[Ecotec] Tests on Pod/Panel - Dyno differences in CAI/Intakes

[IBLOWN]

Hamatime is right. At the end of the day a dyno is just a comparitor. He is comparing all these different setups.

 

[Immortality]

However, what I am trying to get at, is in spite of all the above evidence, all the theory etc...why did it come out with a smaller (albeit 1kw) yield on the DYNO. If the fan in front of the car pushing air into the radiator and through the OTR, if the POD setup is better in terms of airflow and greater pickup of cooler air Why wouldn't it show on the tests?

because the dyno has a large artificial air flow directly into the radiator/ L67 CAI. depending on exactly where the fan was situated it would definitely favour the factory intake (especially if you have removed the plastic strip as we (delco and I) suggested. if the fan was right in front of the car/radiator it would put a huge amount of air into the front of the radiator creating a high air pressure zone benefiting the L67 CAI where as the enclosed pod would suffer in this situation because there is no real airflow over the bonnet headlight area where the enclosed pod would take it's air source from. in this situation with fan right in front of the car i would actually suggest that the enclosed POD filter would actually be getting hot air from under the bonnet because the area under the bonnet would have a higher air pressure then the area just in front of the headlight area. to simulate real world highway conditions you would need to conduct the tests with the fan at least a couple of meters in front of the car so that you would get equal airflow over the entire bumper/bonnet area

also, not sure exactly what order you did the tests in but i would expect to see slightly lower readings on the later tests as heat soak becomes a issue in the engine itself. especially if each subsequent power pull is done in quick succession.

the test with the gas mixer ring certainly are a eye opener though

 

[HamaTime™]

Video of the very first run, running 98 Premium with the Mixer cone on OTR, stock airbox - this is the 94rwkw run.

Fan is about 1 and a bit meters back from the front bar.

Each run was about 5 minutes after the other, gave the motor/exhaust etc a chance to cool down.

You make a valid point with the air benefiting the OTR as the fan pushes air directly onto it, however, I would have thought that with such a large volume of fast moving air flow going into the engine bay, that the cool air would find it's way to the POD fairly easily.

At the end of the day, it's interesting results. I have always been more keen on panel filters with air pushing directly through it.

If I really wanted some more power, I could fabricate a new manifold with longer runners/smoothed entrances with a twin throttle intake right under a massive filter hanging out the bonnet

 

[Immortality]

If your intending to stay with the L67 set up i would recommend doing what is shown in the pic below. remove the plastic strip that cover the gap in front of the radiator (as shown in the pic) and use some sort of foam strips to seal the bonnet against the intake mouth. that way, when you do come to a stop the intake will continue to suck cold air instead of hot air from under the bonnet.

i also used a jig saw to cut about 1" of the front of the intake to make the hole bigger

 

[WogBoyz]

^^ dont some people also cut the top of the intake further back and open it up more aswell?

 

[GTP 85]

Good testing there bud.

As i have always felt, LPG is purely for budget motoring when you use the mixer ring/ cone setups. They will never make power as they create a huge restriction in the intake path. A restriction very much like what i heard about the V8 brutes a few years ago (VU? series) they made much better power than the ford 302(?) so they put a restrictor 'ring' in the intake to cap the LS1s a few kw?? Anyway, in your situation, if you want to make similar power on LPG (as is on petty) you have to look at a direct injection setup. Something that i would be interested in trialing on my race car.

As for the CAI systems. The problem with enclosed pods is that they soak heat in the box. The OTR's do this also hence it comes down to which one can continuously flow the most efficiently while driving to negate the heat soaking effects.

I have tried both SC6 and enclosed pod setups. Nothing wrong with the SC6 cai as it looked stock and tidy. But as most v6 owners were doing this same mod, i chose to try a different setup for individuality and (imo) a neater look again. I tried the enclosed pod with a metal box, small 90mm air feed in the guard. Neat look but soaked heat badly. I developed it further.... Heat resistant matting on the inside of the box, and also a larger cutout in the guard (the size of a panel filter) and a scoop facing the front behind the bumper. i know not many ppl are keen on cutting holes, but this one is not visible at all and its not a load bearing panel. This setup provides consistant power on the dyno. Probably due to it pulling air purely from outside the engine bay, without and restriction

Though it was a lot of mucking about, i now have a cai system that im happy with and has made a gain... if only 4-5 kw (with back to back testing). I can easily pull the headlight out at the drags to have a direct cold air charge to the pod.

