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Steering wheel vibrates when braking

vc commodore

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The issue will be warped rotors....It won't be covered by any warranty....you'll have to dig into your pocket to either machine them or replace them
 

vc commodore

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Brake rotors can warp for any number of reasons with over heating and incorrect cool down being just one cause. That’s why we see cool down laps in all.evels of motor racing. I’ve also seen some porche owners rolling their cars back and forth after race is done and they are back in the pits so brake pads done stay over the same part of a hot rotor for too long (they swear it sucks the heat out and warps or cracks them).

So if you are repeatedly hammering your brakes while on a spirited drive, don’t simply pull over without driving calmly for a while to let the rotors actually cool down. Otherwise you are abusing your vehicle and abuse is not covered under warranty.

But for a dealer to categorically state brakes are not covered under warranty is wrong and bullsh!it should be called for such statements.

If you haven’t been doing such boy racer things on the road, then overheating and warping a rotor on a new low mileage car could be due to brake pad drag causing excessive heat build up. Why the pad is draging on a rotor should be investigated as it could be an assemble or manufacturing fault that causes it. If it is a draging brake pad that is the cause of the wobbles when braking, especially on a car wearing original pads and rotors, then it’s definitely something that should be covered under manufacturers warranty or ACL statutory warranty.

Rotors are a consumable item therefore not covered by any warranty....If you went to the ACL, they would laugh you out their office, or hang up on you.

Next you'll be saying brake pads, oil oil filters, air filters, and cabin filters should be paid for by the manufacturer because they aren't consumables
 
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VS 5.0

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Next you'll be saying brake pads, oil oil filters, air filters, and cabin filters should be paid for by the manufacturer because they aren't consumables

If they fail before they should then you would be correct.
 

Skylarking

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@vc commodore , its not an issue of rotors being a consumable item according to Holden, it’s an issue of whether a product is faulty according to ACL. Pure and simple. Consumable items can still be faulty after all.

If, for example, a caliper piston is stuck in its bore due to manufacturing fault, and as a result the brake pad is forced against the rotor causing it to overheat and warp, then how could anyone rightly state it’s not a warranty issue because the brake pads and rotor are consumable items.

The fact a dealer’s first utterance is always that such items are not covered must be taken with a grain of salt. Some checks must be performed to verify that the caliper, piston, pad and rotor are operating correctly. Obviously if the pad is worn diagonally, something is wrong and the lining is not being consumed appropriately (evenly). As such this is one case where a consumable item ishoild be handled under warranty. Another example that comes to mind is the clutch (assembly?) in some performance fords were replaced under warranty. According to your mindset, this is a consumable part so the owner should wear the cost - fact is opposite to your view.

Excluding vehicle abuse, which is never covered by warranty or ACL, my experiance is that rotors simply shouldn’t warp within 15,000kms. As such, I’d suspect something odd is occurring. I’d be asking for calipers, pistons, pads and rotor to be checked. If nothing mechanical is found, I’d ask for the rotors runout checked and also for areas of the rotor hardness tested to check metallurgy.

You of course are free to simply accept whatever a dealer states as gospel and pay for repairs that could have been argued as a warranty issue.
 

Flying Scotsman

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Thanks for all the replies. No Panhead, no-one's mum has driven my car. Only me, and very ocassionally, the wife. Can't help thinking that there might be an ACL issue as its done low ks. Actually it's a 2016 commodore, still under the first 3 years of the 5 year warranty. At 5000km pa, I think it's reasonable to expect that original pads, rotors, tyres should still be good?? I'm tossing up whether to go straight to the dealer with the issue, or getting a brake place to look at it first?? Anyone know a good brake place Perth SoR that'd look at the brakes and give a quote for what's needed? Might give some ammo when I go to the dealer if a reputable brake place has given me some kind of assessment.....
 

Forg

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Excluding vehicle abuse, which is never covered by warranty or ACL, my experiance is that rotors simply shouldn’t warp within 15,000kms.
And it's the "abuse" thing which is in the dealer's/manufacturer's favour, here, because most rotors don't warp within 15,000km.
So if a set does, and given no ability to prove they were or weren't abused, the most likely explanation is - abuse.

Flying Scotsman, we've got exactly the same problem, with much the same usage. Try the dealer if you've got one near you that won't otherwise damage the car; can't hurt to ask. You might also find that whatever your discs get replaced with will do the same thing, under the same usage pattern. We're basically living with it because skimming the discs usually means it'll come back in a few months, and as I said, there's a good change replacing them will result in the same thing if the car's used the same way … although I'm planning on using a quality aftermarket brand, in the hope they might fare better.
 
