JC Political Thread - For All Things Political Part 2

[Reaper]

I have always thought since the 2010 election was 'just' won and Julia's backflip (due to strategic reasons...) on the Carbox tax cause huge amount of discontent in the community ALP should have switched over to Rudd ages ago. He is by far the preferred ALP PM according to the polls. The only way ALP has any remote chance of winning the election was if Rudd as leader, but they blew that chance a few weeks ago with the leadership spill. Crean got the spill happening and Rudd's refusal to run left Crean hanging in the wind. Crean as leader? He could bring some unity to the party but he also lost the 2001 election for ALP as I recall.

The problem with Rudd is that most of his own party despise him and would not be able to work with the guy. None of the future potential leaders want a bar of running the party in it's current state with a train wreck of an election coming up. What'll probably happen is Gillard looses the election, resigns and some other patsy goes in for a year or so only for somebody like Shorton to come thru and take the reigns a year or 2 out from the next election, hoping the LNP do something exceptionally stupid in government.

 

[Reaper]

It has died down a bit but just a little illustration regarding USA's "fiscal cliff"

Most would say meh, it's 'merica who cares?? Well Australians should care because our debt (as a proportion to income) under Wayne Swan (or is it Wood Duck? the worlds greatest treasurer) is accelerating faster than Americas! People are going nuts over over Newman in QLD getting the budget back in order and rightfully so. Unfortunately they are directing their venom at the wrong person. The proper target of their vengeance should have been the previous Labor government for putting the state in such a predicament. Actually, after looking at the results of the last election, maybe they have. Unfortunately our current Federal Government is tracking exactly the same as the Bligh government, only without a charismatic leader.

 

[vr94ss]

It has died down a bit but just a little illustration regarding USA's "fiscal cliff"

Most would say meh, it's 'merica who cares?? Well Australians should care because our debt (as a proportion to income) under Wayne Swan (or is it Wood Duck? the worlds greatest treasurer) is accelerating faster than Americas! People are going nuts over over Newman in QLD getting the budget back in order and rightfully so. Unfortunately they are directing their venom at the wrong person. The proper target of their vengeance should have been the previous Labor government for putting the state in such a predicament. Actually, after looking at the results of the last election, maybe they have. Unfortunately our current Federal Government is tracking exactly the same as the Bligh government, only without a charismatic leader.

You always compare a national budget to a household budget but economists seem to disagree, they are not alike and it's way too simplistic. It does seem to sell well to the "simple" public though.

The Federal Budget is NOT like a Household Budget: Here
Government budgets bear no relation to household budgets | Bill Mitchell – billy blog
http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/us-money-blog/2013/mar/26/federal-budget-household-finances-fed

So what can be the appeal of this less than truthful analogy? The sad truth is it is a product of our profound financial ignorance.

 

[minux]

You always compare a national budget to a household budget but economists seem to disagree, they are not alike and it's way too simplistic. It does seem to sell well to the "simple" public though.

Actually, it is simplistic. When money is well spent on investment, it will give a return and be worth the borrowings, much like a mortgage or for government building state owned nuclear power stations. What isn't good spends is buying a 60 inch plasma because the 55 inch had 1 shade of gray better colour or for government paying for people to have laptops, pink batts and solar power...

In ANY budget bad spends are bad spends whether for govco or private homes. Debt is much the same, it is all good borrowing a truckload while rates are low, but when rates escalate all of a sudden the interest kills even a prosperous government or household.

I think it was the USA that due to their borrowings and bad spends on health etc their repayments by 20/20 for all these spends will be around 85% of the current tax take. That is a pretty scarey thought...eventually money has to be paid back, one way or another.

 

[Reaper]

You always compare a national budget to a household budget but economists seem to disagree, they are not alike and it's way too simplistic. It does seem to sell well to the "simple" public though.

The Federal Budget is NOT like a Household Budget: Here
Government budgets bear no relation to household budgets | Bill Mitchell – billy blog
Why the federal budget can't be managed like a household budget | Money | guardian.co.uk

Lol - of course it's not like a house budget however in the respect of continually spending more than you have coming in, it's *EXACTLY* the same.

 

[HamaTime™]

Federal budget should be built on the same principles as a household budget.

Don't spend more than you earn.

If you do spend more than you earn, make sure they are things that will earn you money in the long run (i.e. investments), therefore 'avoid bad debt'.

Current Government has failed to understand even how the average Australian household works, can't even make a budget properly. Clap clap :doh:
They are like a teenager gone wild with Daddy's large credit card.