Dont know if this will help much.. but its a slice of my knowledge

 

[HamaTime™]

Good suggestion Bart, thanks very much for the tip! Appreciated, I will most likely endeavor to fix up my L67 setup soon...nothing better than a DIY job. Best way to spend a Saturday afternoon.

Yeah people cut the L67 OTR's back to open them up and also use a heat gun to open it up a bit as well. Daniel (HoldenManDan) has done this on his L67 VS.

Good testing there bud.

As i have always felt, LPG is purely for budget motoring when you use the mixer ring/ cone setups. They will never make power as they create a huge restriction in the intake path. A restriction very much like what i heard about the V8 brutes a few years ago (VU? series) they made much better power than the ford 302(?) so they put a restrictor 'ring' in the intake to cap the LS1s a few kw?? Anyway, in your situation, if you want to make similar power on LPG (as is on petty) you have to look at a direct injection setup. Something that i would be interested in trialing on my race car.

As for the CAI systems. The problem with enclosed pods is that they soak heat in the box. The OTR's do this also hence it comes down to which one can continuously flow the most efficiently while driving to negate the heat soaking effects.

I have tried both SC6 and enclosed pod setups. Nothing wrong with the SC6 cai as it looked stock and tidy. But as most v6 owners were doing this same mod, i chose to try a different setup for individuality and (imo) a neater look again. I tried the enclosed pod with a metal box, small 90mm air feed in the guard. Neat look but soaked heat badly. I developed it further.... Heat resistant matting on the inside of the box, and also a larger cutout in the guard (the size of a panel filter) and a scoop facing the front behind the bumper. i know not many ppl are keen on cutting holes, but this one is not visible at all and its not a load bearing panel.

Though it was a lot of mucking about, i now have a cai system that im happy with and has made a gain... if only 4-5 kw (with back to back testing). I can easily pull the headlight out at the drags to have a direct cold air charge to the pod.

Dont know if this will help much.. but its a slice of my knowledge

Thanks Gilbert, after our discussions I was very tempted to try out a number of different setups and really ascertain the drawbacks/effects that LPG and in particular the mixer ring has on the power output. It's rather like having a breathing mask on with a very limited amount of air coming through, the engine really suffocates and the dyno figures and the driveability of the car really feels that. LPG is an interesting topic though...as I said above, the mixer/dual fuel setup is rubbish and is a no go zone for performance hunters. Run 1 fuel, and build your motor to run on that fuel....however, the benefits to my back pocket and my other financial needs are greatly appreciated, free's up alot of cash for me to be able to put into a house and a new car.

Very good point there (see above in bold). I was very impressed with your creativity with the setup of your pod, and the way you cut the guard. I believe we had a detailed conversation about this a few months back also.

One thing I have learnt is that the dollar investment to the power return. I could go out and spend big money on a CAI kit where the results given above and the feel under my foot prove little. To be honest, I have reached a stage where I have played and tinkered, tested and spent money, and it's gained little. Best money I spent on my car so far has been the exhaust (which was little cost), and the MACE insulator/spacer. End of the day, it's a slow engine and bolt on's and a different filter arrangement aren't going to build me a rocket ship.

Bigger and better plans to go on to. Aka LS1's.

 

[White Tiger]

be interesting to see the results of just the stock air box with out the otr,
or the enclosed pod with an otr,
on the same car along with the other tests just to see the true difference between stock and all the rest

 

[WogBoyz]

Good suggestion Bart, thanks very much for the tip! Appreciated.

Yeah people cut them back to open them up and also use a heat gun to open it up a bit as well.

ahh kk thought so, should do another test with the otr opened up more and with immortality's idea aswell

 

[Trayner]

If your intending to stay with the L67 set up i would recommend doing what is shown in the pic below. remove the plastic strip that cover the gap in front of the radiator (as shown in the pic) and use some sort of foam strips to seal the bonnet against the intake mouth. that way, when you do come to a stop the intake will continue to suck cold air instead of hot air from under the bonnet.

i also used a jig saw to cut about 1" of the front of the intake to make the hole bigger

Anymore pics of this mate ?