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how much to tune a ssv manual?

Sabbath'

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This post has been quite informative and entertaining so far, and cheers for so many ppl chipping in for advices and experiences!!

Yet you're still heading down the path of following the advice of the person in this thread that people that know what they're talking about are disagreeing with?

Yeah I think I will put on my new extractors, cats and otr then drive it for 6 months just to feel the improvements as is, then tune it so I have an appreciation of what the tune actually increases.
 

Heron SSV

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I'm no rocket surgeon, but i'm pretty sure if you get headers and cats you'll get a check engine light, and the only way to get rid of it for good is to get it tuned. if you dont want it tuned, stick with a cat back and OTR. I have a cat back and VCM OTR with no tune and havent had a problem with it.
 

PIR4TE

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Seriously.......WHY...?????
Tune , OTR, & exhaust should get you between 50-70rwkw.
Do it once & do it right , all at the same time.
Ask any decent Tuner & they will tell you to get a tune WHEN FITTING your mods to maximise all the gains available.
Of course he's going to say that, is how he makes a quid!

Of course he will show you a bullshit gain 50-70rwkw - what a joke!
No need to respond with the PC printout videos set to J607 - the atmospheric equivalent at the TB of 0% humidity in a room in Detroit Michighan where it snows heaps and a fricken big lake freezes over - plus another 10-20% for good measure.

Too much info? One word - TIMESLIP.

With the mods I agree OP should ensure mods are scanned and logged but doesnt need dyno spin unless milking hp on the table at WOT.

A 'decent' tuner would be transparent and not correct the raw dyno figure at all, and show you your car stock, with mods, and after mods with tune. Even then half of what you see and none of what you hear.

You don't always get CEL with good extractors, tripping the CEL does not prove they are more powerful or better at scavenging. Just means they are a PITA.
 

AD07

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Of course he's going to say that, is how he makes a quid!

Of course he will show you a bullshit gain 50-70rwkw - what a joke!
No need to respond with the PC printout videos set to J607 - the atmospheric equivalent at the TB of 0% humidity in a room in Detroit Michighan where it snows heaps and a fricken big lake freezes over - plus another 10-20% for good measure.

Too much info? One word - TIMESLIP.

With the mods I agree OP should ensure mods are scanned and logged but doesnt need dyno spin unless milking hp on the table at WOT.

A 'decent' tuner would be transparent and not correct the raw dyno figure at all, and show you your car stock, with mods, and after mods with tune. Even then half of what you see and none of what you hear.



You don't always get CEL with good extractors, tripping the CEL does not prove they are more powerful or better at scavenging. Just means they are a PITA.
Dont know what alien planet you come from PIR4TE , but alot of tuners are also enthusiests & have a passion for modding cars &
earning their money by giving the customer what they want.
You talk about not needing a dyno run, so would you like to see AFR's lean out to an unsafe level because mods were fitted & a tune WAS NOT done....????
Also TIMESLIPs.....so a car with approx 270rwkw does a 14sec pass....does that mean the car is slow or the driver is inexperienced....you seem to be the expert here, please enlighten us.
And why do extractors that throw a CEL become a PITA..???
The number of Tuners, Australia wide , that have fitted Headers, cats, otrs, & tuned VE's to support those mods would be in the 10's of thousands & a majority would have seen 50-70rwkw gains. If this seems like something new to you, you must be living under a rock......


ALSO SEE POST 108 OF THIS THREAD.......what more do you need ..????
 
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PIR4TE

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Dont know what alien planet you come from PIR4TE , but alot of tuners are also enthusiests & have a passion for modding cars & earning their money by giving the customer what they want.
Fair comment, except the personal inference that I am an alien. Agreed professional tuners are by definition in a commercial business and they look to us to make a quid.

You talk about not needing a dyno run,
No I said scan and log for errors and anomalies, then analyze results to determine whether a 3mb ECU flash tune is required.

so would you like to see AFR's lean out to an unsafe level because mods were fitted & a tune WAS NOT done....????
You scan for that like I said. No need for dyno.

Also TIMESLIPs.....so a car with approx 270rwkw does a 14sec pass....
Haha, no mate! A bloke who's been deluded into thinking his car is 270rwkw does a 14sec LOL

does that mean the car is slow or the driver is inexperienced....you seem to be the expert here, please enlighten us.
Means the driver is crap and the car is slow.

