LS3 Lifter noise or Piston Slap?

[losh1971]

Sounds like he needed it longer, maybe a week & needed to charge more. Instead out the door in 3 days?

Maybe, but I think it's like a few cluey members have suggested you can get rid of most of the pig if cammed, with a decent tune but you'd be very lucky to remove the pig altogether....

 

[Lex]

Maybe, but I think it's like a few cluey members have suggested you can get rid of most of the pig if cammed, with a decent tune but you'd be very lucky to remove the pig altogether....

When was tuned (summer). If so, it would be a bit hard to replicate winter first start of the day in the middle of summer. He should say come back in winter, can finish your tune then.

 

[07GTS]

When was tuned (summer). If so, it would be a bit hard to replicate winter first start of the day in the middle of summer. He should say come back in winter, can finish your tune then.

nope cant be replicated as u need the cold temps to also affect the fuel, cold running fueling is trying to compensate for the fuel burn too as not all fuel gets burnt which is part of the richer cold running, best to use a wideband when cold to see actual burn compared to commanded so u can get it running best, one example is ethanol as it dosnt ignite well under bout 15c so someone that dosnt get to those temps wont get those issues to correct for

 

[Kakodaemon]

The slap noise in ours doesn't go away, it's always there. With the noise in yours not always evident,
it could be something else. When ours was diagnosed, l left it at the dealership overnight so they could hear it from startup. They put the engine through various loadings and did other tests on it.
As l didn't buy the car off them, l believe that the opinion they gave me was honest and factual. This opinion was further endorsed by the former dealer's that l brought the car off and had serviced it from new. Again the noise that yours makes mimics ours, but because you can't hear yours at every startup, if you get another opinion mention that to them. Slap is always there, sometimes its louder, but its always there to varying degrees. Good luck mate.

I left mine at the performance place and holden over night so they could hear the cold startup noise. What each of them did to make their diagnosis (despite what each of their paperwork said) i am unsure of. I hear it every startup but late last week it seems to have "changed" and isn't as loud and goes away quickly.

 

[Kakodaemon]

If you actually take notice of what Revnev has written it makes sense....

Pistons wear in the bore, creating more clearance and considering piston slap is created by excess clearance, the more use the engine has, the more clearance is created, therefore the more pronounced the noise should be, rather than the noise actually going away quicker....

So yes, get that 3rd and 5th opinion, but actually think what was written and use some common sense, you may just realise it might be something else creating the noise, other than piston slap

I am using common sense, that is why I am questioning what I have been told as it doesn't seem to add up when considering all the information i have gathered from here and from mechanics diagnosis. That is why I am here asking questions of more knowledgeable people and providing as much info as possible to help myself, and potentially help others who may stumble upon this thread when/if they experience similar noises.

I am just perplexed by the fact that it seems to have changed/got better out of nowhere for no reason. Is that a bad thing or a good thing??

 

[Kakodaemon]

Don't really have time to get 3rd or 5th opinions since starting working again and can't take time off so I'll play it by ear.
Hopefully @IBLOWN noise doesn't get any worse.

Even though the 2 videos were shot on different cameras you can clearly hear that the noise in the video i took today (2nd video) isn't as pronounced as it was a week and a half ago and pretty much goes away while the car is still cold.

gone from making this noise for this amount of time...

to making this noise for this amount of time...

 

[VCoz]

It may be comforting that it has quietened but has the cause of that noise been 'fixed'? It maybe for a while, so suggest keep recording the reduction in noise (did it reduce the day after they had your vehicle?). Also ask GMANZ what invasive or other they did without your knowledge or permission when testing it. Ask GMANZ what was done to mask or to largely reduce the noise they diagnosed as a 'normal' design characteristic 'piston slap - which results from clearance matters'. Change your oil to recommended 5W30 Delco approved synthetic as a new legally safe starting point. Secrecy when people play with your vehicle needs addressing: if damage has occurred by a manufacturing fault (Australian Consumer Law) then is it OK for the manufacturer to mask or cover up the damage for the owner to deal with later? Many owners may wish to know how seriously loud claimed piston slap can be cured without fixing piston to bore clearances. I am limited in what I can say - do some research and consider how valve train noises can be masked or fixed. We are talking about large amounts of money and likely engines impacted if exposed. Once irreversible damage has resulted those accountable that mask the damage to prevent accountability IMO should be investigated if such actions were/are a 'criminal act'?