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Skylarking

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@Forg, a dealer claiming abuse is a double edged sword since the performance vehicle’s we are sold should be able to cope with a little ‘performance driving’ on a quiet twisty road. If the dealer claims that driving their performance vehicle on such roads (with mechanical sympathy and brake cool down post the ‘fun’) is abuse, then the other argument the owner is left with is the issue of misrepresentation of the product sold (being a performance car after all). And as you strike me as someone who will drive hard but won’t abuse his vehicles, the fact that you seem to have lost a little faith in the standard rotor/pad combo seems telling of the quality of the standard parts. So maybe their is a problem here beyond ‘consumable’ though it can be hard to prove (unless loose caliper bolt, oddly worn pad, and such abnormal things).

But the intent of my post was not to get into all this ACL stuff yet again but rather to highlight that there may be more behind the cause and as such people should not simply take whatever self serving convenient thing the dealer says as being gospel. People should understand normal wear and tear as opposed to a failure and if they feel they have not abused something, they should argue the point. So I just provide food for thought.

As is, only the driver knows how he treats his car and whether he has shown any mechanical sympathy towards it and just because a manufacturer makes a statement (even if written) doesn’t mean their statement is correct. Dealers and manufacturers have been known to tell porkie pies. As a known example, a biggie actually, Ford said people were driving their double clutch focus’s wrong which was proven to be false and cost them $10M in fines and some more in corrective action (buybacks, etc).

But each to their own.
 

vc commodore

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And it's the "abuse" thing which is in the dealer's/manufacturer's favour, here, because most rotors don't warp within 15,000km.
So if a set does, and given no ability to prove they were or weren't abused, the most likely explanation is - abuse.

Flying Scotsman, we've got exactly the same problem, with much the same usage. Try the dealer if you've got one near you that won't otherwise damage the car; can't hurt to ask. You might also find that whatever your discs get replaced with will do the same thing, under the same usage pattern. We're basically living with it because skimming the discs usually means it'll come back in a few months, and as I said, there's a good change replacing them will result in the same thing if the car's used the same way … although I'm planning on using a quality aftermarket brand, in the hope they might fare better.


Going back to the late 90's, there were cars that had issues with rotors warping without reaching 10,000K, because the rotors used were cheap crud....The same applies these days....Car manufacturers use cheap rotors, which are prone to warping
 

vc commodore

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@vc commodore , its not an issue of rotors being a consumable item according to Holden, it’s an issue of whether a product is faulty according to ACL. Pure and simple. Consumable items can still be faulty after all.

If, for example, a caliper piston is stuck in its bore due to manufacturing fault, and as a result the brake pad is forced against the rotor causing it to overheat and warp, then how could anyone rightly state it’s not a warranty issue because the brake pads and rotor are consumable items.

The fact a dealer’s first utterance is always that such items are not covered must be taken with a grain of salt. Some checks must be performed to verify that the caliper, piston, pad and rotor are operating correctly. Obviously if the pad is worn diagonally, something is wrong and the lining is not being consumed appropriately (evenly). As such this is one case where a consumable item ishoild be handled under warranty. Another example that comes to mind is the clutch (assembly?) in some performance fords were replaced under warranty. According to your mindset, this is a consumable part so the owner should wear the cost - fact is opposite to your view.

Excluding vehicle abuse, which is never covered by warranty or ACL, my experiance is that rotors simply shouldn’t warp within 15,000kms. As such, I’d suspect something odd is occurring. I’d be asking for calipers, pistons, pads and rotor to be checked. If nothing mechanical is found, I’d ask for the rotors runout checked and also for areas of the rotor hardness tested to check metallurgy.

You of course are free to simply accept whatever a dealer states as gospel and pay for repairs that could have been argued as a warranty issue.


Caliper issue....

We can blame all home owners and or occupiers for failing to fit suction to prevent crud staying around on the surface and being thrown up around the calipers.

We can blame the councils for failing to have a street sweeper not follow every car, to stop any crud being thrown up at the calipers

We can blame brake pad manufacturers for failing to produce pads that don't create dust.

We can blame car manufacturers for failing to equip all cars with some suction devise to prevent any crud getting on the calipers.

Simple issue is, rotors are consumable items and car manufacturers will use cheap rotors 90% of the time to help keep the cost of cars down....Of course there is exceptions.

You also have to look that the car has done 15,000K in 4 years.....Sitting calipers do have a habit of seizing up, due to lack of use.....And considering the lack of kays in a number of years, I can't see the ACL, ACCC or any car manufacturer coping blame for a seizing caliper causing a warped rotor...

So may I suggest look at what was originally posted and take into consideration the facts before dragging the letters ACL into the conversation
 

Red Centre Bluey

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I am intrigued by this 'Pad Material left on the rotor' theory.

Like, REALLY?

The pad polishes the living snot outta the rotor surface, if any pad material is 'Left' on the rotor, it's gonna be buffed off the pad in the very next revolution, if centrifugal forces don't get to it first

Who promoted such nonsense?
 
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