And why do extractors that throw a CEL become a PITA..???
Because you are permanently chained to pay for tuning the light out for eternity, no future engine warnings of that nature, or that it won't happen again at some point down the track.[
The number of Tuners, Australia wide , that have fitted Headers, cats, otrs, & tuned VE's to support those mods would be in the 10's of thousands
Haha really? that many? enough said!
a majority would have seen 50-70rwkw gains
What a daft thing to say!?
Under Detroit lab conditions - check the fricken correction values. Fools most, still bullshit.

If this seems like something new to you, you must be living under a rock......
Hey enough with the assumptions about my personal life, read the forum rules about abuse and fair comment.
I'm glad you're happy with your racing Calais AD07, and ignorance is bliss, I apologise for trying to wake you up.
EDIT: BTW if your standard weight Calais was really getting 270rwkw your time would be 12.8-13.0
 
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Ian Johnston

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RoaringSky, while not being an expert, I wouldnt be running on 91 octane with your car. Is the tuner you have been talking about going to use an SCT tuning tool?? You havent told us what type for the $1190 you speak of.
 

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Just for the record, Tuners who use VCM Suite need to purchase "Credits" from VCM in order to tune.

Most makes/engines require 2 credits, excluding the alloytec power vehicles which require 4 credits. Plus other costs i dont fully understand. So, price of credits + dyno time + labour + profit (they do need to make something) would equal about the grand mark.

Others who may use the GM Xcal3 tuners need to purchase the box, which gets locked to a perticular vin. The flash box itself is around $800 then add the extra costs to that...
 

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Dont know what alien planet you come from PIR4TE , but alot of tuners are also enthusiests & have a passion for modding cars &
earning their money by giving the customer what they want.
You talk about not needing a dyno run, so would you like to see AFR's lean out to an unsafe level because mods were fitted & a tune WAS NOT done....????
Also TIMESLIPs.....so a car with approx 270rwkw does a 14sec pass....does that mean the car is slow or the driver is inexperienced....you seem to be the expert here, please enlighten us.
And why do extractors that throw a CEL become a PITA..???
The number of Tuners, Australia wide , that have fitted Headers, cats, otrs, & tuned VE's to support those mods would be in the 10's of thousands & a majority would have seen 50-70rwkw gains. If this seems like something new to you, you must be living under a rock......


ALSO SEE POST 108 OF THIS THREAD.......what more do you need ..????
Power is gauged by MPH, not the ET. A poor 60' won't really effect the trap speed.
 

AD07

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PIR4TE......with all your obvious wisdom , can you please explain what is wrong about post 108 ......
The results speak for themselves. But i bet you say its just another fudged dyno figure......:doh:
 

PIR4TE

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ALSO SEE POST 108 OF THIS THREAD.......what more do you need ..????
Haha Sonny!, my case in point, good example, thank you!
Been there several times OTR, ECU, full system, tranny tune, framed chart... good service. But suffice it to say his dyno is happy hence a lot of customers are too.
Good on him, I've moved on from that, anyone promoting 270rwkw from the increased VE of an L77 at 5150rpm solely via artistic expertise in setting dependents for PID calcs on top of the branded brilliance of bolt-ons (while retaining AFM L77 intake and top end) is having a lend.
Install a custom manifold, ported TB, increase the lift, increase octane, alter timing and raise the injector cycle during PE on dyno to suit the low KR characteristics of ethanol, beef the valvetrain redline with indestructible nitrided springs and stronger moly rods and hey presto 270-285rwkw maxing out the L77 cam lift / duration limit @ 5650rpm.
Only then you see the need to crack the engine open and install a better cam. Or VVT.
 
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AD07

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So his customers are happy & your only theory is a happy dyno.......good job !!!!
 

PIR4TE

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So his customers are happy & your only theory is a happy dyno.......good job !!!!
Yes. I have no beef with that, we all have to make a living, just that an AFM L77 @ 5150rpm (auto 4th gear std tyres @ 196kph) does not gain the claimed increase in Volumetric Efficiency from bolt ons and recalibration to make 270rwkw.
It is not my theory or guesswork, engine needs more rpm, lift and duration to generate more hp from increased CFM, there is no magic in the physical mechanics of an LS.
FFS man read some more, I'm telling you some potentially valuable info directly from first hand experience.
 

Heron SSV

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I think someone needs to walk the plank. Arrrrgh.
 

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Yes. I have no beef with that, we all have to make a living, just that an AFM L77 @ 5150rpm (auto 4th gear std tyres @ 196kph) does not gain the claimed increase in Volumetric Efficiency from bolt ons and recalibration to make 270rwkw.
It is not my theory or guesswork, engine needs more rpm, lift and duration to generate more hp from increased CFM, there is no magic in the physical mechanics of an LS.
FFS man read some more, I'm telling you some potentially valuable info directly from first hand experience.
I see what you mean about the correction factors being changed between runs too...

