Omega & Berlina to get "premium" engine

[Full Spectrum]

Yeah but the alloytec is still pretty thirsty for this day and age.

It uses more fuel than the 4.0L straight 6 in the falcon, and makes less power and a heap less torque. Plus the FG apparently weights 30kg more than the VE (though it doesn't look it from the exterior).

For 2008, its not a good engine. Simple. How much improvement has been made since the Ecotec was introduced 13 years ago? Remove the crap ADR fuel ratings and I don't believe there is enough improvement over 13 years considering the advances in technology and the rest of the motoring world.

My buzzing around in a VE Calais V6 returned me a pretty decent 8.8l/100 over my total trip. My sister and her BF hired a 2007 VZ Acclaim wagon and headed to SA this year, They drank about 9.5 total trip. And in my trip we hit hills that required a 3rd gear sometimes, But thats what you get when you go the back way everywhere:whistling.

The I6 lives off it's torque, Technology wise it's close to par with the Alloytech but not advanced over it. I'd be more concerned what toyota dishes up from a smaller capacity engine. But remember holden has 2 V6's and only 1 is any good.

My VT goes around at about 13-14l/100, And best of all it's only about 1550kg.
Fords new V6, There are already question marks on that when it comes to economy. Now it's in the Mazda CX range and it's as thirsty as a territory.

 

[Full Spectrum]

I am not sure why holden persist with making engines that have no low down torque, but a better for move for them now which would have no development costs is to dump the low spec v6 and just make the 195 standard across all models.

That is right on the money. One day holden will have balls to do this.
Base engine loud wining bitch with a sloppy but decent - but not for 2008 auto.

195 and 5 speed auto are very nice together. I had a drag with my old VP onto a freeway after picking it up, And i was gaining on the old boy fast, That was until some tool decided to flick the manual shift and redline it for me. Did anyone know they max out @ 87 in first:whistling.

 

[Reaper]

This is why I am so dissapointed with ford for dropping the I6. It had power where you needed it most, low in the rev range. I am just about to clock 600Km from one tank of fuel in my ef and that ain't bad.

Unfortunately that motor does not comply with the new euro(?) spec that comes in 2010. They decided that it would be cost prohibitive to re-engineer that motor to comply and thus a different power plant has been selected.

I am not sure why holden persist with making engines that have no low down torque,

Well not *all* their engines have no low down torque .

but a better for move for them now which would have no development costs is to dump the low spec v6 and just make the 195 standard across all models.

Bugger all development cost but still a substantial unit cost when compared to the lower power unit. At a time when GM is loosing $millions every day, adding extra cost into building a car isn't high on their priority list. Being an automaker isn't a happy occupation right now.

Reaper

 

[CSP]

The point is CSP, the Alloytec for all its worth actually uses 0.6L per 100km MORE FUEL than the ecotec did in the VX/VY commodore. Thats manual vs. manual by the way. Auto has improved but only by 0.4L.

At the same time, torque has only gone from 305 to 325NM and power from 154kw to 175kw. But its in a less useable range than it was in the ecotec.

What are your fuel figures based on?

I have a real world experience so that's what I base the SIGNIFICANT improvements Holden have made over the years on.

I went from a 2000 VX Commodore S A4 to a 2006 VE Calais A5 in November 2006. I noticed better economy around town and huge improvement in economy on the highway. I also went from 154kw to 195kw amd from 305nM to 340nM.

The power was very usable and I enjoyed the mid to high revs - the Alloytec seemed fine to me. That said, I do prefer the Ford I6 to the Holden Alloytec V6. But I preferred the whole package Holden has to offer compared with that of Ford. What Holden should do, is mate the 195 Alloytec with the much nicer A6 box Ford are using and give it direct injection...

 

[Cursed CX8]

iv just got an sv6, my daily trip to work has delivered a 8.7/100 my old vs with 145,000kms on it did a 10.5 on the same trip... i know which id rather drive

 

[CSP]

VS had the Ecotec too...

 

[Cursed CX8]

yer thats what i mean, it had the ecotec, it was under powered at still used more fuel

 

[andyman]

Yeah but the alloytec is still pretty thirsty for this day and age.

It uses more fuel than the 4.0L straight 6 in the falcon, and makes less power and a heap less torque. Plus the FG apparently weights 30kg more than the VE (though it doesn't look it from the exterior).

evidence of this please? when the new fuel consumption sticker system comes out soo this will reveal true figures of what to expect, ie there moving to stickers that show a city figure and a freeway, this combined stuff is b/s

i distinctively remember a reviewer commenting the fg uses more fuel that a ve around town,

after youve driven an alloytec for a while, like 3-4 months, not just one trip to evaluate it, you will never go back to an ecotec, and ive never heard anyone say different to that aswell.

my vs wagon used 15L/100km my vz wagon uses 11L/100km for the same driving, and has more power. ive also had it at a consistant 7.9L/100km on the freeway, do you need it anybetter that that?


also adding to that, ive always believed the vz was a mule car for holden, they used this model to develop the alloytec in real life, they have a very conservative tune and are quite capable of making good power, holden are just using the tune as leverage to make the production life of the engine longer,

 

[Full Spectrum]

I know what 1991_Vn2nV means i think..
He is saying the Ecotec came on line and gave out good fuel figures over the Buick V6's, What were the claims 6-7% better?. And the jump from ecotec to alloytech hasn't set the world on fire. The VT gets me 510km to a tank easy, The VP 400-420km. Getting out on the highway and the VT kills the VP which is no slouch on highways at all.

Also i would like to claim here that the I6 from personal experiences isn't flash on fuel at all. BA 04 Fairmont drinking 17l/100 around town, Under 80,000km. But getting into the 7's on highways.
Also i think the VY was claimed to be better on fuel then a BA anyway?.


Bu anyway, Once you drive a SV6 or Calais you can feel the change overall, Then if you drive it well you actually get better fuel then claimed.

 

[1991_Vn2nV]

What are your fuel figures based on?

I have a real world experience so that's what I base the SIGNIFICANT improvements Holden have made over the years on.

I went from a 2000 VX Commodore S A4 to a 2006 VE Calais A5 in November 2006. I noticed better economy around town and huge improvement in economy on the highway. I also went from 154kw to 195kw amd from 305nM to 340nM.

The power was very usable and I enjoyed the mid to high revs - the Alloytec seemed fine to me. That said, I do prefer the Ford I6 to the Holden Alloytec V6. But I preferred the whole package Holden has to offer compared with that of Ford. What Holden should do, is mate the 195 Alloytec with the much nicer A6 box Ford are using and give it direct injection...

My figures are based on CITY mileage for VX compared to COMBINED ADR mileage for the VE.

The sticker mileage anyway which is what is gonna put someone in a car.

VX (Tested to AS2877)
V6 Automatic Sedan City / Highway: 11.0 / 6.6 (L/100km)
V6 Manual Sedan City / Highway: 10.0 / 6.6 (L/100km)

VE (ADR081/01)
V6 Automatic Omega, Berlina: 10.9 (L/100km) 10.6 (L/100km)
V6 195kW Manual SV6: 11.0 (L/100km)
V6 195kW Automatic SV6, Calais: 11.3 (L/100km)
V6 195kW Automatic Calais-V: 11.6 (L/100km)

The above VE readings are before this fuel economy change with blue being the new figure.

We have a VE, VX and VT in the family that I drive also (well until March this year when I had to stop driving lol). I've driven VE Omega, Berlina, SV6 and WM Caprice (that was just a new rental). Whilst the alloytec is a big step up in the VE over the VZ, im still not impressed.