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LPG

Discussion in 'General' started by helpmefixmybommodore, Oct 26, 2019.

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  1. helpmefixmybommodore

    helpmefixmybommodore New Member

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    Geday, not 100% if I’m going about this the right way as I never use forums and this is new to me. So plz be kind

    so I just bought a duel fuel VR Ute, fairly standard gas setup that was done in 2006. I was driving, ran the gas completely dry, switched to petrol. The car started driving like crap, it was studdering and carrying on. I thought I’d done a center bearing on the driveshaft. Changed that, obviously wasn’t the center bearing, runs like crap still. It idles okayy.. but underload it splutters n pops n back fires, and I mean BACK FIRES. Can hardly get it through the gears, I.e un-drivable. I’m quite unknowable when it comes to gas. I’m going through the fuel system and making sure all is well, filter, injectors ect. If anyone has any advice, that would make life much easier. Thank you.
     
  2. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    Rip out the gas, a system that old is on its way out for sure. Paying a $1 or more a litre probably works out no cost saving, unless you have injected gas. Bridge the pins and check for codes and report back. Are you in north or south?

    Are we talking V8 or V6?
     
  3. helpmefixmybommodore

    helpmefixmybommodore New Member

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    V6. South, Hobart way. I’ve already gotten codes. Here they are;

    Oxygen Sensor or Circuit.

    Intake Air Temp Sensor or Circuit.

    Manifold absolute pressure sensor or circuit.

    Idle speed error.

    Vacuum leak.

    No reference from Ignition Module whole cranking.

    Runs lean under load.

    So you reckon completely rip the gas out?
     
  4. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah not worth having gas when it's the same price per 100km to run as petrol. Sounds like you need a new 02 sensor lean under load suggests 02 has failed. Need to fix the vacuum leak too. If you have a V6 the y peice near the TB is common part to break and cause a vacuum leak.
     
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  5. EYY

    EYY Well-Known Member

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    I'd be keeping the gas. Sort out the underlying problem. Likely to be a bad coil or dfi module, providing plugs and leads are good.

    Not much goes wrong with mixer systems - and the worst thing that can wear in a simple ring mixer system is the converter diaphragm which is a cheap replacement part.

    LPG here in vic is over a full dollar cheaper than petrol. For similar economy at a much lower price, you'd be crazy to remove the lpg system given a choice.

    For a saving of over $60 per 60L tank, I'll take it any day.
     
  6. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

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    Didn’t test drive using both fuel types before buying? Get a roadworthy provided as part of purchase?

    I will cost one way or the other to get the car working well on petrol and probably working well on gas. With the later, the gas cylinder must be certified and stamped every 10 years, just like your BBQ bottle. If it hasn’t got a current certified date, and you got a roadworthy, then the cost to rectify this issue is on the roadworthy suppliers dime (as I understand it). Reason I say this is that if you do decide to remove the LPG stuff, a certified tank is worth more than an uncertified tank.

    Problem with many dual fuel vehicles is injectors can get clogged up through lack of use while petrol tank and line can varnish up, adding to what must be fixed to get the thing running sweet.

    Me I’d keep the dual fuel setup and regularly run petrol once or twice a week.
     
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  7. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    EYY gas is $1 a litre and some places as much as $1.05 a litre. It's not a saving. The gas system needs servicing or the converter fouls up. The switches fail after a while as does the modules. IMO unless you get gas at under 60c a litre it's more bother than it's worth, different story if your on the mainland.
     
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  8. helpmefixmybommodore

    helpmefixmybommodore New Member

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    Okay, thanks for the advice will keep in mind. When you use TB, that refers to?
     
  9. EYY

    EYY Well-Known Member

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    Problem is that fuel pricing is constantly changing. You'd hate to remove the system this week and then there's a sudden jump to $2/L for petrol. It's close to that now here at $1.74/L for 91 while lpg is 58.5c/L. It also gives extra range.

    The systems are incredibly simple, and any issues will be very cheap to rectify. It's generally set and forget.
     
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  10. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

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    TB = throttle body ;)
     
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  11. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    EYY in Tas we don't have price cycling that the mainland does. Gas has been $1 or more a litre for over 4 years, 91 is $1.53 and hasn't changed for three weeks. Mixer systems are far less economical than injected systems as you know.
     
  12. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    I have had a TB ring converter system. It was great for close to 6 years then the problems started. When I moved over to Tas 7 years ago gas was around 80c a litre. Even back then the saving on a 200km round trip was less than $10. These days it's around the same price per 200km. With the cost of stamping the tank every 10 years, plus $120 every 12 months servicing the converter, it's no longer economical to run gas in Tas.
    Taxis no longer run gas in Tas. Even finding a place that sells it is getting hard unless your in a major centre. Head up the East Coast, after leaving Launceston and only one servo has gas. You can drive 300km and not find anywhere to buy LPG.
     
  13. EYY

    EYY Well-Known Member

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    Converters generally go for many years without needing replacement. It may not be economically worth it to go ahead with a conversion these days, but I still wouldn't go to the effort and cost of having it removed. Just what I'd do personally.

    Past fuel prices aren't a very good indicator of future prices. LPG was 85cpl here 2 years ago, now it's dropped. 2 weeks ago petrol was $1.30/L and now it's almost 50cpl more.

    I just like having the option of two fuel types. It's saved me before a number of times - filled up at a servo and obviously got a fair bit of moisture in with the petrol. So much that it wouldn't run on petrol at all; that one took a while to figure out but lpg meant that I could still get to work etc.
     
  14. losh1971

    losh1971 Well-Known Member

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    In terms of the misfire I'd be looking at replacing the plugs and leads. If that doesn't help grab a known good coil and swap it over one by one until the miss goes. If you were in the north I'd say drop around and we can swap parts until we figure out the the faulty part causing the miss. If the gas is playing up this can cause it to misfire too I have had gas problems on an old VS that I drove to pick up parts for the mechanic. Switching to petrol fixed the issue.
     
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  15. helpmefixmybommodore

    helpmefixmybommodore New Member

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    Yeah I’ve done Plugs, and I have considered changing to a known good coil just haven’t gotten around to it. Thanks for the offer mate, cheers. Gonna replace 02 Sensor and see how that goes, as well as vacuum leak. Thanks for the input everyone.
     
  16. shane_3800

    shane_3800 Active Member

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    Lol you've never worked on taxis.
     
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  17. Skylarking

    Skylarking Well-Known Member

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    Not sure how leads, plugs, crank sensor, coil and such can be an issue if it ran well on gas? Even thinking there is an intake leak sounds odd if it ran well on gas.

    Problems with O2 sensor and pollution side of the mix, when on petrol, i can understand. But spark and timing must still be controled by ECU when on gas even for mixer based systems if i'm not mistaken (though that wouldn't be the first or last time).
     
  18. EYY

    EYY Well-Known Member

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    lol not everybody does as many k's as a taxi driver
     
  19. EYY

    EYY Well-Known Member

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    The way I understood it, is that the symptoms started when he ran it out of gas and are now present for both gas and petrol - but the op isn't very clear.
     
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  20. helpmefixmybommodore

    helpmefixmybommodore New Member

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    So after running through my VAC lines n connectors trying to find a leak, I have encountered something. In the picture shown their is a what appears to be a O2 Intake line from the gas converter to the Airbox when idle’ing and revving their is a popping noice. Quite odd, hard to describe. Almost like a back fire, pop noise. But from my understanding that’s a intanke line? Does this ring anything for any LPG guru’s? 4C4D463C-1EBD-43A7-A0FF-AF8999AF6982.png
     

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