Still on my quest for supercharger info

[syndosis]

Hey guys. Been scouring the forum and SC for info on supercharging my VR
Cleanest option seems to be buy an L67 and drop it in and get an auto elec to change any wiring needed.
However I am wanting to do it overtime having some visual progress happning or I will spend the money on something else. My questions are these, and sorry if they are covered else where, i havn't found the info and if you provide link I will immediately read it.

Question 1 : If I get an Eaton M90 I would have to get a manifold to suit my pre Ecotech 3.8l v6. These from what I gather need to be engineered. Would a VS ecotech have correct manifold ? if so i could source a cheap SH engine and go from there as cheaper and easier to find than an L67 ( contact me if you have a source for L67 engine though on [email protected] ).

Question 2 : Does anyone have any contacts specifically Vic or SA for sourcing a manifold and heads for my VR that will allow fitting of an Eaton M90 ?

sorry for length guys but am determined to find as much as I can out before choosing a line to go down

cheers in advance for your help and patience

 

[sv9946]

dude i would not advise this
1. you need supercharged v6 injectors (36 lb hour)and supercharged v6 fuel rails and these mount in the heads and not in the manifold so you need supercharged v6 heads whichi think won't bolt up onto a vr block, somebody correct me if i'm wrong
2. as the injectors mount in the heads this means different rocker covers (supercharged v6) are necessary to fit injectors
3. you need to fit 2 knock sensors to your vr block to prevent detonation and hence should always run premium unleaded
4. L67 engines have a lower compression ration than standard ecotec motors(not sure about compression ratio in vr engine) so most likely a set of different pistons would be necesary to again prevent detonation
5. remouting of ignition coils is necessary to fit an eaton m90 to a ecotec engine and a vr engine plus you need to get all necessary pulleys etc etc to run blower belt
6. also the normal belt length for a vr is different than a vs and a vs different than a L67 so some pulleys is needed for your engine to run power steering a/c (if fitted) etc etc
7. this means that a different harmonic balancer is needed to run blower belt from an L67 and i don't know if an L67 balancer will fit a vr motor
8. a L67 runs a completly different cooling system setup which has a metal tube running along the rocker cover bolted to the extractors so the thermostat can be mounted under the supercharger and the system runs three bleed points intead of one on the cooling system so even the heater hose outlets need to be changed
9. L67 engines run a 2 speed fuel pump and a different wiring setup too run this so this is also necessary
10. a computer system and wiring system to run the top half of the L67 to the bottom half of vr motor would be very hard to do and thats only if you could get the heads to fit the vr block(so far my biggest question do they fit)
11. the camshaft is also different and though not so necessary(WON'T MAKE TOO MUCH OF A DIFFERENCE) to change IT IS still diferent

this is only going into the simple things the a diffeerent from a vr motor to a L67 and iknow there is a **** load more so i wouldn't reccomend doing this it would cause a major headache, best way would be to buy a L67 from a wrecked car even this though wouldn't be cheap most wrecker wanting $3500 change over for a motor or $5000 straight out plus you still need all the fuel sytem (2 speed fuel pump) different exhaust the 4 wire heated oxygen sensors and a few more thing in your car which won't come with the engine the cheapest way out would be to sell your car and buy a supercharged v6 car from the start, this would save money and a lot of headaches

although it would probably cost more than $5000 to change over you would be going into a vs and you won't have the reliability issues of trying to make your vr something its not

p.s. sorry for the long post i am just sick and tired of people telling me supercharged cars like mine aren't worht f%ck all more than a n/a car cause the can just buy a m90 and slap it on, i bought a vs s/c v6 SII calais in mint condition owned buy old people done 130,000 kms 97 model full service history never being pranged etc etc firts owned by holden and i had people telling me my car is worth around $500-$1000 more than there 95 vs executive's SI done 220,000-300,000 had a million different owners and being abasoulutely raped when i paid a smidge over $10,000 three weeks ago

 

[Sleak_VS]

The other option is going a Centrifical blower. Might not come on as quick as an m90, but has a fair bit more power. And a lot less messing around with heads and wiring looms etc. etc. Just food for thought.

