use red goo around where you are looking out for pink fluid leaks.
3: using permatex grey "the right stuff" is expensive and a nightmare if your not prepared for the 5 min cure time but boy does it work well.
4:the gates coolant hose kit has a rubber grommet glued onto the return hose that makes a noob believe its cut to vz specs and plug and play..not so..the whole time i was tracking leaks and pressure issues this hose was hovering a few mm above max water mark..about 9-10cm from the base.

I would love to hear from someone on what happens in a coolant system if that would occur in an otherwise functional system.