 

[Skylarking]

I've heard of people getting tunes done for around $800-$900. Mine was well over a $1000. I think now I know why mine was what I paid. Sounds like those $800 tunes are a one day job not three.

It's not a three day job in any case... most of day 2 & 3 the car is just parked and not being worked on

Or do people just want to charge $$ for a car siting in their back lot for 12 hours so they can roll it into their worksho of a 10 minutes tune "adjust" on cold start? Can't be longer than 10 minutes, heck probably can't be longer than 5 minutes otherwise it's gotten hot and no longer in cold start condition

As i see it, a tune needs to address a lot of conditions, including cold start, but it's just that "tuners" either don't fully do their job correctly, don't don't have the skills to fully do their job correctly. Maybe they simply want cars out the door and no desire to see them back so blame cams being pigs, unseasonlay weather, say all "performce" cars do this, etc, etc. Add to this the desire to reach a price point so as not to price themselves out of work, it seems unavoidable tunes aren't ideal unless all is discussed beforemahd and prices accordingly/ But the focus seems to be in doggies up dyno sheets and the bragging rights they bring so i guess we have ourselves to blame for accepting such...

Maybe it's just that tuners can't see a loss leader as being a benifit. That is, do the job fully and correctly for that engine type and mods in the first instance and carry the learning cost themselves so they can replicate a good tune on the next job benefits. A client shouldn't really be paying for the tuner to learn. That way a tuner can build a reputation which spreads and they can then charge accordingly (for the hours of work and the skill they bring to the table)...

 

[Skylarking]

It may be comforting that it has quietened but has the cause of that noise been 'fixed'? It maybe for a while, so suggest keep recording the reduction in noise (did it reduce the day after they had your vehicle?). Also ask GMANZ what invasive or other they did without your knowledge or permission when testing it. Ask GMANZ what was done to mask or to largely reduce the noise they diagnosed as a 'normal' design characteristic 'piston slap - which results from clearance matters'. Change your oil to recommended 5W30 Delco approved synthetic as a new legally safe starting point. Secrecy when people play with your vehicle needs addressing: if damage has occurred by a manufacturing fault (Australian Consumer Law) then is it OK for the manufacturer to mask or cover up the damage for the owner to deal with later? Many owners may wish to know how seriously loud claimed piston slap can be cured without fixing piston to bore clearances. I am limited in what I can say - do some research and consider how valve train noises can be masked or fixed. We are talking about large amounts of money and likely engines impacted if exposed. Once irreversible damage has resulted those accountable that mask the damage to prevent accountability IMO should be investigated if such actions were/are a 'criminal act'?

What, bannanas are not considered a solution Such antics seems a bit "back to the future" for my liking so I'd definately want to know what they did to quiet things down (oil, additive etc)

And it's important as these silly buggers sometimes walk thensleves into a corner. As an expample a friend had gearbox syncro issues when his vehicle was still under factory warranty, so he complained at the next service. On picking up the car he asked what they did and was told they changed the gearbox oil. Then at the next service he complained that he had gearbox syncro issues (but didn't refer back to the previous service).. On picking up the car, he asked what they did and was told they changed the gearbox oil. So he then asked to speak to the service manager. My friend then asked him if the gearbox oil needed to be repalced at every service and whether the factory would pay for that durig the vehicles life (as a solution to the gearbox syncro issue)... supposedly the looks between the service manager and his staff were priceles. They had nowhere to hide so my friend got another gearbox without further discussions But hat wasn't Holden who seem to be changing facts to suit their narative

 

[IBLOWN]

@IBLOWN, I remember you mentioned fitting new lifters the first time you had issues, I don't suppose you remember or know how much pre-load they have?




I do love old WW2 era engines.

No, i gave the car to a shop to fit them.