One common use of the dyno correction factor is to standardize the horsepower and torque readings, so that the effects of the ambient temperature and pressure are removed from the readings. By using the dyno correction factor, power and torque readings can be directly compared to the readings taken on some other day, or even taken at some other altitude.

That is, the corrected readings are the same as the result that you would get by taking the car (or engine) to a certain temperature controlled, humidity controlled, pressure controlled dyno shop where they measure "standard" power, based on the carefully controlled temperature, humidity and pressure.

If you take your car to the dyno on a cold day at low altitude, it will make a lot of power. And if you take exactly the same car back to the same dyno on a hot day, it will make less power. But if you take the exact same car to the "standard" dyno (where the temperature, humidity and pressure are all carefully controlled) on those different days, it will always make exactly the same power.

Sometimes you may want to know how much power you are really making on that specific day due to the temperature, humidity and pressure on that day; in that case, you should look at the uncorrected power readings.

But when you want to see how much more power you have solely due to the new headers, or the new cam, then you will find that the corrected power is more useful, since it removes the effects of the temperature, humidity and atmospheric pressure and just shows you how much more (or less) power you have than in your previous tests.

There is no "right" answer... it's simply a matter of how you want to use the information.

If you want to know whether you are going to burn up the tranny with too much power on a cool, humid day, then go to the dyno and look at uncorrected power to see how exactly much power you have under these conditions.

But if you want to compare the effects due to modifications, or you want to compare several different cars at different times, then the corrected readings of the "standard" dyno will be more useful.
 

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Haha Sonny!, my case in point, good example, thank you!
Been there several times OTR, ECU, full system, tranny tune, framed chart... good service. But suffice it to say his dyno is happy hence a lot of customers are too.
Good on him, I've moved on from that, anyone promoting 270rwkw from the increased VE of an L77 at 5150rpm solely via artistic expertise in setting dependents for PID calcs on top of the branded brilliance of bolt-ons (while retaining AFM L77 intake and top end) is having a lend.
Install a custom manifold, ported TB, increase the lift, increase octane, alter timing and raise the injector cycle during PE on dyno to suit the low KR characteristics of ethanol, beef the valvetrain redline with indestructible nitrided springs and stronger moly rods and hey presto 270-285rwkw maxing out the L77 cam lift / duration limit @ 5650rpm.
Only then you see the need to crack the engine open and install a better cam. Or VVT.
What makes you think that anyone is actually going to believe you, over the constant evidence and testimonials of customers who have visited one of the most well known LSX related performance workshops in Australia?

A friend of mine who also happens to be my mechanic (when I need professional work done) works closely with EFI dynamics out in Lilydale, his dyno and tuning yields very similar numbers, and hey, so does APS in frankston, LSX in Hallam...

They all happy dyno's too?

Why is everyone constantly objecting to the blatantly obvious facts out there!!???

The numbers are what they are. Tunes are worth the money and unlock enormous untapped potential from massively detuned motors (not talking just Holden/LSX here) etc etc etc...

this thread is more bent than Elton John's sexuality.
 

PIR4TE

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What makes you think that anyone is actually going to believe you, over the constant evidence and testimonials of customers who have visited one of the most well known LSX related performance workshops in Australia?
OK mate, I believe you. His dyno is out of whack, like many others using J607 in my experience. An L77 auto with AFM does not flow enough to make 270+rwkw @ 5150 with bolt ons, ask your mechanic mate.

A friend of mine who also happens to be my mechanic (when I need professional work done) works closely with EFI dynamics out in Lilydale, his dyno and tuning yields very similar numbers, and hey, so does APS in frankston, LSX in Hallam...

They all happy dyno's too?
Apparently! Either that or you are confusing two different engines - a manual L98 to an auto L77?

Why is everyone constantly objecting to the blatantly obvious facts out there!!???

The numbers are what they are. Tunes are worth the money and unlock enormous untapped potential from massively detuned motors (not talking just Holden/LSX here) etc etc etc...
My objection is a notice to the OP underlining the commercial and practical nature of the transaction whilst pointing out the sheepish mindset of people who don't know better, exactly what are the pitfalls and value for money he can expect handing his hard earned to a technician on eBay (see OP's follow up to original post).
 

WazzaV8

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I just want a good setting for 91 ron, and that's how my car will always run as I don't plan for cams or blowers etc!!
Doesn't you owners manual say to run on Premium Unleaded, 91ron is Regular.
 
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