Just joined the orphan club

[VS 5.0]

Ah ok, well I’m new around here

Hence my explanation.

 

[Fzs1000n]

Insignia and commodore.

2 totally different cars.

Should not even share the same website really. May as well chuck a Peugeot in while we're at it...

 

[alsd]

The difference with the Euro cars is they can build a very tight chassis and firm suspension without the harshness and our local product had never achieved this. I remember driving a BMW 3 series in or around 2000. It was a very hi spec model with all the available luxuries of the day and big for the time 17" wheels with low profile tyres. I was truly amazed at how comfortable this car was but how sharp the handling was and this is something the Euro's and especially BMW do very well. At the time it was an expensive car and small compared to the likes of the VT but world's ahead of the VT SS and also expensive VT Clubsport.
You can not compare Euro cars to our local cars and ZB is another story as it neither feels truly Euro or Australian but is in between and that is I suppose due to the Australian input in the suspension tune. It would be interesting to drive a Euro spec Insignia and a US spec Buick Regal to see how they all compare.

This is what I’m talking about, they are light years apart. To say they can’t be compared I don’t totally agree with but I understand why you say it and to some degree that’s fair enough, hence my comment a while back about Holden either being hamstrung by budget or equipment (I didn’t mention talent).

As for saying that the commodore is unique because it can be a taxi right the way through to a highly tuned sports car such as a GTS isn’t really special I would think, almost every car has the same..... BM with all of the M cars, MERC with all of the AMG, Audi, etc etc etc.....

Yes the Euros have advantage of scale and that’s def something to consider but it just can’t be argued, the GM Holden product was just so far behind almost everything out there that was comparable.... I don’t say this to start fights here but just as an honest observation.

anyway, opinions are like a holes I know and that’s just mine. No car is perfect andit’ll be interesting to see if the ZB can handle our roads, that I’m very keen to see and is the biggest doubt I have.....

I’m sure the ZB is going to be a POS with my areas and I’m waiting to see, they’re just too new now to say..... but what we can say now is that, as a comparable car (price wise as I’ve been told this is the acceptable form of measurement) it is light years ahead of the local product.

Im really sorry if that makes people here sorry or offended but tough, it’s just the truth.

 

[alsd]

Anyway, enough dick measuring from me, the ZB is great, much better than the VF and vE’s I drove (In my opinion full stop).

Ill leave it there from my side, sorry if anyone doesn’t like to hear that but well, I don’t care, get over it.....

to all the ZB guys here, I look forward to chatting about our cars and sharing info, like what this whole forum is about.....

 

[alsd]

It didn't have Opel badges on it....

Ah so it’s about badges then.....

Ok I’m an Angel.... you’re a badge sook.

sound fair?

 

[Fzs1000n]

Pre ZB they have never handled that well really.
Drive them in the wet and they want to spin in circles

 

[Derekthetree]

The difference with the Euro cars is they can build a very tight chassis and firm suspension without the harshness and our local product had never achieved this. I remember driving a BMW 3 series in or around 2000. It was a very hi spec model with all the available luxuries of the day and big for the time 17" wheels with low profile tyres. I was truly amazed at how comfortable this car was but how sharp the handling was and this is something the Euro's and especially BMW do very well. At the time it was an expensive car and small compared to the likes of the VT but world's ahead of the VT SS and also expensive VT Clubsport.
You can not compare Euro cars to our local cars and ZB is another story as it neither feels truly Euro or Australian but is in between and that is I suppose due to the Australian input in the suspension tune. It would be interesting to drive a Euro spec Insignia and a US spec Buick Regal to see how they all compare.

BMW especially hit a point in early 2010s with the M sport suspension where it was legitimately uncomfortable and "sporty ride" was the be all and end all. My wife's old F30 320d Msport rode terribly on bad UK roads, as did colleagues F10 5 series.
I think its got better now, but German auto makers certainly mistook sporty for rockhard at one point.

Pre ZB they have never handled that well really.
Drive them in the wet and they want to spin in circles

Learn to drive. Or stick to FWD I guess...

 

[alsd]

BMW especially hit a point in early 2010s with the M sport suspension where it was legitimately uncomfortable and "sporty ride" was the be all and end all. My wife's old F30 320d Msport rode terribly on bad UK roads, as did colleagues F10 5 series.
I think its got better now, but German auto makers certainly mistook sporty for rockhard at one point.

Agreed, I had a 2014 F11 (F10 wagon) msport and it was rock hard, I bent two wheels on the smooth roads of Germany when we hit small holes in the road. But the ride was still amazing when it was smooth. That plus it was quiet, powerful, responsive and the gearbox was amazing. The commodore of the same vintage.... well, I used the term agricultural before, when comparing the two of say that’s fair.

That doesn’t detract though from the point that the whole package in terms of refinement, build quality and function are light years ahead of the commodore. Yes the BMW is more expensive here but in relative terms, in Europe they’re about on par as they’re not subjected to import tariffs, luxury car taxes etc so I disagree that they’re not comparable due to price as one commenter has said here.

 

[figjam]

ZB fans rejoice ! The bogans have them, already.

Had the pleasure of being next to one at the lights this arvo.. …. black, lowered, big wheels with a tad of negative camber, cannon zorst with the muffler full of marbles (? rattled like hell) sounded like a bucket of bolts in the normal light to light shuffle.
He eventually got pole at the lights, and disappeared into the distance with a shreek of F1 revs and a hint of wastegate poof.

How I smiled, smug in my bloated Territory SUV, revelling in the knowledge that a quality, sophisticated Euro machine for discerning drivers had been giver the ricer treatment.

 

[Fu Manchu]

Pre ZB they have never handled that well really.
Drive them in the wet and they want to spin in circles

That's the idea.