 

[sv9946]

heres an easier and better solution to explaining this to you bear in mind yours is a vr motor and requires even more changed than this
go to this site read question 18
http://www.v6supercharged.com.au/faq.asp#19

 

[TheForgotten]

Question 1 : If I get an Eaton M90 I would have to get a manifold to suit my pre Ecotech 3.8l v6. These from what I gather need to be engineered. Would a VS ecotech have correct manifold ?

No

if so i could source a cheap SH engine and go from there as cheaper and easier to find than an L67

you don't look too hard. there was two on ebay yesterday. I bought one of them and the other was going for 3000 last I saw.

Question 2 : Does anyone have any contacts specifically Vic or SA for sourcing a manifold and heads for my VR that will allow fitting of an Eaton M90 ?

no, but there's one for sale on SC, but due to the effort involved, just see $$$

no parts are interchangable between L34/l67 and buick, except injectors and (so I've been told) the harmonic balancer

9. L67 engines run a 2 speed fuel pump and a different wiring setup too run this so this is also necessary

wrong. just conect a relay into the pump to run it on high constant

10k's about right for your car. don't ever listen to anyone who think they know cars, only listen to people whocan prove it

 

[syndosis]

cheers guys
Thanks scv6calais for the run down on the info.
So to get this straight, I can't just get an Ecotech and run a M90 without putting S/C heads and manifold on it? I can't without a lot of trouble put an M90 on my pre ecotech VR ?

trading in my VR 94 is very unlikely as would get stuff all for it as has done 320000 ks but running ok. Happy to do up an engine in the shed ready for a swap over so was gonna supercharge a worked engine in my spare time and swap over later.

Sounds like a CRS kit or something similar is gonna be the best option

Thanks again guys and TheForgotten, I wasn't lazy. I forgot FIT had that faq. I wasn't saying I was looking for a Ecotech and also it won't work to trade in my car as especially trade in I would get stuff all for it.

Cheers

 

[sixshooter]

Alot of info is available here...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buick_V6_engine#Supercharged

 

[TheForgotten]

Thanks again guys and TheForgotten, I wasn't lazy. I forgot FIT had that faq. I wasn't saying I was looking for a Ecotech and also it won't work to trade in my car as especially trade in I would get stuff all for it.

Cheers

well... if yo uput an L67 in there, you won't get much either. I was just pointing out that there's another on there. there is a M90/buick manifold on SC, I think the guy's asking 1500 for it, but I personally wouldn't do it without some engine work. good luck with it either way

 

[sv9946]

just to correct you, the forgotten this abstract of info comes from my auto tech technical refrence manual (delco powertrain management) holden book
fuel pump control module (supercharged models only)
the fuel pump control module is located in the boot compartment, it is controlled by the pcm. it is on top of the right hand wheel arch behind the bracing panel. the supercharged models use a 2 speed roller vane type fule pump it can only be serviced as a whole unit with the sender unit assembly. when the engine requires more fuel delivery, the control module will enable the second speed of the fuel pump. the pcm will send a pulse width modulated signal of 82hz to the control module. this signal will be sent as a varing duty cycle depending on pcm demand. at "normal" driving conditions, the pcm will send a 67% duty cycle signal (67% on @ 82 hz) this results in less fuel being delivered to the engine. SUBSEQUENTLY LESS FUEL IS RETURNED TO THE TANK WITH LESS FUEL TANK VAPOUR. as fuel demand increases, the pcm will raise the duty cycle to 100%. this will have the effect of increasing the voltage and current through the fuel pump and will increase fuel supply to the engine

so a supercharged engine does require a 2 speed pump but the inportant bit is in capital letters. less duty cycle is used to have less fuel vapour in other words if the control module wasn't necessary and a relay could just be used to run a 100% duty cycle at all times without any problems why did holden use the control module

 

[jippa3000]

If you want to wait a bit, Yello terra are going to be releasing a new blower that will crap on the CRS ones and only be about $3000. The V6 side of thing is going to be a really big thing for them in a few of years so they we be releasing all kinds of things. Just keep an eye out for it.