 

[vr94ss]

None of you actually read the posted articles, did you? If so then argue why the economists are wrong and you are right, not just lol, I know better.

This might be a better comparison to household budgets rather than the simplistic one in the pic above that's only meant to mislead people.
Daily Kos: You want to compare the U.S. budget to a family budget? Let's be real about it.

 

[50LTRv8]

Hey Vr94SS

So how much debt is ok for Australia to deal with?, because it will be us footing the bill. At some point the razor gang is gunna hurt us bad, to pay back what we owe.

 

[DAKSTER]

It has died down a bit but just a little illustration regarding USA's "fiscal cliff"

Most would say meh, it's 'merica who cares?? Well Australians should care because our debt (as a proportion to income) under Wayne Swan (or is it Wood Duck? the worlds greatest treasurer) is accelerating faster than Americas! People are going nuts over over Newman in QLD getting the budget back in order and rightfully so. Unfortunately they are directing their venom at the wrong person. The proper target of their vengeance should have been the previous Labor government for putting the state in such a predicament. Actually, after looking at the results of the last election, maybe they have. Unfortunately our current Federal Government is tracking exactly the same as the Bligh government, only without a charismatic leader.

Just a couple of things about Newman getting QLD's budget back in order.

While he is sacking people left right and centre, it wasn't so long ago that he gave a cool couple hundred grand to Channel 10 to help them with Big Brother. Money well spent?

That was the same day or maybe a couple days after I heard they were cancelling a similar amount of cash that used to support the literary awards, because the state couldn't afford such luxuries any more.

Yesterday morning I listened to an interview with the Education minister John-Paul Langbrook who is cutting millions from education.

Now I hear this morning, they are giving KFC 40+ grand to assist with some kind of recycling initiative. Basically, they are going to buy a bunch of bins for KFC. I guess the fast food business is struggling and a very worthwhile cause... can anyone suggest to me why KFC can't buy their own bins, or even why they shouldn't be forced to recycle, at their own cost, just like anyone else?

I have to pay to take my rubbish to the dump (recycling centre) if it doesn't fit in the bins I pay for with my rates.

Our venom is directed at the correct person...

 

[Reaper]

None of you actually read the posted articles, did you? If so then argue why the economists are wrong and you are right, not just lol, I know better.

This might be a better comparison to household budgets rather than the simplistic one in the pic above that's only meant to mislead people.
Daily Kos: You want to compare the U.S. budget to a family budget? Let's be real about it.

Your link is a waste of time. It has 1 valid point about raising income and points directly at the rich for increased taxes. For this particular case I'd tend to agree as tax rates for upper income earners in NA are extremely generous. In Australia it's exactly the opposite. When it comes to raising the income side of things we need to spread the load substantially.

As for the rest of the article it's a long justification of bad money management practices. Sure NA have had some terrible natural disasters to overcome and some borrowing may be required to overcome them. The problem is that America is borrowing for nearly everything and Australia is trending the same way. Most people will borrow for large capital purchases (eg house, car etc) but when you are borrowing to pay for cloths, food, electricity etc month in month out eventually there is going to be a problem. America has been doing it for decades and Australasia is heading that way.

Just a couple of things about Newman getting QLD's budget back in order.

While he is sacking people left right and centre, it wasn't so long ago that he gave a cool couple hundred grand to Channel 10 to help them with Big Brother. Money well spent?

I find that very hard to believe. BB finished on channel 10 in 2008. Either way, I'd presume it came from the tourism budget in an effort to promote Qld. No real difference to the Vic government tipping in to get MasterChef to Victoria. All thru the series they plugged the heck out of Melbourne & Victoria.

That was the same day or maybe a couple days after I heard they were cancelling a similar amount of cash that used to support the literary awards, because the state couldn't afford such luxuries any more.

Hard to say without seeing the details but maybe the benefit to Qld was not as high as BB?

Yesterday morning I listened to an interview with the Education minister John-Paul Langbrook who is cutting millions from education.

If you don't have it, you shouldn't be spending it.

Now I hear this morning, they are giving KFC 40+ grand to assist with some kind of recycling initiative. Basically, they are going to buy a bunch of bins for KFC. I guess the fast food business is struggling and a very worthwhile cause... can anyone suggest to me why KFC can't buy their own bins, or even why they shouldn't be forced to recycle, at their own cost, just like anyone else?

Are you sure there is not more to it?? I doubt govco would be simply buying private corporation bins. Maybe there is however you aren't posting it as it doesn't suit your argument?