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Larger throttle body/plenum spacer: worth it?

MACE

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I'm all for using things like rising rate regs on some mods to keep costs down (nothing beats a real time custom tune though, by someone who knows what they're doing). However when trying to us a adjustable fuel reg on a ported MAF, it's not applicable and the only way around is only through a custom tune. This is because the volume flow rate vs. signal completely changes compared to the original MAF. In that the change is not a proportional with respect to the original MAF so you can't just use a simple rising rate reg which changes the fuel pressure in proportion to pressure. What happens in this case is that you'll only be able to tune for a narrow power band width where the mixture are fine but anywhere else they are less then desirable :(
 

kuzman89

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I want to know why you're going to the Horsepower factory? Overpriced.

Mace's stuff works a treat. Comes down to a good tuner as well
 

p_schrapel

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well it wasnt my car and i just named off some random places that can tune them and he went there. i know they dont have much experience in the v6 game. a question for u mace. how do u change the ratio of your rockers as ive been checking out your rockers compared to the yella terra rockers and they r completely different
 

MACE

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well it wasnt my car and i just named off some random places that can tune them and he went there. i know they dont have much experience in the v6 game. a question for u mace. how do u change the ratio of your rockers as ive been checking out your rockers compared to the yella terra rockers and they r completely different

I hope I haven't come across as being a nob of sorts :p

Just asking the questions in the hope that we get even more knowledge about our products, plus to make people more aware as to how we recommend them to be installed that's all ;)

In regards to changing the ratio of our rockers we rework the factory items which give us the ability to have ratios from 1.65:1 to right through to 2.25:1 :thumbsup:

The later will be available and in conjunction with our cylinder heads :D
 

jhawk

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Thanks guys, that's all pretty helpful actually. Having talked to other guys as well, I gather all that stuff would be reasonably effective, but a good custom tune is the key to it all...

My main concern before I buy anything now is to try and find a decent cost-effective tuner - been ringing around and outfits with Ecotec experience are pretty thin on the ground in NZ :(
 

greenfoam

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I don't beleive HPF were able to tune the VX V6 that's why they just ramped the fuel pressure, I bet it's still running the standard tune. All the MACE stuff does increase power, only a couple/few kw each not alot for the money but that's because you are starting with an engine that doesn't have alot to gain in the first place rather than the products, if you wanted to gain heaps for cheap you wouldn't be running a na v6. On a budget the most effective of the mods would be a tune, which is worthwhile on a series 1 VT (not so much to gain on a series 2 as the factory allready bumped the timing quite alot) cold intake and insulators, the insulators and CAI don't show up much on the dyno but on the road that's allways a good thing. After those things you start to reach the point of...... is it worth the price and when you start eating into the engine/car upgrade the answer really is no (but you don't have to be senisble if you don't want to :) )
 

jhawk

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I would've thought the bigger throttle body would be a decent mod as well, provided you've done a CAI... Does anyone know how big the standard throttle body is in mm though, and the size of the standard airflow meter? I'm guessing there's no point in doing one without the other cos the idea is to get rid of 'bottleneck' in airflow?

If it's not a huge increase in size then yeah it wouldn't make much difference, and wouldn't be worth the $$$. The standard setup doesn't seem really incredibly restrictive anyway, apart from the actual intake/filter obviously.
 

MACE

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I don't beleive HPF were able to tune the VX V6 that's why they just ramped the fuel pressure, I bet it's still running the standard tune. All the MACE stuff does increase power, only a couple/few kw each not alot for the money but that's because you are starting with an engine that doesn't have alot to gain in the first place rather than the products, if you wanted to gain heaps for cheap you wouldn't be running a na v6. On a budget the most effective of the mods would be a tune, which is worthwhile on a series 1 VT (not so much to gain on a series 2 as the factory allready bumped the timing quite alot) cold intake and insulators, the insulators and CAI don't show up much on the dyno but on the road that's allways a good thing. After those things you start to reach the point of...... is it worth the price and when you start eating into the engine/car upgrade the answer really is no (but you don't have to be senisble if you don't want to :) )

And that’s the problem you can’t get away with running a standard tune with and a ported MAF with just a rising rate reg, otherwise it still won’t perform well :(

I can’t talk about other manufactures on the market, however our products definitely show results on the dyno consistently (if there are no underlying problems with the car off the bat) and are installed as per our recommendations, with the exception of cold air intakes which really work best under real work driving conditions. Shown below is a before and after bolt on of our manifold insulator and plenum spacer, no tuning! There will definitely be more with tuning given that they had to trim fuel requirements of cylinders to take into account less then desirable air distribution of the factory ecotec manifold, as indicated by the fouled ignition plugs after the run.

Yes it’s not your run of the mill ecotec 6 but the gains found on this wild engine are similar to that of your mild NA ecotec, infact more so with the factory tune ;)

Given the price of things like the spacer and the gain they represent I think one would be hard pressed to find anything else on the market that represents such gains per $$$ with the exception of some rockers on the market.

Best piece of advice people is to talk to various manufactures and about what suits your requirements for your V6 and budget as I don’t see how people can’t get at least a 25% increase in horsepower for less than 1k if they shop around. Beyond that though as you've mentioned it can start to get expensive, however this is going to change very soon :yeah:

I would've thought the bigger throttle body would be a decent mod as well, provided you've done a CAI... Does anyone know how big the standard throttle body is in mm though, and the size of the standard airflow meter? I'm guessing there's no point in doing one without the other cos the idea is to get rid of 'bottleneck' in airflow?

If it's not a huge increase in size then yeah it wouldn't make much difference, and wouldn't be worth the $$$. The standard setup doesn't seem really incredibly restrictive anyway, apart from the actual intake/filter obviously.

The size of the standard TB is 64mm, though figure is misleading and is less because there are "humps" present in the throttle body that reduce flow area. The MAF is 68mm in diameter however misleading as it has quite a large vane, plus the mesh which reduces it down. You can don one without the other as every bit helps which is more important on an NA can given the fact that it only has atmospheric pressure to work with.
 

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11gothevt11

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They all work well by themselves. However as a package they work even better :)

Hey mace I am buying a larger throttle body and larger air flow meter
Someone was saying u sell modified memcals to make larger throttle body work better also does this work with the larger air flow meter or is it a differant tune?
 
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