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Red Vs Black motors

vc commodore

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I'll start off with, a sorry if this is the wrong section.

I am wondering whether red motor extractors bolt onto a black motor.

I would also like to know,whether a red motor flywheel will bolt onto a black motor crank....

Thanks in advance
 

Dylan kingswood

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No to extractors unsure on flywheel I’ll have a stab on yes though
 

gtrboyy

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Red is 9 port blue/blck is 12 port if look at head.

No sure about flywheels... you'd have to research it but wouldn't be surprised that they do only remember black engines having weird junk 5 speeds
 

EYY

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Flywheel/clutch diameters and weights are different. I had a red motor flywheel on my black 202. Bellhousing is different too, so for Aussie 4 speed you need the right bellhousing for the clutch. E.g. can’t use red motor bellhousing with blue motor clutch as it hits, and can’t be ground out enough to make it work whilst retaining structural integrity.

Red motor flywheel will bolt on but will give heavier rotating assy due to later engines having larger crank counterweights etc. I did it this way and still revved to 6500rpm and didn’t really notice the additional weight. Later flywheels are lighter from memory - not sure how much but it’s considerable.

If you’re planning on bolting your Toyota 5 speed up it’ll work without issue.

Extractors are different. Can change heads to suit, just need to drill holes into deck for coolant flow to head if fitting blue/black head onto earlier engine. Wouldn’t bother with red heads stock vs stock, they’re far less efficient. Some people have made red extractors fit blue/black heads but it’ll never be quite right.
 

vc commodore

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Red is 9 port blue/blck is 12 port if look at head.

No sure about flywheels... you'd have to research it but wouldn't be surprised that they do only remember black engines having weird junk 5 speeds

Yeah, the Holden 5 speeds were crap.....I had one about 10 years ago, behind a very very mild red.....It was in the car 2 weeks and spat the bottom front bearing out...So I swapped it out for a Supra 5 speed
 
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vc commodore

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Flywheel/clutch diameters and weights are different. I had a red motor flywheel on my black 202. Bellhousing is different too, so for Aussie 4 speed you need the right bellhousing for the clutch. E.g. can’t use red motor bellhousing with blue motor clutch as it hits, and can’t be ground out enough to make it work whilst retaining structural integrity.

Red motor flywheel will bolt on but will give heavier rotating assy due to later engines having larger crank counterweights etc. I did it this way and still revved to 6500rpm and didn’t really notice the additional weight. Later flywheels are lighter from memory - not sure how much but it’s considerable.

If you’re planning on bolting your Toyota 5 speed up it’ll work without issue.

Extractors are different. Can change heads to suit, just need to drill holes into deck for coolant flow to head if fitting blue/black head onto earlier engine. Wouldn’t bother with red heads stock vs stock, they’re far less efficient. Some people have made red extractors fit blue/black heads but it’ll never be quite right.

Thanks EYY.....Spoke to a fella that is selling a couple of blacks, with a shed load of holden 6 gear real cheap...One of the blacks has a fully recoed top end and a real nice street cam.....Just needs bearings, as it has a little bottom end noise when it when it warms up.

So the plan will be, check the crank, throw some bearings at it and put my Supra 5 speed behind it. And as luck will have it, the bellhousing on my 5 speed is suited to a black, as it has the hole at the top for the sensor....Not that I need it.
 

lmoengnr

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Yeah, the Holden 5 speeds were crap.....I had one about 10 years ago, behind a very very mild red.....It was in the car 2 weeks and spat the bottom front bearing out...So I swapped it out for a Supra 5 speed
Sounds just like an Opel 4 speed fitted in LC Torana's...
 

Calaber

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Sounds just like an Opel 4 speed fitted in LC Torana's...
IIRC, the five speed was coded MP6 and was known as the Philippines box. I scrounged one from a wreck years ago and was thinking of replacing the Trimatic in my HR with it. Decided against because it's rarity meant that the various parts needed made it too much trouble.
 

Dylan kingswood

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I miss my starfire and Opel 4 speed never gave me any problems apart from having to rebuild the carby
 

vc commodore

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IIRC, the five speed was coded MP6 and was known as the Philippines box. I scrounged one from a wreck years ago and was thinking of replacing the Trimatic in my HR with it. Decided against because it's rarity meant that the various parts needed made it too much trouble.
I think they were made by borg warner, but don't quote me, as my memory is like yours....Very vague....However I could check up, as I have a manual covering VH and VK commodores (which is what they were fitted to).

The thing I really disliked about them was 2nd gear ratio was very close to the 1st gear ratio....
 
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